wheel alignment settings for Griffith 500 required please

[purpleparadise]

Hi

If anyone knows what the wheel alignment settings should be, I'd be really pleased to hear from you. I've had the Griff since the beginning of May and experience worrying instability at speed (a kind of 5-litre hovercraft effect). I have checked tyres & pressures and had the suspension fully checked, the splitter is still in place and I had the alignment done (for the third time) today, although no one seems to know what the settings actually are. Looking forward to finding a dry enough road to test today's adjustments.

Thanks

Jo

[Simon.b]

Have a look at this,

http://www.thegriffithpages.com/content/view/106/8...

Cheers,

Simon.

[NicBowman]

Hi

In my experience the Griff front suspension is prone to wear, and you could expect to need some maintenance after just 25k miles from new. Most often the front suspension bushes slip(metalastic) , especially the upper bushes (near the manifold) get very lose. This will adjust the suspesnion geometry in a way that increases instability and causes an occasional odd wheel wobble - not like wheel balance as it comes and goes.

The rack and track rod ends also suffer, as the wheel offset causes load to pass back into the rack, putting a lot of load through the steering system in general.

Neither are fantastically hard to fix, look in Steve Heaths book for bush transplant.

In general the Griff is not fantastically stable at speed if the road is bumpy, this is an almost universal experience (I am sure to be contradicted here! But, if you use your car on flat A roads all the time you may never know).

I have been throgh my car front to back so many times, and would still like it to be more stable, my local roads are very bumpy.

Wish you luck, just keep aware and don't go too mad on the loud pedal!

Nic

[Bomber Denton]

Here's the Chimaera settings, the same as yours, just for faster cars.

[Seasider]

Bomber Denton said:

Here's the Chimaera settings, the same as yours, just yours are faster better looking cars.

[Bonefish]

Jo,

Had very much the same with my 500 with camber and wheel alignment all seemingly correct. The main cause was shot wishbone bushes so they were floating and moving about altering all my suspension settings underbraking/ movement !. So changed all the fronts with polyurethane bushes. Also changed the top ball joints when I did this and then re-did all camber angles etc the diffenerence was instantly noticeable. Even on bumpy roads I've now got confidence in the car and that it doesn't feel like it's jumping around several feet to the left or right.

I've put 0.75 degrees of negative camber on the fronts, with 2mm of toe in on each wheel. I'd have to refresh my memory what the castor setting was but didn't need to alter the castor angle as it was fine (think around 2-3 degrees but don't quote me on that !)

[spend]

Too much play or notchiness in any of the steering &or suspension components can have unpleasant effects, best to check all these first. 4-4.5deg castor is nearly always within spec unless shims have been incorrectly located AFIK, set by the shims/upper BJ's - I dont think you could get it as low 2-3degs without a bit of engineering. There are many different views on geo settings, the ones quoted should be fine as a std IMHO - you can 'develope' them further to your own preferences if you so desire. Dont forget ride height has an effect on how the arcs work, if this is not in the perfect position WRT geo then more camber & little more toe is 'nicer' IMHO (to ensure neither goes positive under movement).

Dave

[DarkMatter]

purpleparadise said:

...I've had the Griff since the beginning of May and experience worrying instability at speed (a kind of 5-litre hovercraft effect)...

What make/type of tyres do you have? Are they the same on front and rear?

[purpleparadise]

Thank you all for your input - food for thought! I need to go through each reply and check measurements etc. I'll need to find someone who can translate "mintues" on toe in/toe out data into "mm" as the current laser machines in use seem to only offer settings in mm. The front tyres are SO2's (came on car, possibly ancient) and the rear are Toyo Proxes T1R's (brand new 2500 miles/2 months ago) and so far, no tyre/suspension professional has suggested that the tyres are incompatible, but they see so few Griffs and have little spec to go on... Latest adjustment on wheel alignment seems to show that we are going in the right direction for ironing out the problem, if only the rain would stay off for long enough to have a decent Test Hurtle.

Many thanks for all your help

Jo

[red griff 500]

My Griff atrted playing up stability wise when I fitted Toyos to the rear ( SO3's on front). Lots of postings on here confirms that this is a common experience. The best theory I've heard so far is that the extra grip of the Toyos ( and they certainly have much better grip) eccentuates the faults in suspension eg steering UJs, track rod bearings, wishbone bushes etc. Mine certainly need changing (just failed MOT on bushes and steering UJs). It'll be interesting to see the difference when I've changed these. Other people have found that fitting Toyos on the front has cured the problems although I don't think I've heard the rationale as to why this should be so.

[DarkMatter]

purpleparadise said:

The front tyres are SO2's (came on car, possibly ancient) and the rear are Toyo Proxes T1R's

Jo,

While I had SO3s on the front I fitted new T1-Rs on the rear. The car became scary, even in a straight line, especially when the road was not dead smooth. I replaced the SO3s on the front with T1-Rs and it now feels safe and behaves predictably.
Andrew.

[purpleparadise]

The suspension has been checked out and is fine - the car's done 19,000 miles but I will watch out for suspension problems looming. Sounds like Bridgestones on the front and Toyos on the rear is a recipe for heart-stopping moments. I always expected that they would occur at some point, but not at 80 in a straight line! I'll change the front tyres for Toyos shortly and my local village garage still has their old wheel alignment system in a box somewhere and they are happy to fish it out and check the camber/castor in the old-fashioned way.

Thanks everyone - I knew there must be some explanation somewhere!

And, Bomber Denton, I will be overtaking you :-) hopefully without a heart-stopping moment and a big grin!

Jo

[purpleparadise]

Problem solved! It was the mix of Bridgestones and Toyos that did it. Car behaves perfectly now I have Toyos all round - many thanks to everyone who contributed, I am delighted :-)

Jo

[Corky]

Seasider said:

Bomber Denton said:

Here's the Chimaera settings, the same as yours, just yours are faster better looking cars.

[Gooner]

Definitely change the S02s, you'll probably notice a huge difference even if they don't look worn (I did when I ditched mine - a good tyre but the rubber will be completely hard and slippery by now). The Toyo's would be an ideal choice.

There really isn't a good reason for these cars to feel unstable - took me a couple of years of gradual improvement to realise that.

Lots of good advice in the other posts but also consider the ride height if the problem is at speed. Can't remember the exact numbers or where to measure, probably in the Bible or on the Griff pages, but if the car's attitude is sufficiently 'nose down' it can also make a big difference.

gooner