When did they change this Highway Code rule
Discussion
I was travelling south through Stafford town centre last night at 23.15 hrs to avoid the congestion at J14/13 when I came up behind a fully marked up Police Volvo estate car, he stopped at some traffic lights and presumably kept his foot on the brake pedal, the guy in the Ford Focus behind him did the same thing, I didn't, I was taught to apply the hand brake at traffic lights (amongst others), the brake lights on those Volvos are very bright aren't they.(especially when you have to look at them for 10 seconds)
Does it say in the Roadcraft book that "we" don't need to put our handbrakes on in these situations now, If so passing your driving test must be easier than it was when I was a lad.
Does it say in the Roadcraft book that "we" don't need to put our handbrakes on in these situations now, If so passing your driving test must be easier than it was when I was a lad.
slowly slowly said:
I was travelling south through Stafford town centre last night at 23.15 hrs to avoid the congestion at J14/13 when I came up behind a fully marked up Police Volvo estate car, he stopped at some traffic lights and presumably kept his foot on the brake pedal, the guy in the Ford Focus behind him did the same thing, I didn't, I was taught to apply the hand brake at traffic lights (amongst others), the brake lights on those Volvos are very bright aren't they.(especially when you have to look at them for 10 seconds)
Does it say in the Roadcraft book that "we" don't need to put our handbrakes on in these situations now, If so passing your driving test must be easier than it was when I was a lad.
Does it say in the Roadcraft book that "we" don't need to put our handbrakes on in these situations now, If so passing your driving test must be easier than it was when I was a lad.
How do you know they didn't have the handbrake on ?
Just because they had their foot on the brake pedal it doesn't mean they didn't.
Whether or not its in the Highway Code or Roadcraft...I hate it when people sit at the junction/traffic lights/wherever with their foot on the footbrake and the brake lights blazing. Dazzling and unpleasant. But a very natural driving habit given the popularity of automatic gearboxes.
I'm not talking about momentary stops here, BTW, when it would be inefficient and slow to use the handbrake like a learner driver - I'm talking about those twenty second long stops at lights and waiting in queues.
Not the worst driving sin by a long margin - but annoying.
As to the particular incident? Well. It happened...there you go...
The one that makes me laugh is watching cars at traffic lights on inclines twitching backwards and forwards and the driver holds the car (roughly) still on the clutch and accelerator. Makes for a quick getaway, alright, but the revving, the twitching, the smell of burning clutch plate -
I'm not talking about momentary stops here, BTW, when it would be inefficient and slow to use the handbrake like a learner driver - I'm talking about those twenty second long stops at lights and waiting in queues.
Not the worst driving sin by a long margin - but annoying.
As to the particular incident? Well. It happened...there you go...
The one that makes me laugh is watching cars at traffic lights on inclines twitching backwards and forwards and the driver holds the car (roughly) still on the clutch and accelerator. Makes for a quick getaway, alright, but the revving, the twitching, the smell of burning clutch plate -
I was always taught that handbrake should be used when stationary for more than a few seconds on either a flat or UPhill spot - but not necessary when facing downhill, and I still pretty much keep to that - I don't like having people burning their brake light image on the back of my retinas!
I nearly always use the handbrake at lights, but if there is no one behind me I will also keep my foot on the brake pedal until such a point someone does stop behind me when I release it. It's just another indicator to those approaching that I am in fact stationary (just in case they didn't see the red traffic lights).
Probably find it was an automatic where the correct procedure is to leave it in D & use the footbrake for short periods.
Perhaps a touch sloppy in that "when a pause becomes a wait" you should use the handbrake instead but easy to mis-judge the length of the traffic light cycle, or perhaps he thought the car behind was approaching a touch quickly & wanted to keep the brakelights on as an additional warning.
I'd go for end of shift tiredness & a slight misjudgement of the length of the wait required myself.
Perhaps a touch sloppy in that "when a pause becomes a wait" you should use the handbrake instead but easy to mis-judge the length of the traffic light cycle, or perhaps he thought the car behind was approaching a touch quickly & wanted to keep the brakelights on as an additional warning.
I'd go for end of shift tiredness & a slight misjudgement of the length of the wait required myself.
gopher said:
I nearly always use the handbrake at lights, but if there is no one behind me I will also keep my foot on the brake pedal until such a point someone does stop behind me when I release it. It's just another indicator to those approaching that I am in fact stationary (just in case they didn't see the red traffic lights).
That's what I was taught by an ex-police instructor.
I always take my foot off the brake pedal once someone is behind me. I know myself that they're blinding. Just as bad, if not worse than using fogs when they're not required.
When driving automatics, I was taught (and I teach) drivers to leave the car in D whilst temporarily held up, e.g. at traffic lights. Taking the car out of drive, into neutral, and back into drive again creates wear in the transmission, whereas leaving it in drive creates less wear.
Because automatic cars have a tendency to "creep", then I'd always teach students to keep the footbrake on as well as using the handbrake. So it sounds like the Police driver was doing exactly what they'd been taught to do.
I accept what you're saying about bright brake lights though - over the years, lights have got brighter and high-level brake lights have been introduced, so maybe there's scope for changing that bit of advice.
Because automatic cars have a tendency to "creep", then I'd always teach students to keep the footbrake on as well as using the handbrake. So it sounds like the Police driver was doing exactly what they'd been taught to do.
I accept what you're saying about bright brake lights though - over the years, lights have got brighter and high-level brake lights have been introduced, so maybe there's scope for changing that bit of advice.
R_U_LOCAL said:
When driving automatics, I was taught (and I teach) drivers to leave the car in D whilst temporarily held up, e.g. at traffic lights. Taking the car out of drive, into neutral, and back into drive again creates wear in the transmission, whereas leaving it in drive creates less wear.
Because automatic cars have a tendency to "creep", then I'd always teach students to keep the footbrake on as well as using the handbrake. So it sounds like the Police driver was doing exactly what they'd been taught to do.
I accept what you're saying about bright brake lights though - over the years, lights have got brighter and high-level brake lights have been introduced, so maybe there's scope for changing that bit of advice.
Because automatic cars have a tendency to "creep", then I'd always teach students to keep the footbrake on as well as using the handbrake. So it sounds like the Police driver was doing exactly what they'd been taught to do.
I accept what you're saying about bright brake lights though - over the years, lights have got brighter and high-level brake lights have been introduced, so maybe there's scope for changing that bit of advice.
I didn't think Police volvos where automatics, surely when you stop at traffic lights in an automatic you could still apply your handbrake, I was driving a Strallis (32 ton automatic) but I still applied my handbrake.
What does the Highway code say about "starting on an incline"?.
The point I am making is If people sitting with their foot on the brake pedal at traffic lights annoys you then why do it yourself, If you are taught to a very high standard I think you have a responsability to set an example to others, not revert to sloppy practices when it suits.
I was also taught by an ex-police guy and was firmly told to always use the handbrake when waiting at a junction because:
a) if you are punted hard from behind, your foot *will* come off the pedal and bad things could happen after that
b) if you've braked long and/or hard to come to a stop it (to some extent) stops heat being trapped btwn pad and disc, thereby reducing the likelihood of the disc warping.
a) if you are punted hard from behind, your foot *will* come off the pedal and bad things could happen after that
b) if you've braked long and/or hard to come to a stop it (to some extent) stops heat being trapped btwn pad and disc, thereby reducing the likelihood of the disc warping.
Edited by dxg on Thursday 12th April 16:42
R_U_LOCAL said:
Did you actually read my post before posting that little rant?
Edited by R_U_LOCAL on Thursday 12th April 15:46
I could ask you the same question, I can only assume from your quote that Police Volvos have automatic transmission and you teach Police drivers, If thats the case then I stand corrected, but IMO it is common courtesy to get off the brake pedal and use the handbrake.
7db said:
Strangely Brown said:
7db said:
Same for indicators.
Nice try.
Tom Wisdom rails against them in HPD4U - blinding by indicator vs blinding by brakelight?
If they are stationary behind you, why not turn it off if its not helping anyone?
Ahh... apologies. I thought you were fishing for the usual indicate or not debate.
In the context that you intended... yes, I agree with you.
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