M12 could be an option - Some advise please
Discussion
Hello all I'm looking to spend 20-25K on a second hand car and the Nobel may well be a possibility. If you good UK owners could answer a few questions…
1. I’m not a rich man so wanted to find out what I can expect to pay for yearly maintenance?
2. Following on from that how reliable are these cars. I would have thought twin turbos on a V6 Ford Duratec engine would be over stressing it? Or is this engine still running with in design limits?
3. Lastly one the better half is making me ask. What’s the luggage space like? ie could we still manage a suit case or two some where!
I love the looks of the car and from what I have herd over the years it ticks all the performance boxes for weekend fun.
PS I’m looking at the older 2.5l GTO
Thanks Andy
1. I’m not a rich man so wanted to find out what I can expect to pay for yearly maintenance?
2. Following on from that how reliable are these cars. I would have thought twin turbos on a V6 Ford Duratec engine would be over stressing it? Or is this engine still running with in design limits?
3. Lastly one the better half is making me ask. What’s the luggage space like? ie could we still manage a suit case or two some where!
I love the looks of the car and from what I have herd over the years it ticks all the performance boxes for weekend fun.
PS I’m looking at the older 2.5l GTO
Thanks Andy
I've only had mine 6 months so I can't answer 1 + 2 very well but I can answer 3 : There is no boot and no front boot either. The only space you have is the passenger footwell, the space behind the seats and a very small parcel shelf. But, it's possible to go away in it. Me and missus went away last month for 3 nights with no bother. A squashy sports bag is best. I have the seat as far forward as it will go, so that helps. If you are tallish then that will cut down on space a tad.
Adrian
Adrian
Heya,
Go for it!
1. If you budget for £1k/service you'll be in the right ball park. That's assuming there are no 'surprises' though.
2. I think they're generally thought to be pretty bullet proof from an engine standpoint, and there have been very few reports on this forum of issues. Some of the other chaps will likely give you a more detailed answer though.
3. If you buy the proper luggage set, you can genuinely fit loads in - as long as it's soft. It comes with two large suit style bags for behind the seats, and 4 smaller bags which fit under your legs and accross the rear parcel shelf. The small ones all clip into place. Two of us did 5 days at Le Mans last year with absolutely no problem whatsoever. Luggage sets come up secondhand every now and then.
Hope that helps.
D.
Go for it!
1. If you budget for £1k/service you'll be in the right ball park. That's assuming there are no 'surprises' though.
2. I think they're generally thought to be pretty bullet proof from an engine standpoint, and there have been very few reports on this forum of issues. Some of the other chaps will likely give you a more detailed answer though.
3. If you buy the proper luggage set, you can genuinely fit loads in - as long as it's soft. It comes with two large suit style bags for behind the seats, and 4 smaller bags which fit under your legs and accross the rear parcel shelf. The small ones all clip into place. Two of us did 5 days at Le Mans last year with absolutely no problem whatsoever. Luggage sets come up secondhand every now and then.
Hope that helps.
D.
Edited by Bugs M400 on Monday 2nd April 23:33
pipert said:
Hello all I'm looking to spend 20-25K on a second hand car and the Nobel may well be a possibility. If you good UK owners could answer a few questions…
1. I’m not a rich man so wanted to find out what I can expect to pay for yearly maintenance?
2. Following on from that how reliable are these cars. I would have thought twin turbos on a V6 Ford Duratec engine would be over stressing it? Or is this engine still running with in design limits?
3. Lastly one the better half is making me ask. What’s the luggage space like? ie could we still manage a suit case or two some where!
I love the looks of the car and from what I have herd over the years it ticks all the performance boxes for weekend fun.
PS I’m looking at the older 2.5l GTO
Thanks Andy
1. I’m not a rich man so wanted to find out what I can expect to pay for yearly maintenance?
2. Following on from that how reliable are these cars. I would have thought twin turbos on a V6 Ford Duratec engine would be over stressing it? Or is this engine still running with in design limits?
3. Lastly one the better half is making me ask. What’s the luggage space like? ie could we still manage a suit case or two some where!
I love the looks of the car and from what I have herd over the years it ticks all the performance boxes for weekend fun.
PS I’m looking at the older 2.5l GTO
Thanks Andy
1.Serviceing £400-£600 Every 6000 miles £800-£1000 for 24000 miles.
(flame suit on, someone will tell you different).
2.Reliability is a matter of opinion mostly good but they do have their little quirks.
Also thirsty little bu**ers.
3.Two 60 Litre bags two 25 litre bags and two 10 litre bags were available, tailored to fit in various nooks and crannies in the cabin.
If you're lucky you might find a set for sale on Flea-Bay once in a While (they were Six hundred quid new).
F.C.
Had my m12 for just over a year and I'm quite willing to pay!
Servicing £800(ish) for 6000 or 6 months
Drinks fuel but that's what you would expect for the performance you get
I've found it quite reliable and use it almost every day.
I've not had a problem with the space. you just have to be a little creative.
I would say go for it and if it's to be a second car don't even hesitate. Finding one may be a problem others on this forum will help you with what to look for etc. (I walked into a showroom one day and 'MUST HAVE!!!!!'
Servicing £800(ish) for 6000 or 6 months
Drinks fuel but that's what you would expect for the performance you get
I've found it quite reliable and use it almost every day.
I've not had a problem with the space. you just have to be a little creative.
I would say go for it and if it's to be a second car don't even hesitate. Finding one may be a problem others on this forum will help you with what to look for etc. (I walked into a showroom one day and 'MUST HAVE!!!!!'
This thread may be useful read this
I have had my 2.5 for 8 months/8,000miles and use it everyday (unless there's salt on the roads).
I am certainly no expert. However, based on my relatively short ownership and having had ‘normal’ (BMW/Merc) cars up until now for comparison, I offer my limited experience for what it’s worth:
Pros
• Incredible driving experience, sound, sensation of speed, feel, etc. - I cannot say enough about this.
• Fantastic enthusiasm from people for the car.
• Surprisingly comfortable.
• Fine in everyday traffic.
• It has been relatively reliable from an everyday starting point of view. However, things need fixing or replacing regularly - see Cons:
Cons [removes rose tinted glasses and dons flame suit]
• There is nowhere to leave anything in the car - no boot.
• You may find the odd annoying leak when it rains, but these can be found and fixed.
• There are things that need replacing or fixing more regularly than most cars; wiper arms, exhaust manifolds, wheel bearings, ball joints, alarm switches, loom plugs, etc.
• Approx £1,500 to £1,750 to service for 12,000 miles per year. With the other bits that may need doing it can easily add another £500 to £1,000 on top.
• Unless you get one with the preferred spec [see thread above] you could face a big bill, e.g. diff replacement. However, if you make sure the car has the right modifications done, you can reduce the risk of any major failures.
• A replacement clutch is a big bill as it’s an engine out job.
• Some parts can be relatively expensive, such as brakes, radiator, heater matrix, etc. However, on balance, compared to similar performance level cars, the parts are quite competitive.
Summary
• It is an amazing car and will put a smile on your face every time you drive it.
• It is a low volume high performance car, it would be unrealistic to expect to run it for the same cost as a Mondeo or have the reliability of an Evo.
• Having read postings on here for 18 months, there are many people that haven’t had any problems at all and a few that haven’t been so lucky and lost ££££’s because of it. Nonetheless, my guess is that you'll find all bar very few will tell you that it’s been worthwhile.
To use an analogy, I imagine it’s a bit like having a high maintenance supermodel as a girlfriend – at times it can be expensive and occasionally bl**dy irritating, but boy-oh-boy what a ride!
If anyone thinks this is bollox (as some might put it) please feel free to add your opinion – this is mine
I have had my 2.5 for 8 months/8,000miles and use it everyday (unless there's salt on the roads).
I am certainly no expert. However, based on my relatively short ownership and having had ‘normal’ (BMW/Merc) cars up until now for comparison, I offer my limited experience for what it’s worth:
Pros
• Incredible driving experience, sound, sensation of speed, feel, etc. - I cannot say enough about this.
• Fantastic enthusiasm from people for the car.
• Surprisingly comfortable.
• Fine in everyday traffic.
• It has been relatively reliable from an everyday starting point of view. However, things need fixing or replacing regularly - see Cons:
Cons [removes rose tinted glasses and dons flame suit]
• There is nowhere to leave anything in the car - no boot.
• You may find the odd annoying leak when it rains, but these can be found and fixed.
• There are things that need replacing or fixing more regularly than most cars; wiper arms, exhaust manifolds, wheel bearings, ball joints, alarm switches, loom plugs, etc.
• Approx £1,500 to £1,750 to service for 12,000 miles per year. With the other bits that may need doing it can easily add another £500 to £1,000 on top.
• Unless you get one with the preferred spec [see thread above] you could face a big bill, e.g. diff replacement. However, if you make sure the car has the right modifications done, you can reduce the risk of any major failures.
• A replacement clutch is a big bill as it’s an engine out job.
• Some parts can be relatively expensive, such as brakes, radiator, heater matrix, etc. However, on balance, compared to similar performance level cars, the parts are quite competitive.
Summary
• It is an amazing car and will put a smile on your face every time you drive it.
• It is a low volume high performance car, it would be unrealistic to expect to run it for the same cost as a Mondeo or have the reliability of an Evo.
• Having read postings on here for 18 months, there are many people that haven’t had any problems at all and a few that haven’t been so lucky and lost ££££’s because of it. Nonetheless, my guess is that you'll find all bar very few will tell you that it’s been worthwhile.
To use an analogy, I imagine it’s a bit like having a high maintenance supermodel as a girlfriend – at times it can be expensive and occasionally bl**dy irritating, but boy-oh-boy what a ride!
If anyone thinks this is bollox (as some might put it) please feel free to add your opinion – this is mine
pipert said:
Thanks for the responses people
Is there much difference in reliability between the GTO, GTO 3 & GTO 3R?
Is there much difference in reliability between the GTO, GTO 3 & GTO 3R?
Not if they've got the right modifications - which are IIRC:
2.5
• ECU Upgrade (not original Magneti Marelli unit - although some are still going strong)
• Radiator Cowling & Fan Upgrade
2.5 & 3.0
• Limited Slip Diff - Quaife ATB
• Track Sump (if tracked or driven hard)
2.5, 3.0 & 3R
• M400 Fuel Pump (if tracked or driven hard)
2.5, 3.0, 3R & M400
• Fuel Loom Wiring Upgrade
M400
• Motorsport Fuel Pump (if tracked or driven hard)
If I've missed anything, I'm sure someone will be along in a jiff...
Edited by Humpy on Sunday 8th April 21:45
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