Letting a member of staff go
Discussion
We are due to take over a running business in the next month or so (if we can get our finances sorted out!!) and have a problem with one of the staff.
As we are effectivily heavily financing the sale so we need to reduce the staff numbers if we are to stay in business.
There is one member of staff who has been working with the company for 4 years, not the best employee by any means and certainly not someone I would have hired as he has an extremely bad attitude. We have been at the brunt of this guys attitude when we visited the business as a customer.
The other member of staff is a young lad, who has completed two months of work.
How can we effectively let these guys go? What will it cost us? Are there any legal obligations we need to adhere to?
As far as I know they are all on standard type contracts.
Any help would be gratefully received, thanks.
As we are effectivily heavily financing the sale so we need to reduce the staff numbers if we are to stay in business.
There is one member of staff who has been working with the company for 4 years, not the best employee by any means and certainly not someone I would have hired as he has an extremely bad attitude. We have been at the brunt of this guys attitude when we visited the business as a customer.
The other member of staff is a young lad, who has completed two months of work.
How can we effectively let these guys go? What will it cost us? Are there any legal obligations we need to adhere to?
As far as I know they are all on standard type contracts.
Any help would be gratefully received, thanks.
Im no expert, but basics as I understand it....
The young lad isnt AFAIK, entitled to anything, just his contractual notice period (1 month?)
The other chap is entitled to 1 weeks pay for each complete year of service (again iirc the statuatory cap/minimum is about £310 pw).
Then you also have to consider the PILON (payment in luei of notice) payments and is where I got confused recently. If he doesnt work out his notice period you can take the unworked amount off his redundancy payment (I think?). Best take some advice.
You cant make someone's job redundant then re employ someone in the same position (Im guessing there must be a time scale to this, but certainly cant do it immediately)
An expert will be along soon to tell me Im wrong, but until then Im the best you've got
The young lad isnt AFAIK, entitled to anything, just his contractual notice period (1 month?)
The other chap is entitled to 1 weeks pay for each complete year of service (again iirc the statuatory cap/minimum is about £310 pw).
Then you also have to consider the PILON (payment in luei of notice) payments and is where I got confused recently. If he doesnt work out his notice period you can take the unworked amount off his redundancy payment (I think?). Best take some advice.
You cant make someone's job redundant then re employ someone in the same position (Im guessing there must be a time scale to this, but certainly cant do it immediately)
An expert will be along soon to tell me Im wrong, but until then Im the best you've got
You've got no right to dismiss the "4 years service", as his employment rights are preserved within the takeover. If he has an "attitude problem", then you need to keep on top of him, and discipline him in accordance with employmenlaw. He'll probably get the hint, and look to leave. However, there aren't grounds for dismissal of him, in accordance with what you say.
The other chap doesn't have employment rights, so just give him notice in accordance with his contract, or statute, if there is no written contract of employment, on grounds of redudancy. (Restructuring the business in accordance with the business needs). This wouldn't wash with the chap who has been there 4 years, so don't even think of trying this with that guy!
nb This is not formal legal advice, just an opinion as to a way of dealing with the situation. For comprehensive advice, then formally consult a solicitor
The other chap doesn't have employment rights, so just give him notice in accordance with his contract, or statute, if there is no written contract of employment, on grounds of redudancy. (Restructuring the business in accordance with the business needs). This wouldn't wash with the chap who has been there 4 years, so don't even think of trying this with that guy!
nb This is not formal legal advice, just an opinion as to a way of dealing with the situation. For comprehensive advice, then formally consult a solicitor
If you're purchasing a business then the existing employees are covered by TUPE transfer rules.
Use google for a clearer explaination, but their existing contracts have to remain unchanged and redundancy can then be the subject of an unfair dismissal claim in an employment tribunal:
Under TUPE
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is the transfer itself,or a reason connected with the transfer that is not for an ETO reason. Automatically unfair under the unfair dismissal legislation.
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is not the transfer itself, but is a reason connected with the transfer that is for an ETO reason. Potentially fair subject to the normal test of reasonableness under the unfair dismissal legislation.
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is entirely unconnected with the transfer. These fall outside TUPE as they are unrelated to a relevant transfer and the usual unfair dismissal principles will apply. This is the case even though the dismissals may be made around the time of such a transfer.
Use google for a clearer explaination, but their existing contracts have to remain unchanged and redundancy can then be the subject of an unfair dismissal claim in an employment tribunal:
Under TUPE
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is the transfer itself,or a reason connected with the transfer that is not for an ETO reason. Automatically unfair under the unfair dismissal legislation.
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is not the transfer itself, but is a reason connected with the transfer that is for an ETO reason. Potentially fair subject to the normal test of reasonableness under the unfair dismissal legislation.
Dismissals for which the sole or principal reason is entirely unconnected with the transfer. These fall outside TUPE as they are unrelated to a relevant transfer and the usual unfair dismissal principles will apply. This is the case even though the dismissals may be made around the time of such a transfer.
Edited by apguy on Tuesday 23 October 13:38
I've done all this in the past, and even let go a 'director' on a service contact - very expensive!. I suggest that you send a copy of one of their employee contracts to your Commericial Solicitor (a dept that specialises with employment law will be best), spend the £200 it costs them to read up on it and tell you your legal position. You need to be clear that these positions really are redundant, before going ahead otherwsie the redundant parties may have some comeback, then you just need to get on with it.
I suggest that if this employee has attitude, that you let them go immediately paying them their notice and legal redundancy, otherwise they will be very disruptive.
I'm assuming here that you are a 'small' company otherwise there may have to be a consultation process, but your solicitor will advise you on this.
This type of exercise always costs money short term.
AND DON'T FORGET ABOUT THE POTENTIAL MORALE IMAPCT WITH THE REMAINING EMPLOYEES - some of them may not like this and choose to leave shortly afterwards as they think the company is going downhill - DON'T UNDERESTIMATE THIS - Often you can loose your best staff first!
davidy
I suggest that if this employee has attitude, that you let them go immediately paying them their notice and legal redundancy, otherwise they will be very disruptive.
I'm assuming here that you are a 'small' company otherwise there may have to be a consultation process, but your solicitor will advise you on this.
This type of exercise always costs money short term.
AND DON'T FORGET ABOUT THE POTENTIAL MORALE IMAPCT WITH THE REMAINING EMPLOYEES - some of them may not like this and choose to leave shortly afterwards as they think the company is going downhill - DON'T UNDERESTIMATE THIS - Often you can loose your best staff first!
davidy
There are other ways.... if the roles are really redundant, pay up, but if it's just that this guy is useless, give him a formal written warning, put him on a formal performance plan and review weekly. Repeat the warning each week he doesn't meet your standards. After 3 warnings (IIRC) you can fire him, no redundancy, just contractual notice plus holiday accrued.
You may find he leaves anyway when he realises he's being reviewed every week. Just be fair - he may improve, then you also have the accrued business experience.
You may find he leaves anyway when he realises he's being reviewed every week. Just be fair - he may improve, then you also have the accrued business experience.
RichBurley said:
You've got no right to dismiss the "4 years service", as his employment rights are preserved within the takeover. If he has an "attitude problem", then you need to keep on top of him, and discipline him in accordance with employmenlaw. He'll probably get the hint, and look to leave. However, there aren't grounds for dismissal of him, in accordance with what you say.
The other chap doesn't have employment rights, so just give him notice in accordance with his contract, or statute, if there is no written contract of employment, on grounds of redudancy. (Restructuring the business in accordance with the business needs). This wouldn't wash with the chap who has been there 4 years, so don't even think of trying this with that guy!
nb This is not formal legal advice, just an opinion as to a way of dealing with the situation. For comprehensive advice, then formally consult a solicitor
RichThe other chap doesn't have employment rights, so just give him notice in accordance with his contract, or statute, if there is no written contract of employment, on grounds of redudancy. (Restructuring the business in accordance with the business needs). This wouldn't wash with the chap who has been there 4 years, so don't even think of trying this with that guy!
nb This is not formal legal advice, just an opinion as to a way of dealing with the situation. For comprehensive advice, then formally consult a solicitor
Intresting rider in an attempt to exclude liability!
Nick
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