Dutton or Robin Hood
Discussion
Guys,
Looking for my first kit car as a "fun" car for the occasional drive and a few track days.
My budget is around £3k although i don't necessarily want to spend that whole amount....
Option 1 - Dutton Phaeton S2 with 1600 crossflow - will this still feel a nippy wee car, i'm hung up on the engine size.....
Option 2 - Robin Hood with a 2.1 pinto or similar - reviews for the RH's aren't great, is it unfair or justified?
Option 3 - Phaeton V8, will this actually be much quicker than the 1600 due to the weight? My head says this isn't the smart option but my heart says "want one"... always loved the V8 noise!
Obviously the Duttons have the benefit of being around the £2k mark as opposed to £3k for the RH.......
Any advice appreciated,
Cheers
Chris
Looking for my first kit car as a "fun" car for the occasional drive and a few track days.
My budget is around £3k although i don't necessarily want to spend that whole amount....
Option 1 - Dutton Phaeton S2 with 1600 crossflow - will this still feel a nippy wee car, i'm hung up on the engine size.....
Option 2 - Robin Hood with a 2.1 pinto or similar - reviews for the RH's aren't great, is it unfair or justified?
Option 3 - Phaeton V8, will this actually be much quicker than the 1600 due to the weight? My head says this isn't the smart option but my heart says "want one"... always loved the V8 noise!
Obviously the Duttons have the benefit of being around the £2k mark as opposed to £3k for the RH.......
Any advice appreciated,
Cheers
Chris
Try these guys:
http://invisionfree.com/forums/Dutton_Forums/
For that money I would strongly suggest going for something like the Dutton. £3k will get you a very nice Phaeton. Weight is 650-700kgs IIRC.
The early series 1 Phaetons and the B-Type and Malaga before them have four link coil spring rear axles like the majority of seven replicas. The later cars are both heavier and cart sprung.
To be honest I wouldn't get either. I'd look at a Sylva Leader (like I've got
) as a relatively hardcore fun car in the same vein as the Dutton or perhaps a GTM Rossa K3 as an everday sportscar. The Leader is almost as 'challenging' to look at as the Dutton, but has a much better suspension setup, lower weight and generally better chassis design thanks to the legendary Jeremy Phillips.
http://invisionfree.com/forums/Dutton_Forums/
For that money I would strongly suggest going for something like the Dutton. £3k will get you a very nice Phaeton. Weight is 650-700kgs IIRC.
The early series 1 Phaetons and the B-Type and Malaga before them have four link coil spring rear axles like the majority of seven replicas. The later cars are both heavier and cart sprung.
To be honest I wouldn't get either. I'd look at a Sylva Leader (like I've got
) as a relatively hardcore fun car in the same vein as the Dutton or perhaps a GTM Rossa K3 as an everday sportscar. The Leader is almost as 'challenging' to look at as the Dutton, but has a much better suspension setup, lower weight and generally better chassis design thanks to the legendary Jeremy Phillips.LocoBlade said:
Furyous said:
Dont forget the x flow is a very tuneable engine.
Up to 170 bhp is relatively attainable.
...although in this case you'd end up owning an engine costing more than the car itself Up to 170 bhp is relatively attainable.
Friend of mine had a Dutton years back, biggest heap of...... chassis with welding a five year old could have done better. I'm amazed any are still around.
Robin Hood everytime.
LocoBlade said:
Furyous said:
Dont forget the x flow is a very tuneable engine.
Up to 170 bhp is relatively attainable.
...although in this case you'd end up owning an engine costing more than the car itself Up to 170 bhp is relatively attainable.
...by a factor of about 5, if we are talking about Duttons 
A genuine 170bhp is far from easy to achieve on a crossflow, and if you did you probably wouldn't want to drive it on the road.
It is a good engine (much better than the Pintos you'll find in most Robin Hoods), but unless you have a big budget and don't mind something with terrible road manners, about 125bhp, maybe 135bhp on the outside, is a more sensible aspiration.
I can only comment on Robin Hoods, as I built one (now sold). Mine was a Series 1 Sierra-based car, not one of the later "Exmo" models or the type with the dreadful sliding pillar front suspension (both best avoided). They can be good cars IF enough thought/skill/money went into the build. Unfortunately too many people were taken in by the notion that you could get one one the road for a couple of thousand. Whilst it was technically possible, the end result would be pretty poor. The result of this is that many of the cars don't look too good, which has had a knock-on effect on reputation and value. However, a really well built car that has cost circa £6-7K to build could be a good buy. The problem that you'll have is that it will be hard to find one of the better Robin Hoods within your budget. I sold mine for the full asking price of £4750 to the first person that came to see it. If you get one for £3K, you can expect it to be a bit rough around the edges.
Someone on another thread said its not impossible to build a decent hood but its not easy, the trouble is they attract the low end budget builder meaning, people tend to shove the cheapest ford pinto they can find , add some dodgy sierra 90000 mile drive train and suspension and generally the whole cars are put together on a budget , so tend to get scorned upon or looked down upon by people who have a preference for other makes.This is really a bit unfair. Now I should start by saying I could afford to go and get a dudey new Caterham fairly high spec, but at the time of looking by chance a very cheap s7 mk3 came up through a friend so I bought it on a whim. It was a prebuilt S7 with inboard front suspension and stainless steel monocoque (they stopped making it because it cost too much to manaufacture...mmm)and oh my word the corners that were cut by the original builder,but the amount work required to build the thing I am not surprised, I am actually shocked in retrospect how well it drove considering. I am now in the process of a complete rebuild and I must say the fundamental design of this particular hood is very very good. But nearly £6000 of caterham parts later and you start to appreciate that whilst the fundamentals are all there it isn't cheap to get them right in fact they will cost you the same as dax or caterham in the end.You will have a lot of pleasure with one Before I started the rebuild I had a cosworth motor in it and used to go for fundrives evry single night it was that much fun.Fun comes with a price and the price is you do or may have to overcome a lot of engineering shortfalls yourself, but this is the fun after all!!!mine is now ridiculously strong as wide as csr track wise , has a super light k series motor radiator wow this is a light engine. Handling is tuned by me for me and thats is the beauty of these cars you can re engineer everything pick up points damper length, spring height/ride height,steering rack, torsion bars , engine location , gearbox location , rose joints ,corner weighting it can all be done. Does it come out of the box like that? perhaps; it is upto you what you do with it.. good luck hope this helps
IMO the fundamental problem with Hoods is their poor design and lack of engineering, which is then compounded by cheap and unskilled builds. With enough money, time and skill a reasonable car can be built, but it's better idea to start off with a sound design.
That said the new Zero appears to be light years ahead of the 2B and the older monocoques.
That said the new Zero appears to be light years ahead of the 2B and the older monocoques.
Mr2Mike said:
IMO the fundamental problem with Hoods is their poor design and lack of engineering, which is then compounded by cheap and unskilled builds.
Don't hold back, tell us what you really think Have to be honest, I haven't heard anyone with a good word to say about the older RH designs and whatsmore, they're usually into quite decent Striker money and that (in contrast) seems to be genuinely regarded as one of the best handling 'sevens out there. The Duttons make more sense being also rather flawed, but atleast better value.
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