Speeding through roadworks

[anonymous-user]

Most of the posters on here are supposedly into safespeed and i wholeheartely agree with that.

What are your views on speed camera's in roadworks on the motorway's ? Do you think they are there for the goverment revenue raising machine ? or do you ever give a thought to the lads who have to run accross 3 lanes of traffic with a big metal sign on their back's trying to see tomorrow morning without being hit ?

There are now 50mph specs camera's on the M60 at Denton/Manchester due to the amount of fatalities at this location but most of them we're either drunk or drugged.

Would you prefer 3 points etc off a safety cam there to protect the safety of roadworkers or dead/drugged up drivers?

Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 9th November 00:15

[safespeed]

http://www.safespeed.org.uk/trl595.html

The largest ever study of UK motorway roadworks safety associated speed cameras with INCREASES in crashes and INCREASES in crash severity.

Then they tried to hide the report.

[GreenV8S]

I'd rather have drivers watching out for road workers (and each other) than staring at the speedo and looking for cameras.

[Parrot of Doom]

speedyguy said:

There are now 50mph specs camera's on the M60 at Denton/Manchester due to the amount of fatalities at this location but most of them we're either drunk or drugged.

Because its a massive long wide straight section of motorway leading to a very tight corner around which 70mph tbh is far too fast.

Cameras isn't the way to solve it though. Stick a Volvo on a bridge before the bend, that'll make people think.

[safespeed]

GreenV8S said:

I'd rather have drivers watching out for road workers (and each other) than staring at the speedo and looking for cameras.

Not only that but the best science available agrees with you.

[supermono]

I find my attention drawn equally between looking for cameras (not camera's, silly) and roadworkers (roadworker's? lol), so far I've only ever seen cameras.

When does the work get done?

SM

[Marcellus]

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

[TonyHetherington]

I really am going to hate myself for saying this, I really am....but...

...the one thing you can say that specs cameras does through roadworks is slow people down.

Of course, the whole time you're watching your speed (on the M1 for 10 flippin miles!), and you end up stuck in people's blind spots for long periods of time because everyone's doing 50mph, so you constantly have to vary your speed so you're not in their blind spot.

What confuses me though is now and then a car comes blasting through. I can only assume not properly registered?!

[dan1981]

RE: the specs cameras in roadworks.

Read a very interesting piece about them the other day.

Apparently they only cover one lane each. and if you change between lanes then they can't record you for speeding.

However the problems (for us) occur as there are numerous cameras. so there is no way to know which cameras are entry cameras (record your speed as you enter "the zone&quot and which are exit cameras (record your speed as you leave "the zone&quot and which ones cover which lanes.

So for example if there are 6 cameras 3 are entrance cameras and three are exit cameras - they each cover one of the available lanes.

So i think the people that speed through the roadworks are simply taking a chance that they will change lanes and hopefully avoid either the exit camera or the entrance camera, and not inadvertantly trigger the same two.

Bit of a risk if you ask me..... unless you have inside info...... or an incorrectly registered car!

(re-read this and am not completly sure that it makes any sense the way i have written it!)

[supermono]

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

Shocking. Did that accident happen because someone was doing 50mph in a 40 or some other reason -- poor attention, lane discipline, mechanical, debris, etc, etc. According to DFT there are many many reasons for crashing more likely than speeding.

SM

Edited by supermono on Friday 9th November 09:47

[Marcellus]

supermono said:

Shocking. Did that accident happen because someone was doing 50mph in a 40?

SM

It was well before the world of cameras that we live in (c1990) and when asked the question to estimate the other drivers speed at the time all I could say was "I was doing 69.5mph officer and he came up on me like a bat out of hell"......he went past me didn't realise that the car in front of him wasn't/couldn't get out of his way or underestimated it's speed, slammed on the brakes, swerved into the cones and hit half a dozen workers.

[esselte]

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

So no matter what else you do,so long as you drive within the speed limit you won't have an accident...?

[TonyHetherington]

Marcellus said:

supermono said:

Shocking. Did that accident happen because someone was doing 50mph in a 40?

SM

It was well before the world of cameras that we live in (c1990) and when asked the question to estimate the other drivers speed at the time all I could say was "I was doing 69.5mph officer and he came up on me like a bat out of hell"......he went past me didn't realise that the car in front of him wasn't/couldn't get out of his way or underestimated it's speed, slammed on the brakes, swerved into the cones and hit half a dozen workers.

Out of curiosity, do you know what the result of that prosecution was? Sounds like driving without dure care and attention or up to dangerous driving?!

[Marcellus]

esselte said:

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

So no matter what else you do,so long as you drive within the speed limit you won't have an accident...?

That's not what I said....you can have an accident without causing injury...in roadworks if you do have an accident you are less likely to injure a roadworker if you are travelling within the speed limit.

[esselte]

Marcellus said:

esselte said:

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

So no matter what else you do,so long as you drive within the speed limit you won't have an accident...?

That's not what I said....you can have an accident without causing injury...in roadworks if you do have an accident you are less likely to injure a roadworker if you are travelling within the speed limit.

So hit a roadworker st 50 and you won't cause injury......I still can't see it......Obviously what I'm getting at is the "I stick to the speed limit so I'm OK" sort of thinking....

Edited by esselte on Friday 9th November 10:29

[Marcellus]

esselte said:

Marcellus said:

esselte said:

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

So no matter what else you do,so long as you drive within the speed limit you won't have an accident...?

That's not what I said....you can have an accident without causing injury...in roadworks if you do have an accident you are less likely to injure a roadworker if you are travelling within the speed limit.

So hit a roadworker st 50 and you won't cause injury......I still can't see it......

again as I said "less likely"......if you're at 50mph and in a situation where you're likely to hit a worker you are more likely with modern braking systems to get to a very low speed before impact..whereas if you are in the same situation at 70mph you are less likely to.

SO as per my initial response to the OPs question - Yes

[GreenV8S]

Marcellus said:

if you're at 50mph and in a situation where you're likely to hit a worker you are more likely with modern braking systems to get to a very low speed before impact..whereas if you are in the same situation at 70mph you are less likely to.

Or to put it another way - driving substantially too fast for the circumstances and then losing control is very dangerous and puts everyone around you at risk.

Being alert, driving at an appropriate speed for the circumstances and slowing as necessary to deal with hazards enables you to drive safely and responsibly.

Compliance with the speed limit is almost entirely irrelevant. However, if the driver abdicates responsibility for choosing the appropriate speed to a number on a stick they are likely to stop managing the speed themselves and less likely to slow down below the limit when necessary. It seems inevitable to me that this philosophy would lead to convoys of zombie drivers and increased levels of frustration and risk. It's a horrifying prospect. Drivers should be encouraged to be more involved and alert, not less.

[Big Fat F'r]

supermono said:

Marcellus said:

as I enter the road works I set my cruise control & speed limiter to the posted limit whether I know there are cameras in there or not.

I do this as a result of witnessing an accident where several roadworkers were mown down.

May take me longer (nanosecond) to get to my destination but I will without causing injury.

Shocking. Did that accident happen because someone was doing 50mph in a 40 or some other reason -- poor attention, lane discipline, mechanical, debris, etc, etc. According to DFT there are many many reasons for crashing more likely than speeding.

SM

Edited by supermono on Friday 9th November 09:47

Possibly a multitude of reasons.

The best science available recognises that speed is a multiplier of errors.

BFF

[oldsoak]

safespeed said:

Not only that but the best science available agrees with you.

"The best science" also once advocated that the earth was round and that the sun revolved around the earth...

Unfortunately best science or no..there are many who ignore arbitrary numbers on a stick, many more (so it seems) can't even be bothered to slow down where a 'so-called' speed camera is operating and end up with a fine and 3 points off their licence.
Remove the cameras and stick a 'volvo' in plain sight (as has been advocated) may well deter some, but it would also tie up a traffic unit for the duration when their time could be more productively spent elsewhere.

With the amount of ongoing roadworks there are, if a 'Volvo' was tasked to babysit all of them the BiB would need more cars(and personnel) than they have now.
Perhaps a life sized fold-away plywood cut-out model of a Volvo could be deployed and on occasion the 'real deal' left in its place to ward off complacency (as is practiced in such countries as Turkey)....who knows?

My personal take' on this subject is that to slow down and obey the number painted on the sign for a mile or so is no biggy, and may help save someone's life.
A lot of us donate blood regularly and/or carry donor cards to help save lives...perhaps we should also donate a few mph to the 'cause' as well on occasion...but until that day dawns perhaps the camera should remain to remind us to slow down or to punish those who either don't give a damn or can't be bothered to slow down.

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

I find the sign's that show what speed you doing more effective. as some times you just don't relise what speed you doing. and I'm more likely to slow down if this is pointed out, and not just have a double flash, which is only going to piss me off. the whole Idea is to get people to slow down. if you don't know about SPEC's then this is not going to happen. as they don't even flash, your only going to find out when you get a letter in the post.

Road works is one place I allways do slow down.

Also the other problem with SPEC's if you stuck in traffic at 10MPH for a while you know you can floor it till the next spec, as you know your av speed will still be less then the posted limit. most car's have a av speed on the dash you can re-set after each camera, so you can make the most out of each section.

Also im sure the bit about changing lanes is false, I think it's only valid you you change to a lane that does not have a camera. I'm sure at each section your just get log on the computers database and then compared to the section before. I'm sure a multi million pound system is not going to be fooled by you changing lanes.