Should I be ****ed off?
Discussion
Need some advice - should I be pissed off or is this just bad luck.
I've had the Ultima on the road for two years now, and the engine in the car for two years and two months. I had a two year warranty on the engine. You know where this is going...
A few days ago at a track event (performance driving school) a few laps in I noticed the oil pressure dropping slowly, so I pulled off and shut down. Car was trailored back and initial inspection from the race shop mechanic was that a bearing on the crank failed. Bits of bearing material in the oil. He didn't pull the pan yet. I'll be swinging down there on Monday to see for myself.
The engine is a SBC, built by a recommended engine builder. I had it dry-sumped and I use a pre-oiler before starting the engine. Change the oil often. The car has only 7000 miles on it, all of which are tame road miles except about 150 miles track time, but only at driver training schools and I'm pretty conservative as a driver since the Ultima is so incredibly fast. I never go over about 5200 rpm and that is very rare anyway.
I deliberately dry sumped the car and installed the pre-oiler to try to prevent exactly this. So, should I be pissed off with the engine builder, or is this just bad luck?
When I was building my engine I spent many hours on the Chevy-talk forum trying to find the right choice of parts for my build.
The subject of 'spinning' a bearing came up time and time again and did not seem to be related to 'standard of workmanship'. My perception of those posts was that it was more common in standard conrods than more up-market H beams and the like. The advise given was that it was essential to inspect the rods for bends and alignment of the two bearing journals.
In your case I doubt your build included standard rods so may be down to the other common cause....bad luck. This can even happen to those you would suspect to be immune..Lucky_P.
Steve
The subject of 'spinning' a bearing came up time and time again and did not seem to be related to 'standard of workmanship'. My perception of those posts was that it was more common in standard conrods than more up-market H beams and the like. The advise given was that it was essential to inspect the rods for bends and alignment of the two bearing journals.
In your case I doubt your build included standard rods so may be down to the other common cause....bad luck. This can even happen to those you would suspect to be immune..Lucky_P.
Steve
There is no such thing as luck, good or bad I too like Steve did alot of research before i built my first engine and spinning shells did seem to come up slot , seems odd that these engines in normal road cars will do thousands of miles without problems but put one in a Ultima and they seem to be a problem !!!! my second engine was built by a expert and he spent alot of time and money on the new crank and rods and used special shells ,very supprised that a dry sump motor has had bearing problems !!!
^ Just because the motor has been fitted with a dry sump system, do not automatically assume that it will be problem free. There is much more to it than just fitting the appropriate hardware ie. correct size supply and return lines, size of tank, positioning of certain items and I think that in my particular case at least, attention was paid to the oil flow paths and internal oil drain design features within the block modified to enhance performance of the dry sump system as a whole.
Also, bad luck is most prevalent it would seem where Ultimas are concerned, I think maybe they are looking to fill the most unreliable vehicle void now vacant since the demise of TVR
Also, bad luck is most prevalent it would seem where Ultimas are concerned, I think maybe they are looking to fill the most unreliable vehicle void now vacant since the demise of TVR
An common problem is using stainless braided lines with rubber hose inside. When it gets hot use some the suction pulls it shut starving the bearings for oil.
I supply a metal spring to be installed in the hose on the suction side of the dry sump to prevent this.
The other option is to use teflon lined braided hose.
If everything else was correct in the engine, I'd look at this.
Of course if you want to upgrade to a LS7, you know who to contact.
Good Luck!
I supply a metal spring to be installed in the hose on the suction side of the dry sump to prevent this.
The other option is to use teflon lined braided hose.
If everything else was correct in the engine, I'd look at this.
Of course if you want to upgrade to a LS7, you know who to contact.
Good Luck!
On a factory buily engine the tune is very conservative, therefore very little cylinderpressure and very little chance at detonation etc. On a hotrodded engine the margins are much slimmer and cylinderpressure, timing and fuel may be much closer to the safe limits, where one tank of bad gas can cause detonation to drive the conrod bearing to make contact with the crank journal. Shifting full throttle at low rpm(5200) will compound these problems as you are effectively lugging your engine. Standard SBC's should handle 6000-6200rpm without complaint. Oliver
jschwartz said:
An common problem is using stainless braided lines with rubber hose inside. When it gets hot use the suction pulls it shut starving the bearings for oil.........
JeffDon't know too much about dry sump systems so blast away if I'm barking up the wrong tree.
If this were the failure mode would it not first be indicated with an oil warning light?
Steve
jschwartz said:
An common problem is using stainless braided lines with rubber hose inside. When it gets hot use some the suction pulls it shut starving the bearings for oil.
I supply a metal spring to be installed in the hose on the suction side of the dry sump to prevent this.
The other option is to use teflon lined braided hose.
If everything else was correct in the engine, I'd look at this.
Of course if you want to upgrade to a LS7, you know who to contact.
Good Luck!
Is this between the scavenge pump and the sump, or the dry sump tank and the high pressure pump ?I supply a metal spring to be installed in the hose on the suction side of the dry sump to prevent this.
The other option is to use teflon lined braided hose.
If everything else was correct in the engine, I'd look at this.
Of course if you want to upgrade to a LS7, you know who to contact.
Good Luck!
Thanks Ryan. VB is the best beer in the world, second is RedBack. You can't get either in America because no self-respecting Aussie wharfy would let them be loaded onto an outbound ship! But if you are ever out this way, I'll pay you to carry a slab of either through customs 
In terms of the car, I'm currently tearing down the engine bay and should have the engine out in a few days. That will give me a chance to inspect it myself. I've also pulled off all the lines and will report on their state, and the state of the pump and the suction lines.
In terms of the car, I'm currently tearing down the engine bay and should have the engine out in a few days. That will give me a chance to inspect it myself. I've also pulled off all the lines and will report on their state, and the state of the pump and the suction lines.
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