Announcement expected - mobile use is dangerous driving
Discussion
Just a heads up for PH SPL...
Announcement expected tomorrow that hand held mobile phone use at the wheel will automatically be interpreted as dangerous driving and carry a potential prison sentence. Source cannot be given, yet - if the timing is slightly out the move is looking inevitable.
Perhaps we could have a citizens' equivalent that nu labia DfT announcements are automatically interpreted as daft and carry a threat of politicians spending time inside - with their families.
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving that warrants a very serious dd charge? I'd say no, each individual case should be pursued on its merits (caution, vehicle control offence, w/o due care, dangerous driving) and that blanket policies such as this do harm by removing another of the few remaining links between driver behaviour, direct observable consequences for risk / road safety, and the law.
Announcement expected tomorrow that hand held mobile phone use at the wheel will automatically be interpreted as dangerous driving and carry a potential prison sentence. Source cannot be given, yet - if the timing is slightly out the move is looking inevitable.
Perhaps we could have a citizens' equivalent that nu labia DfT announcements are automatically interpreted as daft and carry a threat of politicians spending time inside - with their families.
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving that warrants a very serious dd charge? I'd say no, each individual case should be pursued on its merits (caution, vehicle control offence, w/o due care, dangerous driving) and that blanket policies such as this do harm by removing another of the few remaining links between driver behaviour, direct observable consequences for risk / road safety, and the law.
turbobloke said:
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving
It's a good point. Being stationary in a queue of traffic does constitute driving under legal definitions. Driving does not just constitute those periods when you are actually moving. If you pull into the side of the road with the intention of continuing your journey you are still, in most circumstances, driving.Whether being stionary in a queue of traffic would constitute dangerous driving is a matter of fact for the court to decide. My initial feeling is it would not be, although I've been wrong before. The offence of using a mobile whilst driving would be committed.
Derek Smith said:
turbobloke said:
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving
It's a good point. Being stationary in a queue of traffic does constitute driving under legal definitions. Driving does not just constitute those periods when you are actually moving. If you pull into the side of the road with the intention of continuing your journey you are still, in most circumstances, driving.Whether being stionary in a queue of traffic would constitute dangerous driving is a matter of fact for the court to decide. My initial feeling is it would not be, although I've been wrong before. The offence of using a mobile whilst driving would be committed.
goskins17 said:
Derek Smith said:
turbobloke said:
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving
It's a good point. Being stationary in a queue of traffic does constitute driving under legal definitions. Driving does not just constitute those periods when you are actually moving. If you pull into the side of the road with the intention of continuing your journey you are still, in most circumstances, driving.Whether being stionary in a queue of traffic would constitute dangerous driving is a matter of fact for the court to decide. My initial feeling is it would not be, although I've been wrong before. The offence of using a mobile whilst driving would be committed.
G51CAV said:
goskins17 said:
Derek Smith said:
turbobloke said:
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving
It's a good point. Being stationary in a queue of traffic does constitute driving under legal definitions. Driving does not just constitute those periods when you are actually moving. If you pull into the side of the road with the intention of continuing your journey you are still, in most circumstances, driving.Whether being stionary in a queue of traffic would constitute dangerous driving is a matter of fact for the court to decide. My initial feeling is it would not be, although I've been wrong before. The offence of using a mobile whilst driving would be committed.
FishFace said:
No it won't.
Would you care to expand slightly on what you mean by "it"?Are you referring to the point of the OP, that "driving" whilst on mobile will constitute DD, or to the question of whether being stationary can be construed as "driving" for this test?
Or to something else entirely?
LeoSayer said:
FFS, you know why? Because they can - because they can take a picture of you doing it, without the need for expensive traffic policeman.
Not on the phone and under the speed limit? You must be a safe driver then
Certainly safer than one who is speeding and controlling the car with one hand while holding a phone to his ear in the other.Not on the phone and under the speed limit? You must be a safe driver then
Edited by LeoSayer on Wednesday 19th December 21:23
If we could rely on Plod being given sufficient latitude to interpret " driving" in relation to this issue, And, more importantly, if we could rely on Plod to intelligently interpret this "latitude" then great. Dangerous driving though if you're on the move. No problem. People have been KILLED by this. It is serious shit.
Seems to me that the attention given to mobile phone use must be vastly out of all proportion to the actual amount of accidents it causes. If you can end up in prison for driving (possibly quite safely) with a phone, what happens to those that carry a flaming stick of tobacco whilst driving, or those that dare to tune the radio or put a CD in their head unit?
So how many people have been killed from mobile phone offences compared to say falling off ladders or sticking a knife in the toaster or accidents in the home? Frankly I don't buy into this nonsense, it's the tip of the iceberg imo. A government after propeganda. If 'they' addressed real issues like numpties causing mahem I'd listen.
Next thing you know they'll be giving 'powers' to those mini-Hitlers called 'parking attendants' who won't have to even get a photo or anything and can 'refer' your 'prosecution' for 'dangerous driving' to the 'authorities'.
Seriously, I see far worse driving on the road from people who are tailgating, driving aggressively, undertaking, dazzling oncoming traffic with fog lamps etc. None of these are deemed serious enough for even a ticket most of the time, let alone DD charges.
We really are moving into a dictatorial authoritarian era, and I hate seeing small things chipping slowly away at our 'freedoms'.
"Ah, but mobile phone use is bad!" Yes, the thin end of the wedge. "Ah, I see you've just blinked! You're not considered 'in control' of your vehicle whilst blinking!"
"You're parked up with your handbrake on and your engine off? On the phone? That'll be a Dangerous Driving charge for you then, Sir....yes, yes, I KNOW you're not moving and the car's off, but you're still deemed to be 'driving'... Prison sentence for you, m'laddo."
Is it the SOLE intention of this government to persecute the motorist so much they descend to the utter depths of despair? Why aren't they focussing on actually prosecuting people that get away with all manner of REAL crimes, such as petty shoplifting, mugging, beatings and vandalism? Why could a middle-class citizen find themselves facing a prison sentence for using a mobile phone in their car whilst someone who mugs an old lady or steals a car gets off with the equivalent of a slap on the wrists?
Something is SERIOUSLY
ed up with this country, the more I read, the more I hate this place. Great Britain? Not any more.
This country ----> Handbasket -----> Hell.
Seriously, I see far worse driving on the road from people who are tailgating, driving aggressively, undertaking, dazzling oncoming traffic with fog lamps etc. None of these are deemed serious enough for even a ticket most of the time, let alone DD charges.
We really are moving into a dictatorial authoritarian era, and I hate seeing small things chipping slowly away at our 'freedoms'.
"Ah, but mobile phone use is bad!" Yes, the thin end of the wedge. "Ah, I see you've just blinked! You're not considered 'in control' of your vehicle whilst blinking!"
"You're parked up with your handbrake on and your engine off? On the phone? That'll be a Dangerous Driving charge for you then, Sir....yes, yes, I KNOW you're not moving and the car's off, but you're still deemed to be 'driving'... Prison sentence for you, m'laddo."
Is it the SOLE intention of this government to persecute the motorist so much they descend to the utter depths of despair? Why aren't they focussing on actually prosecuting people that get away with all manner of REAL crimes, such as petty shoplifting, mugging, beatings and vandalism? Why could a middle-class citizen find themselves facing a prison sentence for using a mobile phone in their car whilst someone who mugs an old lady or steals a car gets off with the equivalent of a slap on the wrists?
Something is SERIOUSLY
ed up with this country, the more I read, the more I hate this place. Great Britain? Not any more.This country ----> Handbasket -----> Hell.
turbobloke said:
Just a heads up for PH SPL...
Announcement expected tomorrow that hand held mobile phone use at the wheel will automatically be interpreted as dangerous driving and carry a potential prison sentence. Source cannot be given, yet - if the timing is slightly out the move is looking inevitable.
Perhaps we could have a citizens' equivalent that nu labia DfT announcements are automatically interpreted as daft and carry a threat of politicians spending time inside - with their families.
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving that warrants a very serious dd charge? I'd say no, each individual case should be pursued on its merits (caution, vehicle control offence, w/o due care, dangerous driving) and that blanket policies such as this do harm by removing another of the few remaining links between driver behaviour, direct observable consequences for risk / road safety, and the law.
I call BSAnnouncement expected tomorrow that hand held mobile phone use at the wheel will automatically be interpreted as dangerous driving and carry a potential prison sentence. Source cannot be given, yet - if the timing is slightly out the move is looking inevitable.
Perhaps we could have a citizens' equivalent that nu labia DfT announcements are automatically interpreted as daft and carry a threat of politicians spending time inside - with their families.
Does using a hand-held mobile in a stationary motorway jam queue constitute dangerous driving that warrants a very serious dd charge? I'd say no, each individual case should be pursued on its merits (caution, vehicle control offence, w/o due care, dangerous driving) and that blanket policies such as this do harm by removing another of the few remaining links between driver behaviour, direct observable consequences for risk / road safety, and the law.
This would be a stupid move for them as it is currently a nice simple fixed penalty with zero admin costs and a nice £60 tax contribution
If it goes immediately to a dangerous driving charge this isn't dealt with by a fixed penalty offence so therefore it will involve an expensive court case. They don't have the resources to turn every single person caught driving on a phone into court case.
Well unless they completely legalise the chav crimes of assault, shoplifting etc.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7153070.stm
Personally, I don't see this as "yet more control". It is merely applying a stiffer penalty to an act of complete lunacy. There is no more "control" than at present.
Personally, I don't see this as "yet more control". It is merely applying a stiffer penalty to an act of complete lunacy. There is no more "control" than at present.
Edited by Strangely Brown on Thursday 20th December 08:17
I don't see what a mobile phone has to do with it. The "new" law appears to be if the driving falls within the existing dangereous driving parameters.
In Dorset a dangerous driving charge is hard to make stick even if the driver has no licence, no insurance and is subject to an earlier ban. The fact that he killed a paper boy who was cycling at the time didn't lead to a prison sentence.
In Dorset a dangerous driving charge is hard to make stick even if the driver has no licence, no insurance and is subject to an earlier ban. The fact that he killed a paper boy who was cycling at the time didn't lead to a prison sentence.
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