4.5 HEAD SPECS?????
Discussion
THE 4.5 V8 HEADS....... DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT THE INLET AND EXHAUST VALVE SIZES ARE? AND ANYONE PUT IN OVERSIZE VALVES? ALSO WHAT ARE THE INLET AND EXHAUAST PORT VOLUMES OR DIAMETERS.
THIS ENGINE IS 2 VALVES PER CYL, OVERSIZE VALVES WOULD REALLY BENEFIT THIS ENGINE, ALSO ANYONE SAWN A SCRAP CYLINDER IN HALF TO SEE THE INLET AND EXHAUST PORT WALL SECTIONS? HOW BIG CAN YOU GO??????
STANDARD CAM SPEC? ANYONE GOT A IDEA OF WHAT IT IS? DURATION? LIFT? LOBE CENTRE ANGLES? LIFT AT TDC? TIMING FIGURES?
ANYONE KNOW SPECS OF MODIFIED CAMS? HOW MUCH, WHICH MAKE?
ANYONE REPROFILE CAMS?
IS THERE ANYONE OR ANY COMPANY OUT THERE THAT ARE REALLY GOOD AT PORTING THESE HEADS OUT?
Inlet side of things, the short induction kit i gather is the way to go!
BUT ANYONE MESSED AROUND WITH EQUAL LENGTH LONG PRIMARY EXHAUST MANIFOLDS?
Sorry i havent introduced myself i have a 4.5 Cerbera, had it for around 6 weeks now.
I've mainly worked on the famous Vauxhall/Opel/Lotus 2.0 XE engines on throttle bodies, its the same theory as our Cerbera Engines. High Revving single choke per cylinder, my other car is this http://www.gnrse.co.uk/index_files/Page1054.htm .
With this type of engine Induction (diameter lengths) , Exhaust Manifold (diameter lengths), Cams and the Cylinder Head Ports are really important to get the Volumetric efficiently up. The above engine when modified with the right bits 125 % VE is easy and if the Cerbera 4.5 does makes the factory spec of 380 lbs per ft i thk its tht, im not sure now, its not far from 125% VE, but to gain horsepower you want to extend this torque curve to the higher part of the rev range, but at the cost of sometimes or most of the time loosing out at the bottom end.
See below, if this engine had a VE of 120% at 7000 rpm it could make 500 hp.
Displacement: 4475 [cm3]
Max. RPM: 14000 [RPM] Turbo efficiency. t1 [ºC]
RPM steps: 500 [RPM] Compressor Intercooler 20 Q Airflow Power Torque
RPM VE [%]
1500 10.0%
2000 25.0%
2500 30.0%
3000 40.0%
3500 60.0%
4000 70.0%
4500 80.0%
5000 100.0%
5500 113.0%
6000 115.0%
6500 118.0%
7000 120.0%
7500 125.0%
8000 125.0%
Power Torque
[HP] [kW] [Nm] [kpm] [lbf*ft]
9.0 6.6 41.9 4.27 30.9
29.8 22.0 104.8 10.69 77.3
44.8 32.9 125.8 12.82 92.8
71.6 52.7 167.7 17.10 123.7
125.3 92.2 251.6 25.65 185.5
167.1 123.0 293.5 29.92 216.4
214.8 158.1 335.5 34.20 247.4
298.3 219.6 419.4 42.75 309.2
370.8 272.9 473.9 48.30 349.4
411.7 303.0 482.3 49.16 355.6
457.6 336.8 494.8 50.44 364.8
501.2 368.9 503.2 51.30 371.0
559.4 411.7 524.2 53.43 386.5
596.7 439.1 524.2 53.43 386.5
The potential is there, and for sure extensively reworking the heads would be the way to go. I know the heads won't breathe like a 4 valve per cyl, but research and development will prove how good they could actually flow?
Anyone know where I could get some spare Cylinder Heads from?
Race AJP engine do they make 440 bhp???????????
This should be a good goal to aim for. Thats about 105 %VE at 7000 rpm. or 98%VE at 7500 rpm to make 440 bhp.
THIS ENGINE IS 2 VALVES PER CYL, OVERSIZE VALVES WOULD REALLY BENEFIT THIS ENGINE, ALSO ANYONE SAWN A SCRAP CYLINDER IN HALF TO SEE THE INLET AND EXHAUST PORT WALL SECTIONS? HOW BIG CAN YOU GO??????
STANDARD CAM SPEC? ANYONE GOT A IDEA OF WHAT IT IS? DURATION? LIFT? LOBE CENTRE ANGLES? LIFT AT TDC? TIMING FIGURES?
ANYONE KNOW SPECS OF MODIFIED CAMS? HOW MUCH, WHICH MAKE?
ANYONE REPROFILE CAMS?
IS THERE ANYONE OR ANY COMPANY OUT THERE THAT ARE REALLY GOOD AT PORTING THESE HEADS OUT?
Inlet side of things, the short induction kit i gather is the way to go!
BUT ANYONE MESSED AROUND WITH EQUAL LENGTH LONG PRIMARY EXHAUST MANIFOLDS?
Sorry i havent introduced myself i have a 4.5 Cerbera, had it for around 6 weeks now.
I've mainly worked on the famous Vauxhall/Opel/Lotus 2.0 XE engines on throttle bodies, its the same theory as our Cerbera Engines. High Revving single choke per cylinder, my other car is this http://www.gnrse.co.uk/index_files/Page1054.htm .
With this type of engine Induction (diameter lengths) , Exhaust Manifold (diameter lengths), Cams and the Cylinder Head Ports are really important to get the Volumetric efficiently up. The above engine when modified with the right bits 125 % VE is easy and if the Cerbera 4.5 does makes the factory spec of 380 lbs per ft i thk its tht, im not sure now, its not far from 125% VE, but to gain horsepower you want to extend this torque curve to the higher part of the rev range, but at the cost of sometimes or most of the time loosing out at the bottom end.
See below, if this engine had a VE of 120% at 7000 rpm it could make 500 hp.
Displacement: 4475 [cm3]
Max. RPM: 14000 [RPM] Turbo efficiency. t1 [ºC]
RPM steps: 500 [RPM] Compressor Intercooler 20 Q Airflow Power Torque
RPM VE [%]
1500 10.0%
2000 25.0%
2500 30.0%
3000 40.0%
3500 60.0%
4000 70.0%
4500 80.0%
5000 100.0%
5500 113.0%
6000 115.0%
6500 118.0%
7000 120.0%
7500 125.0%
8000 125.0%
Power Torque
[HP] [kW] [Nm] [kpm] [lbf*ft]
9.0 6.6 41.9 4.27 30.9
29.8 22.0 104.8 10.69 77.3
44.8 32.9 125.8 12.82 92.8
71.6 52.7 167.7 17.10 123.7
125.3 92.2 251.6 25.65 185.5
167.1 123.0 293.5 29.92 216.4
214.8 158.1 335.5 34.20 247.4
298.3 219.6 419.4 42.75 309.2
370.8 272.9 473.9 48.30 349.4
411.7 303.0 482.3 49.16 355.6
457.6 336.8 494.8 50.44 364.8
501.2 368.9 503.2 51.30 371.0
559.4 411.7 524.2 53.43 386.5
596.7 439.1 524.2 53.43 386.5
The potential is there, and for sure extensively reworking the heads would be the way to go. I know the heads won't breathe like a 4 valve per cyl, but research and development will prove how good they could actually flow?
Anyone know where I could get some spare Cylinder Heads from?
Race AJP engine do they make 440 bhp???????????
This should be a good goal to aim for. Thats about 105 %VE at 7000 rpm. or 98%VE at 7500 rpm to make 440 bhp.
I believe most AJP8's - worked on, RedRosed and all - give about 425 at under 7k (looking at the dyno-sheets). So 450 seems close enough to get with some exhaust, ECU and intake fiddling.
But then, what about peakpower if you'll end up with a bugger bottom-end and thus undriveable car . . .
Great figures for a 2 valve / head mill BTW.
What I like to know is the max safe redline for the 8.
Anyone?
But then, what about peakpower if you'll end up with a bugger bottom-end and thus undriveable car . . .
Great figures for a 2 valve / head mill BTW.
What I like to know is the max safe redline for the 8.
Anyone?
Has your 4.5 had the re-map and / or the shorter inlets?
Once this has been done you and you're getting more like the 400ish pony mark your need to port the heads may be diminished....
I think Jools best result so far is 425Bhp with no internal mods see the Trackcar solutions website
Matt
Once this has been done you and you're getting more like the 400ish pony mark your need to port the heads may be diminished....
I think Jools best result so far is 425Bhp with no internal mods see the Trackcar solutions website
Matt
savroo said:
THE 4.5 V8 HEADS....... DOES ANYONE KNOW WHAT THE INLET AND EXHAUST VALVE SIZES ARE? AND ANYONE PUT IN OVERSIZE VALVES? ALSO WHAT ARE THE INLET AND EXHAUAST PORT VOLUMES OR DIAMETERS.
THIS ENGINE IS 2 VALVES PER CYL, OVERSIZE VALVES WOULD REALLY BENEFIT THIS ENGINE, ALSO ANYONE SAWN A SCRAP CYLINDER IN HALF TO SEE THE INLET AND EXHAUST PORT WALL SECTIONS? HOW BIG CAN YOU GO??????
STANDARD CAM SPEC? ANYONE GOT A IDEA OF WHAT IT IS? DURATION? LIFT? LOBE CENTRE ANGLES? LIFT AT TDC? TIMING FIGURES?
ANYONE KNOW SPECS OF MODIFIED CAMS? HOW MUCH, WHICH MAKE?
ANYONE REPROFILE CAMS?
IS THERE ANYONE OR ANY COMPANY OUT THERE THAT ARE REALLY GOOD AT PORTING THESE HEADS OUT?
Inlet side of things, the short induction kit i gather is the way to go!
BUT ANYONE MESSED AROUND WITH EQUAL LENGTH LONG PRIMARY EXHAUST MANIFOLDS?
Sorry i havent introduced myself i have a 4.5 Cerbera, had it for around 6 weeks now.
I've mainly worked on the famous Vauxhall/Opel/Lotus 2.0 XE engines on throttle bodies, its the same theory as our Cerbera Engines. High Revving single choke per cylinder, my other car is this http://www.gnrse.co.uk/index_files/Page1054.htm .
With this type of engine Induction (diameter lengths) , Exhaust Manifold (diameter lengths), Cams and the Cylinder Head Ports are really important to get the Volumetric efficiently up. The above engine when modified with the right bits 125 % VE is easy and if the Cerbera 4.5 does makes the factory spec of 380 lbs per ft i thk its tht, im not sure now, its not far from 125% VE, but to gain horsepower you want to extend this torque curve to the higher part of the rev range, but at the cost of sometimes or most of the time loosing out at the bottom end.
See below, if this engine had a VE of 120% at 7000 rpm it could make 500 hp.
Displacement: 4475 [cm3]
Max. RPM: 14000 [RPM] Turbo efficiency. t1 [ºC]
RPM steps: 500 [RPM] Compressor Intercooler 20 Q Airflow Power Torque
RPM VE [%]
1500 10.0%
2000 25.0%
2500 30.0%
3000 40.0%
3500 60.0%
4000 70.0%
4500 80.0%
5000 100.0%
5500 113.0%
6000 115.0%
6500 118.0%
7000 120.0%
7500 125.0%
8000 125.0%
Power Torque
[HP] [kW] [Nm] [kpm] [lbf*ft]
9.0 6.6 41.9 4.27 30.9
29.8 22.0 104.8 10.69 77.3
44.8 32.9 125.8 12.82 92.8
71.6 52.7 167.7 17.10 123.7
125.3 92.2 251.6 25.65 185.5
167.1 123.0 293.5 29.92 216.4
214.8 158.1 335.5 34.20 247.4
298.3 219.6 419.4 42.75 309.2
370.8 272.9 473.9 48.30 349.4
411.7 303.0 482.3 49.16 355.6
457.6 336.8 494.8 50.44 364.8
501.2 368.9 503.2 51.30 371.0
559.4 411.7 524.2 53.43 386.5
596.7 439.1 524.2 53.43 386.5
The potential is there, and for sure extensively reworking the heads would be the way to go. I know the heads won't breathe like a 4 valve per cyl, but research and development will prove how good they could actually flow?
Anyone know where I could get some spare Cylinder Heads from?
Race AJP engine do they make 440 bhp???????????
This should be a good goal to aim for. Thats about 105 %VE at 7000 rpm. or 98%VE at 7500 rpm to make 440 bhp.
Email me regarding heads for saleTHIS ENGINE IS 2 VALVES PER CYL, OVERSIZE VALVES WOULD REALLY BENEFIT THIS ENGINE, ALSO ANYONE SAWN A SCRAP CYLINDER IN HALF TO SEE THE INLET AND EXHAUST PORT WALL SECTIONS? HOW BIG CAN YOU GO??????
STANDARD CAM SPEC? ANYONE GOT A IDEA OF WHAT IT IS? DURATION? LIFT? LOBE CENTRE ANGLES? LIFT AT TDC? TIMING FIGURES?
ANYONE KNOW SPECS OF MODIFIED CAMS? HOW MUCH, WHICH MAKE?
ANYONE REPROFILE CAMS?
IS THERE ANYONE OR ANY COMPANY OUT THERE THAT ARE REALLY GOOD AT PORTING THESE HEADS OUT?
Inlet side of things, the short induction kit i gather is the way to go!
BUT ANYONE MESSED AROUND WITH EQUAL LENGTH LONG PRIMARY EXHAUST MANIFOLDS?
Sorry i havent introduced myself i have a 4.5 Cerbera, had it for around 6 weeks now.
I've mainly worked on the famous Vauxhall/Opel/Lotus 2.0 XE engines on throttle bodies, its the same theory as our Cerbera Engines. High Revving single choke per cylinder, my other car is this http://www.gnrse.co.uk/index_files/Page1054.htm .
With this type of engine Induction (diameter lengths) , Exhaust Manifold (diameter lengths), Cams and the Cylinder Head Ports are really important to get the Volumetric efficiently up. The above engine when modified with the right bits 125 % VE is easy and if the Cerbera 4.5 does makes the factory spec of 380 lbs per ft i thk its tht, im not sure now, its not far from 125% VE, but to gain horsepower you want to extend this torque curve to the higher part of the rev range, but at the cost of sometimes or most of the time loosing out at the bottom end.
See below, if this engine had a VE of 120% at 7000 rpm it could make 500 hp.
Displacement: 4475 [cm3]
Max. RPM: 14000 [RPM] Turbo efficiency. t1 [ºC]
RPM steps: 500 [RPM] Compressor Intercooler 20 Q Airflow Power Torque
RPM VE [%]
1500 10.0%
2000 25.0%
2500 30.0%
3000 40.0%
3500 60.0%
4000 70.0%
4500 80.0%
5000 100.0%
5500 113.0%
6000 115.0%
6500 118.0%
7000 120.0%
7500 125.0%
8000 125.0%
Power Torque
[HP] [kW] [Nm] [kpm] [lbf*ft]
9.0 6.6 41.9 4.27 30.9
29.8 22.0 104.8 10.69 77.3
44.8 32.9 125.8 12.82 92.8
71.6 52.7 167.7 17.10 123.7
125.3 92.2 251.6 25.65 185.5
167.1 123.0 293.5 29.92 216.4
214.8 158.1 335.5 34.20 247.4
298.3 219.6 419.4 42.75 309.2
370.8 272.9 473.9 48.30 349.4
411.7 303.0 482.3 49.16 355.6
457.6 336.8 494.8 50.44 364.8
501.2 368.9 503.2 51.30 371.0
559.4 411.7 524.2 53.43 386.5
596.7 439.1 524.2 53.43 386.5
The potential is there, and for sure extensively reworking the heads would be the way to go. I know the heads won't breathe like a 4 valve per cyl, but research and development will prove how good they could actually flow?
Anyone know where I could get some spare Cylinder Heads from?
Race AJP engine do they make 440 bhp???????????
This should be a good goal to aim for. Thats about 105 %VE at 7000 rpm. or 98%VE at 7500 rpm to make 440 bhp.
Cheers Paul
Autocraft cut a head up so they could work out what max material could be removed when they were developing Campbels 5.5 Ltr Supercharged AJP8. Their conclusion was that the valves are as big as they can go. Anything larger and the seats would disappear, chambers are too small. Incidentally this car will be at the Diamond Rock on display.
Have a chat with Dave on 01722 411118
Good luck
G
Have a chat with Dave on 01722 411118
Good luck
G
yzf1070 said:
Autocraft cut a head up so they could work out what max material could be removed when they were developing Campbels 5.5 Ltr Supercharged AJP8. Their conclusion was that the valves are as big as they can go. Anything larger and the seats would disappear, chambers are too small. Incidentally this car will be at the Diamond Rock on display.
Have a chat with Dave on 01722 411118
Good luck
G
So it's running now Have a chat with Dave on 01722 411118
Good luck
G
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