TVR Cerbera 4.2 Vs 4.5 advice please
Discussion
After some advice please - I've currently got Supra VVTI 6 Speed Single Turbo which I'm looking at putting up for sale soon, fancy trying something new. The Supra is VERY fast with the mods that has been done and it's used as a daily driver. I've hankered for a Cerbera before and I'm being drawn to one again but I'm not sure which model will be best. I'm planning on getting out in a few soon but am wondering what the general consensus is. The Cerbera would have to be a daily driver and their reputed reliability is a bit worrying. I've heard the 4.2 and 4.5L AJP engines are the more reliable ones, is this true? What are the main differances between the 2 engines? The 4.5 is meant to have individual throttle bodies too isn't it, where the 4.2 is a single plenum?
The main type of driving I do is a 8 mile trip to work and back and a few long distance hauls the odd few days. I want a fast car but it wouldn't have to be mind blowingly quick as, without causing an argument, the Supra at the minute will be faster than either Cerb on a rolling start but I'm bored of driving fast etc and would prefer to save the fuel
Is the differance in performance between the 4.2 and the 4.5 that great? I'm not interested in top end speed, prefer low down grunt and the odd motorway pull, love country lane twisties too.
Which would be the better choice? Any Cerbera owners fancy a deal with a single turbo Supra?
Thanks
The main type of driving I do is a 8 mile trip to work and back and a few long distance hauls the odd few days. I want a fast car but it wouldn't have to be mind blowingly quick as, without causing an argument, the Supra at the minute will be faster than either Cerb on a rolling start but I'm bored of driving fast etc and would prefer to save the fuel
Is the differance in performance between the 4.2 and the 4.5 that great? I'm not interested in top end speed, prefer low down grunt and the odd motorway pull, love country lane twisties too.Which would be the better choice? Any Cerbera owners fancy a deal with a single turbo Supra?
Thanks
Edited by Ro_Kopite on Sunday 5th August 15:51
Good man, looks like you're ready to scratch the Cerbera itch, it comes to all petrol heads sooner or later. Which to go for given the description of how it will be used the answer is either really. There's not much in it between a standard 4.5 and 4.2, the general concensus is that the 4.2 has the better throttle response the 4.5 a bit more torque. Both models have indvidual throttles just the intake layout differs and I beleive this is where the 4.2 wins out over the standard 4.5 but plenty of mods available for the 4.5 to improve matters and turn it into the quicker of the two. Early 4.2s may have a cast crank and some of these have failed, other than that and apart from tuning potential there's nothing in it between the two.
I've found mine to be very reliable, the odd clutch and starter glitch but since sorted I've racked up a pretty good mileage without any problems. I don't use mine as a daily driver (I've tried it but it does my head in - but I might just be soft) although plenty do without problems, in fact the daily drivers seem to be the more reliable cars if treated properly. So as long as you're happy with a bit of preventative maintenance and more frequent servicing it shouldn't be a problem.
In summary and from what you say you're after try either and buy the one in the best condition that floats your boat, I doubt you'll be dissapointed.
Cheers
David
I've found mine to be very reliable, the odd clutch and starter glitch but since sorted I've racked up a pretty good mileage without any problems. I don't use mine as a daily driver (I've tried it but it does my head in - but I might just be soft) although plenty do without problems, in fact the daily drivers seem to be the more reliable cars if treated properly. So as long as you're happy with a bit of preventative maintenance and more frequent servicing it shouldn't be a problem.
In summary and from what you say you're after try either and buy the one in the best condition that floats your boat, I doubt you'll be dissapointed.
Cheers
David
Cheers for the reply Dave, what is considered to be an "early" Cerb? I don't know what year they facelifted it. By the sounds of it, they're both equally moddable but then the main differance would be the capacity at the final stage. What ECU's do both run? I've heard there's a Motec in the 4.5?
Ro_Kopite said:
Cheers for the reply Dave, what is considered to be an "early" Cerb? I don't know what year they facelifted it. By the sounds of it, they're both equally moddable but then the main differance would be the capacity at the final stage. What ECU's do both run? I've heard there's a Motec in the 4.5?
They all run MBE ECUs from the factory. The 4.5 is perceived as more moddable because you can achieve bigger gains with induction mods and custom ECU mapping. In reality, most of a big gain is down to how poorly mapped a standard 4.5 is. The 4.2 has the better throttle response which counts for a lot - a good 4.2 will be as quick as a reasonable standard 4.5, some even quicker.
4.5s tended to be spec'd to higher levels than 4.2s - stuff like aircon, full leather etc. etc.
Like I said... "a good 4.2 will be as quick as a reasonable standard 4.5, some even quicker." 
nemasis said:
yeah as i just said a 4.2 IS quicker than a 4.5 all day long,fester turned up ehh hope he is now hangingfrom the nearest lamp post,no phil didnt go for that reason i would now be arrested and waiting to be bailed out
Sadly the evidence (except for a handful of exceptional cars) suggests you're wrong 
nemasis said:
i think youll find a good set up 4.2 (by me for instance) will be quicker than a 4.5
well if we're waving our own flags .. be nice to put one of your 4.2s against one of my 4.5s at santa pod if you can beat 11.9secs / 119mph with a 4.2 I'll buy you a beer 
I guess the lightweight was the one and only major facelift although I don't think all of the changes applied to the 4.2. My understanding is that it involves the 4 light headlamp and tail light arrangements (later 4.2' had this), a reprofiled rool bar with the loss of sun visors to improve forward visibilty. Some light weight panels, spiders as standard and a 95/98 ron switch.
I've no idea when the 4.2 received the forged crank but would guess 99 or later. As for mpg I wouldn't think there was a whole lot in it, neither can be described as planet savers.
Boss has summed up the whole 4.2, 4.5 tunabilty question in another post when he said: the majority of gains seen on the 4.5 could best be described as reinstating the power the engine should of had all along with decent mapping and is relatively cheap to achieve for the bhp/£.
The 4.2 on the other hand is widely considered to be correctly mapped and producing what it should so any gains from this engine can be relatively more expensive.
Personally I'd be happy with either providing it had the later clutch and if a 4.2 the forged crank. After that it's down to condition and how the car's been looked after, a cheap Cerby may not always save you the money you thought you were saving.
David
I've no idea when the 4.2 received the forged crank but would guess 99 or later. As for mpg I wouldn't think there was a whole lot in it, neither can be described as planet savers.
Boss has summed up the whole 4.2, 4.5 tunabilty question in another post when he said: the majority of gains seen on the 4.5 could best be described as reinstating the power the engine should of had all along with decent mapping and is relatively cheap to achieve for the bhp/£.
The 4.2 on the other hand is widely considered to be correctly mapped and producing what it should so any gains from this engine can be relatively more expensive.
Personally I'd be happy with either providing it had the later clutch and if a 4.2 the forged crank. After that it's down to condition and how the car's been looked after, a cheap Cerby may not always save you the money you thought you were saving.
David
Edited by davidn on Sunday 5th August 22:48
nemasis said:
tell me what were the exceptional cars ???????????cause id love to know,all standard 4.2s were quicker than 4.5.well when i tested them they where.but would love to know the exceptional ones
the dyno, the race track, the quarter mile and the open road all tell the same story .. put a good 4.5 against a good 4.2 and the 4.5 wins every time. You can't argue with an extra 20-30 lb.ft of torque through most of the rev range ..
The crank was changed in late in 98 so from an S reg you should be OK...
But beeing TVR I think should they have found a few "old" crankshafts lying on the courtyard they will
certainly have fitted them anytime later
I was in the same situation as you two years ago, found the 4.2 (standard) livlier and more responsive (perception) then the also standard 4.5, thats why I went for it--- another difference btw is brakes 4.5 has bigger brakes all round
But beeing TVR I think should they have found a few "old" crankshafts lying on the courtyard they will
certainly have fitted them anytime laterI was in the same situation as you two years ago, found the 4.2 (standard) livlier and more responsive (perception) then the also standard 4.5, thats why I went for it--- another difference btw is brakes 4.5 has bigger brakes all round
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