PG 9 Prohibitions- Do you understand them?
Discussion
tonyrec said:
Just as a matter of interest, do people on here understand about PG9 Prohibitions issued by Police?
Has anyone been issued with one?
Once ive had some answers i will explain all about them if anyones interested.
I'm interested.
Can you issue a PG9 for a small plate/no plate?
Who pays for the costs?
This will be along thread and hopefully i will be able to cover all points..any questions please ask!
PG9 Prohibitions are issued by Authorised Police Officers (Mainly Trafpols) and the Vehicle Inspectorate (VI).
There are 2 basic types of Prohibition-
1)IMMEDIATE-(vehicle cannot be driven any further).
these can be issued by both Police and the VI.
2)DELAYED-(vehicle can be driven away subject to certain exemptions).
eg) to return to home address or Operating centre within the next hour (time/exact location stipulated on the form).
These are NORMALLY only issued by the VI.
The reason behind this is that when the Police Prohibit the use of a vehicle, the vehicle is usually too dangerous to drive and if a delayed was issued then it somewhat defeats the object of issue of the Prohibition in the first place.
However, the VI normally deal with Heavy Goods Vehicles which are carrying loads of all descrptions and they can delay the Prohibition mainly to protect the load (perishable goods etc).
Prohibtions can be given to basically any class of vehicle- but to save time on here, just about all vehicles on the road are covered.
Showmans vehicles - Articulated vehicles normally seen transporting fun fair equipment are exempt from annual testing but if given a Prohibition for a defect, then this brings the pains on for the owner because it then needs to be taken to the local Goods Vehicle Testing Station for a FULL test...once the fault has been repaired.
The types of defects that can lead to vehicles being given a PG9 range from, an insecure battery, defective tyre, insecure seats/doors right through to brake/steering defects.
Nearly everything is covered BUT a degree of common sense needs to be applied. Im sure that everyone would be annoyed if their vehicle was taken off the road for one defective tyre or an Insecure Battery?
The vehicle can be issued with a PG9 and the driver can be given a Verbal Warning for the offences or dealt with by way of Summons or Fixed Penalty Notice.
The main thing from the Police point of view is that THERE IS NO RIGHT OF APPEAL WHATSOEVER IN REGARD TO THE ISSUE OF THE PROHIBITION. (Police decision is Final)
Once the PG9 has been issued then the vehicle must be lifted away from the scene (front/rear or total lift)which will be specified on the form. It cant be towed.
To get it removed, the faults must be fixed, the vehicle re MOTd, then the PG9 form together with the new MOT must be taken to a Police Station where a PG10 will be issued (Removal of Prohibition).
Vehicle can now be driven.
Slightly different procedure for removal in regard to HGV/PSVs which are dealt with totally by the Goods Vehicle Testing Station.
If however, the owner wants to sell the vehicle with the PG9 still in place.....he can do this BUT he must inform the new owner that the vehicle is subject to a Prohibition.
Consequently, if he decides that to repair the vehicle would be too costly and he wishes to have the vehicle scrapped, then the Prohibtion effectively "dies " with the vehicle and no further action is needed.
There is also an Offence in place for driving a vehicle that is subject to a PG9......
It is Driving In Contravention of a Prohibition, (Sec 71(1)RTA 1988), which itself carries large fines at the local Court.
Also, if the defect is Dangerous (no brakes etc) and you are stopped driving the vehicle and the original form was given to you,then you could be liable to arrest.....Sec 25 PACE, to prevent you causing injury to yourself or others.
The issue of these Prohibitions is extremely popular in London because more than half of the Traffic Police are trained and therefore Authorised to issue them compared to our colleagues in the County forces.
Sorry that this is long winded, but in a nutshell this is it.
If there are any question please ask!
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 3rd July 17:49
PG9 Prohibitions are issued by Authorised Police Officers (Mainly Trafpols) and the Vehicle Inspectorate (VI).
There are 2 basic types of Prohibition-
1)IMMEDIATE-(vehicle cannot be driven any further).
these can be issued by both Police and the VI.
2)DELAYED-(vehicle can be driven away subject to certain exemptions).
eg) to return to home address or Operating centre within the next hour (time/exact location stipulated on the form).
These are NORMALLY only issued by the VI.
The reason behind this is that when the Police Prohibit the use of a vehicle, the vehicle is usually too dangerous to drive and if a delayed was issued then it somewhat defeats the object of issue of the Prohibition in the first place.
However, the VI normally deal with Heavy Goods Vehicles which are carrying loads of all descrptions and they can delay the Prohibition mainly to protect the load (perishable goods etc).
Prohibtions can be given to basically any class of vehicle- but to save time on here, just about all vehicles on the road are covered.
Showmans vehicles - Articulated vehicles normally seen transporting fun fair equipment are exempt from annual testing but if given a Prohibition for a defect, then this brings the pains on for the owner because it then needs to be taken to the local Goods Vehicle Testing Station for a FULL test...once the fault has been repaired.
The types of defects that can lead to vehicles being given a PG9 range from, an insecure battery, defective tyre, insecure seats/doors right through to brake/steering defects.
Nearly everything is covered BUT a degree of common sense needs to be applied. Im sure that everyone would be annoyed if their vehicle was taken off the road for one defective tyre or an Insecure Battery?
The vehicle can be issued with a PG9 and the driver can be given a Verbal Warning for the offences or dealt with by way of Summons or Fixed Penalty Notice.
The main thing from the Police point of view is that THERE IS NO RIGHT OF APPEAL WHATSOEVER IN REGARD TO THE ISSUE OF THE PROHIBITION. (Police decision is Final)
Once the PG9 has been issued then the vehicle must be lifted away from the scene (front/rear or total lift)which will be specified on the form. It cant be towed.
To get it removed, the faults must be fixed, the vehicle re MOTd, then the PG9 form together with the new MOT must be taken to a Police Station where a PG10 will be issued (Removal of Prohibition).
Vehicle can now be driven.
Slightly different procedure for removal in regard to HGV/PSVs which are dealt with totally by the Goods Vehicle Testing Station.
If however, the owner wants to sell the vehicle with the PG9 still in place.....he can do this BUT he must inform the new owner that the vehicle is subject to a Prohibition.
Consequently, if he decides that to repair the vehicle would be too costly and he wishes to have the vehicle scrapped, then the Prohibtion effectively "dies " with the vehicle and no further action is needed.
There is also an Offence in place for driving a vehicle that is subject to a PG9......
It is Driving In Contravention of a Prohibition, (Sec 71(1)RTA 1988), which itself carries large fines at the local Court.
Also, if the defect is Dangerous (no brakes etc) and you are stopped driving the vehicle and the original form was given to you,then you could be liable to arrest.....Sec 25 PACE, to prevent you causing injury to yourself or others.
The issue of these Prohibitions is extremely popular in London because more than half of the Traffic Police are trained and therefore Authorised to issue them compared to our colleagues in the County forces.
Sorry that this is long winded, but in a nutshell this is it.
If there are any question please ask!
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 3rd July 17:49
tonyrec said:So does the vehicle have to be taken to the Police Station rather than driven i.e. has to be transported but not towed?
To get it removed, the faults must be fixed, the vehicle re MOTd, then the PG9 form together with the new MOT must be taken to a Police Station where a PG10 will be issued (Removal of Prohibition).
Vehicle can now be driven.
Oh, and thanks for the explaination.
tonyrec said:
Showmans vehicles - Articulated vehicles normally seen transporting fun fair equipment are exempt from annual testing but if given a Prohibition for a defect, then this brings the pains on for the owner because it then needs to be taken to the local Goods Vehicle Testing Station for a FULL test...once the fault has been repaired.
Why are they exempt? They are usually ancient old wagons - surely they should be tested more regularly than normal, rather than not at all?
>> Edited by miniman on Thursday 3rd July 17:33
Jeremy,
The actual vehicle does not have to be taken to the Police Station......only the Original PG9 form and the new MOT.
The rules actually say that the only time that you can drive a vehicle with a Prohibition in force is when you are going to the Police Station directly to get the PG9 removed.
The actual vehicle does not have to be taken to the Police Station......only the Original PG9 form and the new MOT.
The rules actually say that the only time that you can drive a vehicle with a Prohibition in force is when you are going to the Police Station directly to get the PG9 removed.
Thx for that tony, saw this once on one of those police stop things. They pulled over a dodgy looking taxi on its way to Heathrow gave him a PG9 and the Peruvian passenger was turfed out on to the street....get this, he still paid the taxi driver...I know what I would've given him....
all
all
Im stunned that no one has heard of this before...to be honest (as i always am), its the most useful tool in the Trafpols box....and if im more honest than i should be its great for squareing up the real tw**s and getting their cars off the road for a while. 
Deltaf......can you now tell that im totally relaxed?
I would think that the only way that you would get one for a battery is if you question his/her parentage!
keep smiling mate.
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 3rd July 19:36
Deltaf......can you now tell that im totally relaxed?
I would think that the only way that you would get one for a battery is if you question his/her parentage!
keep smiling mate.
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 3rd July 19:36
tonyrec said:
Im stunned that no one has heard of this before
I think it's like you say, this perhaps isn't very common in more rural area's. I've certainly not heard of anyone I know receiving one.
I can see that you check battery security etc. quite easily, but how would you check for e.g. defective brakes? Looking at the disks may show them to be excessively worn, but something like defective hydraulics would require driving the car to check?
Presumably something relativly minor such as a light out wouldn't be sufficient ground to issue a PG9?
Thats correct...a light out wouldnt be enough.
As regards the brakes, theres lot of things that we look for, cracked discs, excesively worn pads, no reserve travel on either the foot/hand brake and the most obvious ones are fluid leaks.
In order to be Authorised to issue PG9s we have to pass about 7 weeks of practical exams, City and Guild etc in Motor Vehicles Examinations in addition to Air Brakes Courses. This enables us to examine Lorrie and coaches as well.
When youre looking at vehicles all day long (in addition to dealing with speeders and Fatal Collisions), you get to know what to look for in a poorly maintained car.
I dont mean this to sound like "look how good iam", i just want to give you an insight into what we do and how we work.
As regards the brakes, theres lot of things that we look for, cracked discs, excesively worn pads, no reserve travel on either the foot/hand brake and the most obvious ones are fluid leaks.
In order to be Authorised to issue PG9s we have to pass about 7 weeks of practical exams, City and Guild etc in Motor Vehicles Examinations in addition to Air Brakes Courses. This enables us to examine Lorrie and coaches as well.
When youre looking at vehicles all day long (in addition to dealing with speeders and Fatal Collisions), you get to know what to look for in a poorly maintained car.
I dont mean this to sound like "look how good iam", i just want to give you an insight into what we do and how we work.
im going to! There was a clampdown on excessively tinted windows in Manchester recently. But what happens if the windows are just legal, and the driver is wearing dark sunglasses? www.manchesteronline.co.uk/news/stories/Detail_LinkStory=61376.html
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