Rust - Porsche won't budge so advice needed
Discussion
All,
The outcome of my battle with Porsche to repair, under warranty, the rust that is occurring as a result of the factory fitted kick plates rubbing against the body shell of my car (December 2002 C4S, UK Car, 31k miles, Bought from an OPC, full warranty and serviced on the button) has now reached the point where I believe the only option I have is to go legal.
Porsche have said they will provide the parts (2 new kick plates worth £180) but I will have to pay the labour for the repair - a further £650. I asked Porsche if they would provide the parts and allow me to get the work done at an alternative (and much cheaper) body shop but Porsche have declined. If I want their good will I have to use their (very) expensive body shop.
Porsche’s response has remained the same. The rust is caused by an external influence rubbing on the shell of the car. My argument is that the ‘external influence’ is a factory fitted option and if the design of that factory fitted option allows it to rub against the shell of the car and cause the rust then this is a fundamental manufacturing problem.
In my last call with Porsche GB I told them my intention was to take this legal at which point they have said they can no longer discuss the issue with me and advised me of the contact details of their legal representative.
I would appreciate any help or advice on where to go next. Specifically, what are the words / phrases I should use when writing to Porsche’s legal department that would give me the best chance of Porsche settling this out of court? Should I seek a settlement in my letter or should my letter to Porsche just inform them of my intention to take this action through the small claims court?
I appreciate your collective help. This has really soured what has otherwise been a very enjoyable Porsche ownership experience.
Jon
The picture shows my problem. Both sides of the car are impacted by this problem.
The outcome of my battle with Porsche to repair, under warranty, the rust that is occurring as a result of the factory fitted kick plates rubbing against the body shell of my car (December 2002 C4S, UK Car, 31k miles, Bought from an OPC, full warranty and serviced on the button) has now reached the point where I believe the only option I have is to go legal.
Porsche have said they will provide the parts (2 new kick plates worth £180) but I will have to pay the labour for the repair - a further £650. I asked Porsche if they would provide the parts and allow me to get the work done at an alternative (and much cheaper) body shop but Porsche have declined. If I want their good will I have to use their (very) expensive body shop.
Porsche’s response has remained the same. The rust is caused by an external influence rubbing on the shell of the car. My argument is that the ‘external influence’ is a factory fitted option and if the design of that factory fitted option allows it to rub against the shell of the car and cause the rust then this is a fundamental manufacturing problem.
In my last call with Porsche GB I told them my intention was to take this legal at which point they have said they can no longer discuss the issue with me and advised me of the contact details of their legal representative.
I would appreciate any help or advice on where to go next. Specifically, what are the words / phrases I should use when writing to Porsche’s legal department that would give me the best chance of Porsche settling this out of court? Should I seek a settlement in my letter or should my letter to Porsche just inform them of my intention to take this action through the small claims court?
I appreciate your collective help. This has really soured what has otherwise been a very enjoyable Porsche ownership experience.
Jon
The picture shows my problem. Both sides of the car are impacted by this problem.
Take it to the small claims court. I think this has a limit of around £3000 so should be ok for your claim. As soon as you do that (and it doesn't really cost anything to do) I'm sure they'll come to a "mutual agreement" with you that is satisfactory.
You should be able to initiate this on the web, so google the small claims court etc
You should be able to initiate this on the web, so google the small claims court etc
Silver993tt said:
Take it to the small claims court. I think this has a limit of around £3000
£5,000 is the small claims threshold thesedays.Send a letter to Porsche GB's registered office address summarising the story and the problem you have experienced. Tell them that, in the absence of satisfactory proposals to resolve the dispute, you will commence small claims proceedings and give them a deadline (14 days is reasonable, in the circumstances) for productions of these proposals, in the absence of which you will arrange to have proceedings served on them.
You may want to check your home contents insurance to see whether it includes legal expenses insurance. If it does, phone them to notify the claim and let them instruct solicitors to deal with it on your behalf.
Sounds pretty shitty of Porsche GB to take the line that they are not liable for a product that one of their dealers sold to you and fitted to the car. Best of luck getting it sorted.
Get it independently assessedby a reputable body specialists, send the legal department a copy of the report and give them 14 days to respond.
Tell them that after that period, you will take legal action to resolve the matter and any costs incurred will be added to the claim for the work being undertaken at a different Porsche OPC, as you have now lost faith in their ability to identify and correct the problems to Porsche's high standards.
Once you have done that, you are in a position to take them to court.....very easy to do.
Good Luck.
Tell them that after that period, you will take legal action to resolve the matter and any costs incurred will be added to the claim for the work being undertaken at a different Porsche OPC, as you have now lost faith in their ability to identify and correct the problems to Porsche's high standards.
Once you have done that, you are in a position to take them to court.....very easy to do.
Good Luck.
Someone in Porsche warranty is being a little pedantic again by the looks ... from a technical perspective I can see their point, but if its an approved part and they issued a warranty on the car knowing it was there .. to be blunt, tough luck for them. I anticipate that their stance is looking at the bigger picture - there must be a lot of cars with these plates and its likely they may all develop the same problem as they get used.
If you have tried Porsche GB and their position is the same, then you have little option than to go down the legal route that Lurking Lawyer describes. I`ve had a few minor scurmishes with the warranty department on past cars and so have a few friends, but Porsche GB have always come good in the end. They just need the odd shove from time to time ... like with a Claim Form from the court
Small claims procedures are informal and you can easily do it yourself - if you employ a solicitors you won`t get the costs back in a small claims action even if you win. So bear that in mind.
Best of luck
If you have tried Porsche GB and their position is the same, then you have little option than to go down the legal route that Lurking Lawyer describes. I`ve had a few minor scurmishes with the warranty department on past cars and so have a few friends, but Porsche GB have always come good in the end. They just need the odd shove from time to time ... like with a Claim Form from the court
Small claims procedures are informal and you can easily do it yourself - if you employ a solicitors you won`t get the costs back in a small claims action even if you win. So bear that in mind.
Best of luck
Edited by Try5t on Friday 20th July 13:14
johnfm said:
There is a PH guy who does this sort of thing for a living - put a post on the business forum re: small claims.
It's how I earn a crust.To the OP - if you need any guidance on the court side of things, feel free to drop me an e-mail via my profile.
Small claims litigation is designed to be user-friendly and informal though - it positively encourages the parties to do it themselves rather than use solicitors, so I don't think you'll have any problems with it.
hi dont be afraid to take them to court,its easy very little hassle will take between 6-12 months,i have just done it to a multi national company who were being pedantic over a 5k bathroom suite.We wiped the floor with them they had to pay everything including comp,interest,it ended up we got the suite for nothing all for the sake of a couple of hundred quid taps,
I have never sued before but would not think twice if i had to do it again,so if your right go for it.
I have never sued before but would not think twice if i had to do it again,so if your right go for it.
Los Angeles said:
with a 5% interest charge a month over current base rate.
You can certainly seek to recover out of pocket expenses but the court will only award interest at the judgment rate of 8% p.a.(You may be thinking of the increased interest provision under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act - that doesn't apply here.)
Edited by Lurking Lawyer on Saturday 21st July 12:14
That depends whether the OP is claiming under the warranty (which he refers to in his first post) - if the warranty is underwritten by Porsche GB, they are the correct defendant. Although it may be that warranty is actually underwritten by some other subsidiary company, or even by a separate insurance company.
If the claim is not pursuant to the warranty, but on the basis that the goods and services supplied were not of satisfactory quality, the claim should be against the OPC that supplied and fitted them, since the OP's contract is with them rather than with Porsche GB.
If the claim is not pursuant to the warranty, but on the basis that the goods and services supplied were not of satisfactory quality, the claim should be against the OPC that supplied and fitted them, since the OP's contract is with them rather than with Porsche GB.
If The Griffalo had exactly the same problem, maybe he would provide a statement in support of your claim, JD? Not conclusive, but it may help persuade a District Judge that this isn't a one-off or that it wasn't caused by something you yourself have done.
Depends on where you both are, I suppose - for a statement to be admissible, the witness has to attend to the small claims hearing, so it would mean Griffalo attending at court with you.
Still, you could always send a copy of the statement with your claim and use it just as further leverage in the hope that it persuades them to settle.
Depends on where you both are, I suppose - for a statement to be admissible, the witness has to attend to the small claims hearing, so it would mean Griffalo attending at court with you.
Still, you could always send a copy of the statement with your claim and use it just as further leverage in the hope that it persuades them to settle.
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff