Parking Charge on Superstore Car Park - Legal?

[johnbear]

I've just been to the local superstore, parking in their shared carparked with other stores and upon returning to my car I found a Parking Charge Notice from Excel Parking Services Limited.

I didn't have to pay to park and it's not a council car park. I've been charged £60 for not parking within the lines of the bay - tyre over the line

Is this legal?

[BIG DUNC]

Is there a sign somewhere within the car park saying you have to be parked within the bays?
It probably sais on the same sign that by leaving your car there you are agreeing to their terms and conditions. Whether or not this is legal or moral I have no idea.
Good luck.

[Parrot of Doom]

You're the registered keeper. That doesn't mean you're the person with whom they entered into a contract.

Ask them to identify the driver so you can pass the charge on.

[Chrisgr31]

Have a look at the Tesco thread.

Basically they may write to the DVLA asking for details of the Registered Keeper. Once they receive them they will write to the Registered Keeper asking for the £60 or whatever it has increased to by then. The Registered Keeper may then choose to write back to advise they are unsure who was driving can the company please provide the details. If they don't do nothing. Do not admit who was driving!

I overstayed my welcome in a privately own Pay and Display car park over 6 months ago, and received a ticket. Heard nothing since so worth ignoring them!

[johnbear]

After finding the notice, I did find a sign saying that parking was free for 2 hours.

[bluepolarbear]

Assuming correct signage they have a legally binding contract with the driver of the vehicle. If the driver fails to pay they can go to court and ask the court to award for breach of contract.

The problem that normally exists is they don't know who the driver is. They may have video footage but they problem just have a reg plate.

As this is a civil offence they are on their own, if they can find they maybe able to recover the cost but it is normally not worth the effort. Its easier for them to send an official looking letter to the Reg Keeper and hope they will cover for fine for the driver.

How do they know who the reg keeper is? The government quite happily sells your private data to anyone with cash.

[Trax]

Yep, as everyone has and will say, they cannot prosecute the driver if they cannot prove who the driver was.

Just ignore it, they are chancers and con artists. They make enough money from the gullible who pay, without pursuing people who know the law.

[BMWBen]

Isn't the law about breach of contract that they can only charge you what the breach actually cost them? Hence all the controversy about bank charges... I'm pretty sure this is the same situation.

If they do identify the driver, ask them to break down the costs incurred by you straying outside the line.

[Flat in Fifth]

johnbear said:

After finding the notice, I did find a sign saying that parking was free for 2 hours.

As others said there are a number of threads about this I think the TESCO ANPR thread provides a number of links.

Pertaining to your situation, does the signage specifically mention parking which is not completely within the marked bays, ie wheel over line?

If not, they can whistle.

[Conian]

I drive a car which is a bit low to the ground and has loooong doors so that people can get into the (cramped) back seats. I'm also a big chap, so getting out of cars like this can be tricky... even tricker when you consider that the handbrake is to the right of the drivers seat, sticking up enough to hook on trouser leg when trying to do a tight exit.

I have now got a method of getting in and out the car in tight spaces, but it requires full health and strength to do it, and aches from the gym or flu symptoms makes it impossible.

I try not to be too inconsiderate and I will park further down the car park when I do this, I park a bit badly, basically taking up 2 bays so that I can open the door. I've only ever once been spoken to about parking out of the lines, and a quick lie was invented for just such occasion...

"When I came in and parked there was a sodding great 4x4 in the next bay which was parked badly which meant I couldnt get into the bay properly"

[johnbear]

There was no notice of the rules about parking within the lines and the car park was empty.

[tigger1]

johnbear said:

There was no notice of the rules about parking within the lines and the car park was empty.

Write back explaining that you don't think you were parked outside the lines, and regardless, there is no such requirement on any of their posted signs stating you had to be parked in a single bay.

Thank them for their time, and then explain that they should go forth and copulate / capitulate as required.

[Parrot of Doom]

tigger1 said:

johnbear said:

There was no notice of the rules about parking within the lines and the car park was empty.

Write back explaining that you don't think you were parked outside the lines, and regardless, there is no such requirement on any of their posted signs stating you had to be parked in a single bay.

Thank them for their time, and then explain that they should go forth and copulate / capitulate as required.

No don't do that. Don't even admit you were driving. Only when and if they provide CCTV stills of the driver do you try that one.

[tigger1]

Parrot of Doom said:

tigger1 said:

johnbear said:

There was no notice of the rules about parking within the lines and the car park was empty.

Write back explaining that you don't think you were parked outside the lines, and regardless, there is no such requirement on any of their posted signs stating you had to be parked in a single bay.

Thank them for their time, and then explain that they should go forth and copulate / capitulate as required.

No don't do that. Don't even admit you were driving. Only when and if they provide CCTV stills of the driver do you try that one.

Yes, good point - get things in the right order:

• 1. Go f*ck yourself
• 2. I wasn't driving, go see the drivr for your money
• 3. The driver said they parked in the bay
• 4. There's no sign to say you must park in the bay

[TonyHetherington]

This sort of approach is only applicable to the privately owned ticketing companies I assume?

I got a ticket last night for parking in highstreet while I unloaded all my camera gear into the dance studio I was photographing (which is on the high street). Grrrr.

[mel]

Sod that I'm more interested in the photographs you took in the dance studio!

[RichBurley]

BMWBen said:

Isn't the law about breach of contract that they can only charge you what the breach actually cost them? Hence all the controversy about bank charges... I'm pretty sure this is the same situation.

If they do identify the driver, ask them to break down the costs incurred by you straying outside the line.

As I would see it, it's the law of tort that counts. A trespass has occurred. The vehicle may not be on the land after a period of time, before a penalty is levied. I presume that a penalty should be commensurate with what a Judge would consider ought to be the penalty for a vehicular trespass, which may or may not be £60.00 in these circumstances.

I have bee instructed by a company to pursue private debts in a situation like this, and I am instructed to prusue those claims to Court if they do not settle, relying upon trespass and law of tort if the registered keepers fail to acknowledge the offence, or provide adequate evidence that someone else was driving at the time.

[TonyHetherington]

mel said:

Sod that I'm more interested in the photographs you took in the dance studio!

so would any red blooded male

[mouseymousey]

RichBurley said:

I have bee instructed by a company to pursue private debts in a situation like this, and I am instructed to prusue those claims to Court if they do not settle, relying upon trespass and law of tort if the registered keepers fail to acknowledge the offence, or provide adequate evidence that someone else was driving at the time.

Could you explain that a bit further please? Would you take the registered keeper to court? I thought that, unlike with speeding, there is nothing in law which requires the registered keeper to provide details of the driver.

[RichBurley]

mouseymousey said:

RichBurley said:

I have bee instructed by a company to pursue private debts in a situation like this, and I am instructed to prusue those claims to Court if they do not settle, relying upon trespass and law of tort if the registered keepers fail to acknowledge the offence, or provide adequate evidence that someone else was driving at the time.

Could you explain that a bit further please? Would you take the registered keeper to court? I thought that, unlike with speeding, there is nothing in law which requires the registered keeper to provide details of the driver.

I would take them to Court if my client instructs me. No, there is nothing in the law to require them in this instance to prove that it is them driving. But I only have to prove a case on a balance of probabilities, and if you are the keeper, and and fail to provide any evidence that it isn't your driving, them have made a prima facie case on behalf of my client, and you, as the keeper, who has been alleged to be the driver, would have failed to provide an adequate denial.

In answer to the OP's question, personally speaking, I would ignore this kind of fine, as it will take a gutsy person or company to take this to Court. By the same token, if you have parked where my client doesn't permit you, and you don't pay up, then I am instructed to pursue Court proceedings on that basis...

Assuming a District Judge makes a decision (not binding), then I'll let you know how my client fares in such a claim.

Edited by RichBurley on Tuesday 7th August 15:22