Just how much trouble are McLaren in?
Discussion
1) They have just lost their chief designer. This really cannot help when they are in a head to head battle with the donkeys.
2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
loneranger said:
1) They have just lost their chief designer. This really cannot help when they are in a head to head battle with the donkeys.
2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
As a big F1 fan I sincerely hope you're wrong but that will not be the case sadly.2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
loneranger said:
1) They have just lost their chief designer. This really cannot help when they are in a head to head battle with the donkeys.
2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
Interesting thoughts, but you seem to presume that:2) Lots of their senior people will now be spending most of their time with lawyers, the FIA, the police, the press etc . Instead of getting on with racing. This huge distraction has got to harm.
3) The FIA may force them to remove parts or take other retrograde steps to cancel out the technolgy advantage that came with the Ferrari knowledge.
4) How many points are going to be deducted? Will it be from the drivers, the manufacturers. Or both. Or maybe they will be banned from a few upcoming races. Whatever, the donkeys have the season in the bag now.
5) McLarens sponsors and technology partners. Mercedes included, will be having kittens. Handling this alone will keep Ron occupied full time.
6) Bernie will be more than hopping mad that his business is being dragged through the mud. He will have his pound of flesh for this.
1. McLaren (the organisation) have acted improperly
2. McLaren benefitted from any information passed
I'm not at all sure that those are reasonable presumptions.
The normal route to acquire IP is to hire the guy that created or understands it. It's done all the time, and it's totally above board. I'm not saying that espionage isn't an issue within motorsport, but it is fraught with problems of its own - if you're interested, the development of the Tupolev 144 illustrates the problem of nicking designs that you don't understand.
As for Bernie, it'll be interesting to see how it plays. I'm sure it won't be the way I'd expect, but I could imagine him taking advantage of the publicity. I can't see him shedding any tears over anything that creates parity of performance between top teams.
WilliBetz
Interesting one, could it all be dirty tricks? if you were a designer and got an anonymous delivery of designs from a competitor what would you do with them? you didn't steal them they were just sent to you.
how do you prove that either way ??
sounds like a good way to screw up a competitor..
Send some old plans out to their designers, then fire your own employee who your having trouble with...
makes your ex guy unemployable plus probably the guy from the other team and gives massive problems to your competitor..
or maybe thats just what I'd do
G
how do you prove that either way ??
sounds like a good way to screw up a competitor..
Send some old plans out to their designers, then fire your own employee who your having trouble with...
makes your ex guy unemployable plus probably the guy from the other team and gives massive problems to your competitor..
or maybe thats just what I'd do
G
Dakkon said:
A lot of assumptions there LR, only time will tell if your right.
Did Ron not give you his autograph or something and that's why you don't like McLaren?
I don't dislike any person or team in F1. I admire them all. Except for Ralf.Did Ron not give you his autograph or something and that's why you don't like McLaren?
Edited by Dakkon on Wednesday 4th July 10:13
http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3213_246671...
Stepneygate could decide World Championships
As F1 grapples with the incredible developments of Stepneygate, which culminated in McLaren suspending their chief designer on Tuesday after Ferrari documents were allegedly uncovered at his home, a nightmare scenario looms over the sport: the World Championship being won and lost in the courts.
Having already launched legal proceedings against their mechanic Nigel Stepney, Ferrari's claim of espionage took on a sensational dimension on Tuesday when a police raid, made at their behest, allegedly found 'technical information' stolen from their Maranello base at the home of Mike Coughlan, McLaren's chief designer.
Announcing that they had presented 'a case against Nigel Stepney and an engineer from the Vodafone McLaren Mercedes team with the Modena Tribunal, concerning the theft of technical information', Ferrari pointedly ruled out further legal redress. 'Ferrari reserves the right to consider all implications, be they criminal, civil or of any other nature, according to the applicable laws,' it declared in a statement.
"We have proof that Stepney had been supplying technical information to a McLaren employee and we found evidence of that fact in his [the employee's] home. This is a very serious situation. We are talking about a lot of information being given to a prominent McLaren engineer. We are not talking here about rumours or speculation."
As a mood of crisis threatened to envelop the sport on Tuesday night, the FIA confirmed that, "We have received information on this matter, which we are examining."
The governing body will be powerless during any criminal investigation either in Italy or Britain, but it is already being speculated that Ferrari could launch a separate case that would determine the victors of both the Drivers' and Constructors' World Championships in the courts.
Their case would be advanced if they could prove a correlation between performance and the alleged 'dirty tricks'.
Tellingly, the discovery of a mysterious white powder in the fuel tanks of both Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen's cars just before the Monaco GP, which prompted the internal enquiry that resulted in Stepney's sacking, coincided with a sudden regression by the team's chargers. Having won the previous two races in dominant fashion, Ferrari then failed to challenge for victory in the next three.
Meanwhile, with McLaren admitting that 'a senior member of its technical organisation personally received a package of technical information from a Ferrari employee at the end of April', The Guardian reports that 'Ferrari believe that the improvement in McLaren's performance after the Spanish Grand Prix on May 13 is consistent with the apparent leaks at the end of April.'
Stepneygate could decide World Championships
As F1 grapples with the incredible developments of Stepneygate, which culminated in McLaren suspending their chief designer on Tuesday after Ferrari documents were allegedly uncovered at his home, a nightmare scenario looms over the sport: the World Championship being won and lost in the courts.
Having already launched legal proceedings against their mechanic Nigel Stepney, Ferrari's claim of espionage took on a sensational dimension on Tuesday when a police raid, made at their behest, allegedly found 'technical information' stolen from their Maranello base at the home of Mike Coughlan, McLaren's chief designer.
Announcing that they had presented 'a case against Nigel Stepney and an engineer from the Vodafone McLaren Mercedes team with the Modena Tribunal, concerning the theft of technical information', Ferrari pointedly ruled out further legal redress. 'Ferrari reserves the right to consider all implications, be they criminal, civil or of any other nature, according to the applicable laws,' it declared in a statement.
"We have proof that Stepney had been supplying technical information to a McLaren employee and we found evidence of that fact in his [the employee's] home. This is a very serious situation. We are talking about a lot of information being given to a prominent McLaren engineer. We are not talking here about rumours or speculation."
As a mood of crisis threatened to envelop the sport on Tuesday night, the FIA confirmed that, "We have received information on this matter, which we are examining."
The governing body will be powerless during any criminal investigation either in Italy or Britain, but it is already being speculated that Ferrari could launch a separate case that would determine the victors of both the Drivers' and Constructors' World Championships in the courts.
Their case would be advanced if they could prove a correlation between performance and the alleged 'dirty tricks'.
Tellingly, the discovery of a mysterious white powder in the fuel tanks of both Felipe Massa and Kimi Raikkonen's cars just before the Monaco GP, which prompted the internal enquiry that resulted in Stepney's sacking, coincided with a sudden regression by the team's chargers. Having won the previous two races in dominant fashion, Ferrari then failed to challenge for victory in the next three.
Meanwhile, with McLaren admitting that 'a senior member of its technical organisation personally received a package of technical information from a Ferrari employee at the end of April', The Guardian reports that 'Ferrari believe that the improvement in McLaren's performance after the Spanish Grand Prix on May 13 is consistent with the apparent leaks at the end of April.'
loneranger said:
http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3213_246671...
Stepneygate could decide World Championships
'Ferrari believe that the improvement in McLaren's performance after the Spanish Grand Prix on May 13 is consistent with the apparent leaks at the end of April.'
Wow really getting the press "on side" now Stepneygate could decide World Championships
'Ferrari believe that the improvement in McLaren's performance after the Spanish Grand Prix on May 13 is consistent with the apparent leaks at the end of April.'
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