Illegally Parked Camera Vans
Discussion
jezzwelda said:
Quite often I see Scamera Vans parked illegally busy saving the planet - most often parked outside Preston on a paved central reservation between two lanes of the A6.
Is this legal? I'm sure if anyone else parked there they'd be nicked.
Is this legal? I'm sure if anyone else parked there they'd be nicked.
Und am sure they really save pedestrians who will be struggling to see past them parked perhaps on a pedestrian crossing island
But this ist LanCASH£££££re... ist not really to do with road safety.
jezzwelda said:
Quite often I see Scamera Vans parked illegally busy saving the planet - most often parked outside Preston on a paved central reservation between two lanes of the A6.
Is this legal? I'm sure if anyone else parked there they'd be nicked.
Is this legal? I'm sure if anyone else parked there they'd be nicked.
To extend the question slightly...
If they are breaking the law whilst they are operating, are any of the offences they record "safe". i.e. Can they legally nick you if they are acting illegally themselves?
vonhossen said:
The Police can do a lot of things that you can't because their role requires it. They can carry CS gas, you can't. They can search people where you can't. They can go through red traffic lights where you can't. They can get on a bus for free, where you can't. They can speed where you can't & yes they can park where you can't if their role requires it.
It's a simple case of the Police having an exemption because it is needed to fulfill their role
It's a simple case of the Police having an exemption because it is needed to fulfill their role
And the rest of the discussion re this subject can be seen here
glassman said:
vonhossen said:
The Police can do a lot of things that you can't because their role requires it. They can carry CS gas, you can't. They can search people where you can't. They can go through red traffic lights where you can't. They can get on a bus for free, where you can't. They can speed where you can't & yes they can park where you can't if their role requires it.
It's a simple case of the Police having an exemption because it is needed to fulfill their role
It's a simple case of the Police having an exemption because it is needed to fulfill their role
And the rest of the discussion re this subject can be seen here
That's all well and good but scamera vans are usually NOT operated by police officers. So the question stands.
Strangely Brown said:
That's all well and good but scamera vans are usually NOT operated by police officers. So the question stands.
I'm on your side... By providing a link to a previous discussion I was merely trying to add some dialogue which did throw up phrases such as, "hypothecation & netting off" to justify why some of these scameras are positioned where they are.
Mmmm interesting. The suggestion that the police can do many things that mere mortals cannot is understood but let's remember that the Talivan operators aren't Police officers and that they are parking in often dangerous locations (a van pulling into the outside lane of a busy A road). Added to this the Police don't have carte blanche to do as they like. They are bound by many of the same laws we are.
The question stands - is it illegal?
The question stands - is it illegal?
Yes it is illegal. In order for some one to be prosecuted someone has to do it. So who is going to do it? Not the police because as far as they are concerned there is a conflict of interestes. I went to the courts to inquire as to how citizens can prosecute these type of things. I was told by the Clerk to the Justices that I would have to go to the court at 9.00am and attend the quarter sessions. At which time I would take the oath give evidence of the alleged offence to the magitrates and request a summons for the alleged offence be issued. E.g "On the 00th of xxx I saw a white transit van registration No.XXXXX parked on the footpath and within the limits of a pedestren crossing. I took a Photograph which I offer in evidence as Exibit 1. I believe an offence has been commited under the road trafic act XXX section xxx paragraph XXX". The magistrates then issue the summons. It would say Information has this day been laid before me by (the name of the person who gave the evidence) that You XXX did park a transit van on the footpath contrary to XXX of the RTA XXX and that you did park that vehicle within the limits of a pedestrain crossing. You are therfore summons to appear before the XXX mgistrates court on 00th of XXX. That's how it works. The vans nor the police have any exemption in law.It is just simply a matter of who will prosecute, and then who will convict. Who ever issues the prosecution also stands the costs of prosecuting again who's going to do it!. If you want to know more go to the library and read Wilkinsons Road Traffic law (that is the book the courts , Police and Solicitors use). Also read Archbolds (that is the book that Crown court Judges have in front of them)Hope this helps. When an Ambulance goes through a red light the driver beaks the law.
kestral said:
Yes it is illegal. In order for some one to be prosecuted someone has to do it. So who is going to do it? Not the police because as far as they are concerned there is a conflict of interestes. I went to the courts to inquire as to how citizens can prosecute these type of things. I was told by the Clerk to the Justices that I would have to go to the court at 9.00am and attend the quarter sessions. At which time I would take the oath give evidence of the alleged offence to the magitrates and request a summons for the alleged offence be issued. E.g "On the 00th of xxx I saw a white transit van registration No.XXXXX parked on the footpath and within the limits of a pedestren crossing. I took a Photograph which I offer in evidence as Exibit 1. I believe an offence has been commited under the road trafic act XXX section xxx paragraph XXX". The magistrates then issue the summons. It would say Information has this day been laid before me by (the name of the person who gave the evidence) that You XXX did park a transit van on the footpath contrary to XXX of the RTA XXX and that you did park that vehicle within the limits of a pedestrain crossing. You are therfore summons to appear before the XXX mgistrates court on 00th of XXX. That's how it works. The vans nor the police have any exemption in law.It is just simply a matter of who will prosecute, and then who will convict. Who ever issues the prosecution also stands the costs of prosecuting again who's going to do it!. If you want to know more go to the library and read Wilkinsons Road Traffic law (that is the book the courts , Police and Solicitors use). Also read Archbolds (that is the book that Crown court Judges have in front of them)Hope this helps. When an Ambulance goes through a red light the driver beaks the law.
I suggest you get your copy of Wilkinson out & read it then.
Regulations 21 and 22 of the Zebra, Pelican and Puffin Pedestrian Crossings Regulations 1997 create exceptions for vehicles stopped in the controlled area of a pedestrian crossing. The regulations apply to all three types of crossing.
Specifically mentioned are if the vehicle is being used for police, fire brigade or in England, fire and rescue authority, or ambulance purposes. It doesn't have to be a Police officer, it's just a Police purpose.
Ambulances are exempt from Red traffic lights under Reg 36(1)(b) Traffic Signs and General Directions Regulations 2002. Along with Police, Fire brigade, Bomb disposal & Blood service vehicles.
As for parking in restricted areas, anyone could park there with a dispensation from the local authority. Parking offences in restricted areas have been decriminalised, you can't go to court & get a summons as it's a PCN offence & the local authority prosecute. They won't however prosecute Police etc on official business.
Edited by vonhosen on Tuesday 10th April 21:47
- ) I wondered how long it would take Vonhosen to screech in, blue light flashing, to answer the question!!
So it's clear - bugger the safety issues we can park where we (and our helpers) want.
What an irony - the safety van parked endangering members of the public !! Well I suppose we shouldn't allow H&S to stand in the way of raising taxes.
Welcome to the Blairite paradise that is the UK.
So it's clear - bugger the safety issues we can park where we (and our helpers) want.
What an irony - the safety van parked endangering members of the public !! Well I suppose we shouldn't allow H&S to stand in the way of raising taxes.
Welcome to the Blairite paradise that is the UK.
vonhosen said:
kestral said:
Yes it is illegal. In order for some one to be prosecuted someone has to do it. So who is going to do it? Not the police because as far as they are concerned there is a conflict of interestes. I went to the courts to inquire as to how citizens can prosecute these type of things. I was told by the Clerk to the Justices that I would have to go to the court at 9.00am and attend the quarter sessions. At which time I would take the oath give evidence of the alleged offence to the magitrates and request a summons for the alleged offence be issued. E.g "On the 00th of xxx I saw a white transit van registration No.XXXXX parked on the footpath and within the limits of a pedestren crossing. I took a Photograph which I offer in evidence as Exibit 1. I believe an offence has been commited under the road trafic act XXX section xxx paragraph XXX". The magistrates then issue the summons. It would say Information has this day been laid before me by (the name of the person who gave the evidence) that You XXX did park a transit van on the footpath contrary to XXX of the RTA XXX and that you did park that vehicle within the limits of a pedestrain crossing. You are therfore summons to appear before the XXX mgistrates court on 00th of XXX. That's how it works. The vans nor the police have any exemption in law.It is just simply a matter of who will prosecute, and then who will convict. Who ever issues the prosecution also stands the costs of prosecuting again who's going to do it!. If you want to know more go to the library and read Wilkinsons Road Traffic law (that is the book the courts , Police and Solicitors use). Also read Archbolds (that is the book that Crown court Judges have in front of them)Hope this helps. When an Ambulance goes through a red light the driver beaks the law.
I suggest you get your copy of Wilkinson out & read it then.
Regulations 21 and 22 of the Zebra, Pelican and Puffin Pedestrian Crossings Regulations 1997 create exceptions for vehicles stopped in the controlled area of a pedestrian crossing. The regulations apply to all three types of crossing.
Specifically mentioned are if the vehicle is being used for police, fire brigade or in England, fire and rescue authority, or ambulance purposes. It doesn't have to be a Police officer, it's just a Police purpose.
Ambulances are exempt from Red traffic lights under Reg 36(1)(b) Traffic Signs and General Directions Regulations 2002. Along with Police, Fire brigade, Bomb disposal & Blood service vehicles.
As for parking in restricted areas, anyone could park there with a dispensation from the local authority. Parking offences in restricted areas have been decriminalised, you can't go to court & get a summons as it's a PCN offence & the local authority prosecute. They won't however prosecute Police etc on official business.
A) Have you got a definition of "Police purpose"?
B) Is a parking warden performing a "Police purpose"?
Cheers.
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