Headlamps on cycle wings

[stig mills]

Has this been done before? Checked SVA rules and lamps that turn with the wheels seem to comply. I have made substantial wing stays and have some small haedlamp units that look great on the wings. I imagine the bulbs wouldnt last long but wondered if anyone had any experience of the same.
Thanks in anticipation for input. Stuart

Edited by stig mills on Wednesday 28th November 23:14

[groomi]

I think the biggest problem would be the vibration and vertical movement. I imagine it would dazzle oncoming drivers and not light your way brilliantly either.

However, if it's primarily a track toy and the lights are just for legality then hopefully it won't be a problem.

[Mr2Mike]

Not a great idea I reckon. Bulb life will be miniscule, the lights are likely to flicker and when your wing stays break it will attempt to rip a chunk of your wiring loom out with it.

[Sam_68]

SVA Section 9.1 said:

Check that no lamp or reflector can be moved by swivelling, deflecting or otherwise while the vehilce is in motion.

There are exemptions for headlamp dipping or beam adjustment, retractable headlamps, and for headlamps that are deflected to the side to follow the steering, but fitting a headlamp to a cycle wing that moves up and down with the suspension is definitely not acceptable.

[Russ Bost]

Stuart

I agree with Sam above, you can mount an indicator on a mudguard, providing it is "by design" & it can move with the turning wheels, but headlamps can only move for the purpose of adjustment or, if retractable, to retract. Have to say the way the Manual is written it's clear as mud!

[skwdenyer]

Sam_68 said:

SVA Section 9.1 said:

Check that no lamp or reflector can be moved by swivelling, deflecting or otherwise while the vehilce is in motion.

There are exemptions for headlamp dipping or beam adjustment, retractable headlamps, and for headlamps that are deflected to the side to follow the steering, but fitting a headlamp to a cycle wing that moves up and down with the suspension is definitely not acceptable.

Russ Bost said:

I agree with Sam above, you can mount an indicator on a mudguard, providing it is "by design" & it can move with the turning wheels, but headlamps can only move for the purpose of adjustment or, if retractable, to retract. Have to say the way the Manual is written it's clear as mud!

I'm a little unclear (but I don't have the manual) - what is the datum against which vertical deflection is measured? If relative to the road, by definition headlamps attached to cycle wings won't deflect vertically.

To the OP, if you just want the headlamps there for aesthetics, why not just mount auxiliary driving lights onto the cycle wings, and use some sort of "pop out" system for the headlights as per the LCC Rocket?

[Vindi_andy]

Russ Bost said:

Stuart

I agree with Sam above, you can mount an indicator on a mudguard, providing it is "by design" & it can move with the turning wheels, but headlamps can only move for the purpose of adjustment or, if retractable, to retract. Have to say the way the Manual is written it's clear as mud!

If headlamps can only move for retraction or adjustment how do the likes of ford and vauxhall get away with their headlights that move with the steering

I dont think it will be an issue but I would talk to an examiner to get his interpretation

[Mr2Mike]

Vindi_andy said:

If headlamps can only move for retraction or adjustment how do the likes of ford and vauxhall get away with their headlights that move with the steering

I dont think it will be an issue but I would talk to an examiner to get his interpretation

As Sam mentioned, they can turn to the side with the steering (my old MR2 had steering fog lamps!). They would not be permitted to move up and down with the suspension.

[stig mills]

Thanx for your input guys. I reckon its a no no then. Probably not legal and also not practical. Just trying to be different.
Happy xmas

[skwdenyer]

Mr2Mike said:

As Sam mentioned, they can turn to the side with the steering (my old MR2 had steering fog lamps!). They would not be permitted to move up and down with the suspension.

As I mentioned earlier, surely the lights would not "move up and down" - they would by definition remain a fixed distance above the road surface (assuming the suspension isn't massively under-damped)? Putting the lights on the sprung mass (i.e. the normal situation) is the only way to guarantee them to move up and down relative to the road

Furthermore I've now read The Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 and I can't see any restriction on fitting the headlights to cycle wings - certainly steering of headlights is permitted, and so long as the height restrictions are met then all should be well.

Does anybody have the SVA manual to check? I don't want to pay £37 to answer somebody else's problem

[Mr2Mike]

skwdenyer said:

As I mentioned earlier, surely the lights would not "move up and down" - they would by definition remain a fixed distance above the road surface

If by "road surface" you are only talking about that tiny bit of tarmac under the tyre then yes.

Imagine a wheel going over a bump in the road which compresses the suspension; the headlamp will not be held at a constant distance from the majority of the road surface, only that bit the tyre is passing over. The effect of this would be a flickering of the light as seen by any traffic on front of you.

[skwdenyer]

Mr2Mike said:

skwdenyer said:

As I mentioned earlier, surely the lights would not "move up and down" - they would by definition remain a fixed distance above the road surface

If by "road surface" you are only talking about that tiny bit of tarmac under the tyre then yes.

Imagine a wheel going over a bump in the road which compresses the suspension; the headlamp will not be held at a constant distance from the majority of the road surface, only that bit the tyre is passing over. The effect of this would be a flickering of the light as seen by any traffic on front of you.

In fairness, I was slightly playing devil's advocate here; I agree with you, but my point - I believe - shows that one can't disqualify headlamps on cycle wings on the grounds of not staying a fixed distance above the road (and the regs do specify a minimum and maximum height under normal loading conditions).

Anyhow, as I said, I've read what I think are the relevant regulations as regards lighting, and I cannot see anything that would prevent the OP from doing what s/he wishes to do. The issue OP's point about lamp life is important, however, unless the units are mounted in housings which decouple them (using a spring and damper, say) from any sudden vertical movement of the cycle wing assembly.