door seals.

[Davi]

Anyone happened across any websites that give accurate cross sections of door seals? Found a few but not what I'm looking for - which is a seal that can be clipped to a panel rather than being pushed over a lip.

Ta

[LotusNova]

Davi,

Not exactly sure what you're after, but you could try these folks:
http://www.woolies-trim.co.uk/c-322-extrusion.aspx

Best regards,
Jon.

[Davi]

Thanks Jon, no luck there unfortunately.

What I'm after I've only really seen on more modern cars - its' like the standard type door / aperture seal, a bit like this...

U-O

only instead of having a "U" section that clips over a flange around the aperture, it has clips so that it is clipped to a flat surface in a reveal.

So you end up with something like...

__
...|D-O
...|___
.........|


and if you can make head or tail of that diagram you're a better man than I

[egomeister]

I've not encountered an off the shelf seal like that before, I suspect you would probably have to cannibalise a seal from a car if you want a seal like that.

Any reason you don't want to use the type that press over the flange?

[ricola]

Hi Davi,
Try this:
http://www.kopak-walker.co.uk/

They seem to have a decent selection..

Rich

[Davi]

ricola said:

Hi Davi,
Try this:
http://www.kopak-walker.co.uk/

They seem to have a decent selection..

Rich

Cheers Rich, hard to tell from the pics but they have a few profiles that look similar - I'll contact them and see what they say

egomeister said:

I've not encountered an off the shelf seal like that before, I suspect you would probably have to cannibalise a seal from a car if you want a seal like that.

Any reason you don't want to use the type that press over the flange?

because despite all the (very good, very sensible, really should be listened to) advice against it I've decided to try and do a carbon semi-monocoque on my project, and the door seals come in a place it would be rather inconvenient / structurally less sound to have a seam.

[egomeister]

I take it you wouldn't be able to mould a lip in then?

Can you get to the rear of the panel you are planning to put the seal on? I'm wondering if you could adapt a stock section of the kind of profile you want, but fix it in a different way. I'll see if I can spot anything with integrated clips though, but i fear it's a bit specific.

[Davi]

egomeister said:

I take it you wouldn't be able to mould a lip in then?

Can you get to the rear of the panel you are planning to put the seal on? I'm wondering if you could adapt a stock section of the kind of profile you want, but fix it in a different way. I'll see if I can spot anything with integrated clips though, but i fear it's a bit specific.

Theoretically I could, but it would make the mould incredibly complex and if I'm honest, I don't like moulding little lips, they are quite prone to failure in my hands & skills.

Very good point on the access though, there is no reason I can't adapt so that I could gain rear access if I can come up with an alternative fixing method.

My Dad's just phoned with the suggestion of self adhesive seals. I've never used them but find most self adhesive stuff tends to fall off quite rapidly. Certainly another thing to ponder on though.

[egomeister]

Davi said:

egomeister said:

I take it you wouldn't be able to mould a lip in then?

Can you get to the rear of the panel you are planning to put the seal on? I'm wondering if you could adapt a stock section of the kind of profile you want, but fix it in a different way. I'll see if I can spot anything with integrated clips though, but i fear it's a bit specific.

Theoretically I could, but it would make the mould incredibly complex and if I'm honest, I don't like moulding little lips, they are quite prone to failure in my hands & skills.

Very good point on the access though, there is no reason I can't adapt so that I could gain rear access if I can come up with an alternative fixing method.

My Dad's just phoned with the suggestion of self adhesive seals. I've never used them but find most self adhesive stuff tends to fall off quite rapidly. Certainly another thing to ponder on though.

Wouldn't fancy self adhesive seals in an area that will be used so often.

Got an pics of the construction of the car? Send them over to me and i'll have a think.

[Davi]

egomeister said:

Wouldn't fancy self adhesive seals in an area that will be used so often.

Got an pics of the construction of the car? Send them over to me and i'll have a think.

No that was my thought on the sticky stuff.

Nothing I can show you at the moment unfortunately - it's in CAD and the tub has been broken down to component form, so is just a few hundred construction references and squiggles! In fact that's why I'm after the seals, need to know where to position the reveal construction points before I can re-assemble.

[egomeister]

Davi said:

egomeister said:

Wouldn't fancy self adhesive seals in an area that will be used so often.

Got an pics of the construction of the car? Send them over to me and i'll have a think.

No that was my thought on the sticky stuff.

Nothing I can show you at the moment unfortunately - it's in CAD and the tub has been broken down to component form, so is just a few hundred construction references and squiggles! In fact that's why I'm after the seals, need to know where to position the reveal construction points before I can re-assemble.

I was thinking something along the lines of plastic push fittings through from the back of the panel, but i think you might have to get lucky on the lengths of what is available (and also the size of the seal). Perhaps you might be able to find something like this? http://www.skiffy.com/docs/inhoudfr.cfm?taal=gb&am...

Of course, if you have a specific seal you have seen it may be worth cannibalising that assuming its not moulded to the door aperture. Could you perhaps fit the seal to the door rather than body? Not sure things would be any easier though!

How are the doors constructed - I presume they are framed rather than frameless? If they have similarities to a production door, i'd make as much use of the joggle/geometry and trim as you possibly can.

What level of detail are you modelling the car to?

[Davi]

egomeister said:

I was thinking something along the lines of plastic push fittings through from the back of the panel, but i think you might have to get lucky on the lengths of what is available (and also the size of the seal). Perhaps you might be able to find something like this? http://www.skiffy.com/docs/inhoudfr.cfm?taal=gb&am...

Of course, if you have a specific seal you have seen it may be worth cannibalising that assuming its not moulded to the door aperture. Could you perhaps fit the seal to the door rather than body? Not sure things would be any easier though!

How are the doors constructed - I presume they are framed rather than frameless? If they have similarities to a production door, i'd make as much use of the joggle/geometry and trim as you possibly can.

What level of detail are you modelling the car to?

ahhh yes rivscrews - that is a good idea.

"assuming its not moulded to the door aperture". Bingo - The one I've been able to get a proper look at is on the wife's Celica, which is moulded. I've seen it on other cars with a similar seal but haven't found anyone willing to let me pull their car apart for a proper look

The doors will be framed, as they are going to need to include a large section of the roof to make entry and exit easier. The car has changed quite dramatically since the pic in my profile, since I decided to go 3 seater and alter the basic cabin the new position didn't really suit the old shape, which I wasn't totally happy with anyway, then the engine changed, then the...... you get the idea! It now looks nothing like the profile pic, more a cross between a concept car and a lemans style.

To start with I was just going to get a basic body shape that I could mill, but started to rather enjoy the CAD side so carried on. With the constant delays on getting the workshop planning and me no chance to start physical work, plus investigating semi-monocoque I'm now heading into virtual creation of the car.

Edited by Davi on Wednesday 19th September 09:03

[grahambell]

Hi Davi,

As moulding a lip is too complex, how about making a lip by bonding/riveting some alloy angle round the aperture and using the sort of seal used for boot lids?

[Davi]

That's the back up plan Graham, if I can't find a suitable seal I'll be doing just that. I'm trying to keep the lines as clean as possible at the moment, partly from an aesthetic point of view but also from the access side, which I want to keep as uninterrupted as possible. (LOL - as possible as it can be in a car I'll probably need a winch to get in and out of )

Edited by Davi on Wednesday 19th September 10:17

[egomeister]

grahambell said:

Hi Davi,

As moulding a lip is too complex, how about making a lip by bonding/riveting some alloy angle round the aperture and using the sort of seal used for boot lids?

Surely this would be pretty difficult to achieve unless the door aperture was pretty much planar?

[Silent1]

The door seals on a VX220 are stuck on rather than over a lip so it may be worth speaking to lotus?

[Davi]

Silent1 said:

The door seals on a VX220 are stuck on rather than over a lip so it may be worth speaking to lotus?

worth a look! ta.

[nala]

Hi,
Try this site, they were very helpful when I used them.
http://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/bbCMS/shopping.asp?in...