Which Griff to buy?
Discussion
Sure this is a frequent asked question. Not new to TVR's, have recently sold my V8S. Was intending to buy a replica Cobra but have now put on hold. Looking at 4.3 precat and later 500's. Advice sought, 4.3 older and cheaper but is there any merit in the later 500's. Would like power steering, I know an option on the later cars but can you convert earlier ones, hydraulic or electric.
I read the earlier cars had problems with the rear suspension set up, so can this be sorted or again is it best to look for a later (what year) car. Anything else I should know appreciated
I read the earlier cars had problems with the rear suspension set up, so can this be sorted or again is it best to look for a later (what year) car. Anything else I should know appreciated
Later cars had a rear tie bar IIRC... but then decent aftermarket suspension means you don't really need one - but you could also have it retro-fitted.
4.3 pre-cats are regarded as the best sounding of the lot... but you'd need to ask someone else about the true power output of the 4.3 (most 500's are around 260 for a good 'un).
IMO buy on condition...
4.3 pre-cats are regarded as the best sounding of the lot... but you'd need to ask someone else about the true power output of the 4.3 (most 500's are around 260 for a good 'un).
IMO buy on condition...
My 4.3 is putting out 270bhp.... 10bhp less then the 280bhp claimed by TVR.... however I have ACT carbon fibre trumpets, ACT induction kit, larger fuel injectors and a rolling road remap.
With regard to the suspension no problems getting this uprated dependant on budget, approx £500 upwards.
Some of the good condition 4.3s are fetching more then the early 500's now.
Hoover
With regard to the suspension no problems getting this uprated dependant on budget, approx £500 upwards.
Some of the good condition 4.3s are fetching more then the early 500's now.
Hoover
Edited by Hoover. on Thursday 7th June 22:38
The 500's are a better developed car, with better brakes, revised suspension pick-up points, slightly better heating and ventilation.
Down sides are the catylst so inferior exhaust note and the MOT emissions test to struggle though
And the TVR 5ltr can suffer from moving liners and broken cranks.
But to drive there's very little between the cars the condition is far more important the 5ltrs are teensy bit quicker but due to softer cam and the cats the advantage isn't as marked as it should be for another 700cc.
Drive a few and make up your own mind
Matt
Down sides are the catylst so inferior exhaust note and the MOT emissions test to struggle though
And the TVR 5ltr can suffer from moving liners and broken cranks.
But to drive there's very little between the cars the condition is far more important the 5ltrs are teensy bit quicker but due to softer cam and the cats the advantage isn't as marked as it should be for another 700cc.
Drive a few and make up your own mind
Matt
Hoover. said:
Some people sneer at the precats as being old un superior models..... personally I love them 
Ah well let them Hoover probably never owned either before. IMHO The pre-cats sound better( unless you have a 500 with no cats
and were a "little" rougher around the edges but after many years of chersihed ownership they have probably been smoothed out or are utter dogs and been neglected 
I and I am sure many of you have seen pre-cats in better condition then 6 year old 500's.
The only reason I went for a 500 was I knew if I brought pre-cat I would hanker after a 500 so went stretched myself and went straight for the 500.
If I was you a would go out in as many as both as you can and decide which you prefer. AS Podie said Condition is the Main thing.
BB
hi 4.3 i think future classic the noise is just wrong it shouldnt allowed every time i start mine up the birds stop singing and all the neighbours run for cover, but i think any griff will be a good investment buy the best car you can afford many people i talk to buy newer tvrs but they always want their griff back ,every time you drive one you just cant stop smiling fantastic value for money in this sterile eu world sorry i have had a few beers i,ll get my coat
A healthy 4.3 will be knocking on the door of an average 500. At a RR day in January the 2 4.3s produced 250 & 256 bhp against 260-272 for standard 500s.
I'm not aware of any difference in suspension pick up points between the two cars. Certainly wishbones etc are interchangeble. The 500s had a rear anti-roll bar and different spring/damper combination. Few 4.3s will be on their original suspension now - mine runs 500 shocks and springs.
4.3 brakes are perfectly good for normal use as long as they're in good condition. The gearboxes also differ between the cars (although some 500s have the precat Rover box). The T5 on the 500 is supposed to be stronger but I prefer the shift of the L77.
I think to say the 4.3 is 'rougher around the edges' is probably a fair summary. I don't think it's rougher in terms of fit, finish or build quality, but that maybe because most precats have more or less been rebuilt by now. If anything 500s are more 'sophisticated' (in relative terms!) - they have closed loop fuelling and optional PAS and A/C. All the genes are still there though.
Do you want a pure-spirited classic which punches above its weight, or a hardcore 'modern' sportscar?
I'm not aware of any difference in suspension pick up points between the two cars. Certainly wishbones etc are interchangeble. The 500s had a rear anti-roll bar and different spring/damper combination. Few 4.3s will be on their original suspension now - mine runs 500 shocks and springs.
4.3 brakes are perfectly good for normal use as long as they're in good condition. The gearboxes also differ between the cars (although some 500s have the precat Rover box). The T5 on the 500 is supposed to be stronger but I prefer the shift of the L77.
I think to say the 4.3 is 'rougher around the edges' is probably a fair summary. I don't think it's rougher in terms of fit, finish or build quality, but that maybe because most precats have more or less been rebuilt by now. If anything 500s are more 'sophisticated' (in relative terms!) - they have closed loop fuelling and optional PAS and A/C. All the genes are still there though.
Do you want a pure-spirited classic which punches above its weight, or a hardcore 'modern' sportscar?
Had to be a 500 for me. I need that little bit extra speed or I'd forever be wanting.
500 can be made to sound awesome too. (not that they sound poor in standard form, by any means.)
Bottom line, any engined Griffith is a fabulous beast. It's impossible not to have fun in a well sorted version, whichever engine it carries.
500 can be made to sound awesome too. (not that they sound poor in standard form, by any means.)
Bottom line, any engined Griffith is a fabulous beast. It's impossible not to have fun in a well sorted version, whichever engine it carries.
Edited by lazyitus on Friday 8th June 08:51
I would go depending on budget. With 15k in you pocket a much newer 500 is within reach. If your down around 12k there appear to be some fine pre-cat cars available.
Interior and exterior finish is slightly different between the two also - mostly subtle stuff, however, so many different variations are out there no two are the same anyway.
I'm pre-cat biased as the noise is simply fantastic. 90% of driving is not full blast anyway and in the real world the marginal difference in performance makes little odds.
As suggested already - get out and have some fun testing different cars.
enjoy.
Interior and exterior finish is slightly different between the two also - mostly subtle stuff, however, so many different variations are out there no two are the same anyway.
I'm pre-cat biased as the noise is simply fantastic. 90% of driving is not full blast anyway and in the real world the marginal difference in performance makes little odds.
As suggested already - get out and have some fun testing different cars.
enjoy.
If you can get a decent 430 it has to be the right choice, if only for the rarity value. Like others above, I'm biased primarily because I have one, but they have more soul than the 500s. And the sound - it's glorious! I've heard many 500s with all kinds of exhaust mods - they usually sound great at full chat under load, or popping and banging on overrun, but they glug like tugboats at idle. A well sorted precat is an aural delight.
As for performance, I don't track mine but I've been for a few 'spirited' runs with other Tivvers and PHers and my 96,000 mile/15 year old pre-cat's not been embarrassed yet - in the real world the performance is awesome.
I'm fortunate in that the previous owner had spent over £6,000 on getting it up to scratch - everything from carpets, seats, leather, shocks, manifold, etc. has been replaced. If you can find something similar or are willing to put the money and time in, you'll not regret it. Promise.
As for performance, I don't track mine but I've been for a few 'spirited' runs with other Tivvers and PHers and my 96,000 mile/15 year old pre-cat's not been embarrassed yet - in the real world the performance is awesome.
I'm fortunate in that the previous owner had spent over £6,000 on getting it up to scratch - everything from carpets, seats, leather, shocks, manifold, etc. has been replaced. If you can find something similar or are willing to put the money and time in, you'll not regret it. Promise.
I think your options are limited by the fact you want power steering.
From what I've read on here its a difficult and expensive thing to retrofit.
If you can do without the girlie pack get a PreCat. Just look at how many of your responses have been from those of us who own them, you just can't help but get hooked by them and if you aren't an immediate enthusiast you soon will be, so keep some of your budget for an anorak
From what I've read on here its a difficult and expensive thing to retrofit.
If you can do without the girlie pack get a PreCat. Just look at how many of your responses have been from those of us who own them, you just can't help but get hooked by them and if you aren't an immediate enthusiast you soon will be, so keep some of your budget for an anorak
kerry11 said:
HI all,
I'm also looking to buy a griff and was wondering if they suffer from engine reliability probs like other later v8 tvr's and are there any common faults to look for.
Griffith engines are generally sound. They are a pretty basic V8 in many respects. Possibly the most reliable engine to grace a TVR IMO.I'm also looking to buy a griff and was wondering if they suffer from engine reliability probs like other later v8 tvr's and are there any common faults to look for.
My main concern with an earlier car would be the condition of the chassis. My V8S was a good un but I have heard that the chassis on most models can be a problem rust wise, you would expect the later ones to be better!
My V8S had 205/15 front tyres and I felt on the limit for quick turn in and low speed manouvers. I have read somewhere about electric power steering in a Griff similar to that used in some kit Cobras.
Anyone have experience of both a V8S and Griff, comments appreciated?
My V8S had 205/15 front tyres and I felt on the limit for quick turn in and low speed manouvers. I have read somewhere about electric power steering in a Griff similar to that used in some kit Cobras.
Anyone have experience of both a V8S and Griff, comments appreciated?
eng622
In practice your theory that the later chassis are better preserved doesn't work that way in practice - I have found that the early chassis are better.
My theory is that the early chassis were never stockpiled outside as they went straight into production such was the early demand. Later chassis tended to lie around outside and picked up the start of internal corrosion.
Jay
In practice your theory that the later chassis are better preserved doesn't work that way in practice - I have found that the early chassis are better.
My theory is that the early chassis were never stockpiled outside as they went straight into production such was the early demand. Later chassis tended to lie around outside and picked up the start of internal corrosion.
Jay
Edited by Jay Ayegees on Friday 8th June 22:31
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