Differences between harnesses
Discussion
I am going to get some harnesses in my Elise however I'm struggling to understand the differences between different harnesses / makes.
The 4 vs 5 points is easy (I'm assuming that 5 point harnesses are the ones to have rather than 4?)
I'm also happy that I need quick release on the shoulder straps and that there are some discussions around the buckles (seat belt vs aircraft types)
HOWEVER - what are the other differences I need to be aware of and what are the differences between LUKE and Schroth etc??
Many thanks for your help in this!
Miles
The 4 vs 5 points is easy (I'm assuming that 5 point harnesses are the ones to have rather than 4?)
I'm also happy that I need quick release on the shoulder straps and that there are some discussions around the buckles (seat belt vs aircraft types)
HOWEVER - what are the other differences I need to be aware of and what are the differences between LUKE and Schroth etc??
Many thanks for your help in this!
Miles
A 4-pointer is what you need, otherwise you'll have to start making mount points!
I've had a Willians Silverstone harness fitted and it had quick-release shoulder straps so that you can lean forward for oblique junctions or even exiting the pit lane.
Main issue with buckles is that strictly speaking you have to be able to do up a harness with one hand to pass an MOT. In reality very few stations will check this - turn-buckles are supposed to be two-handed in operation yet Caterhams are sold with them and regularly pass SVA tests with them fitted, too.
I've had a Willians Silverstone harness fitted and it had quick-release shoulder straps so that you can lean forward for oblique junctions or even exiting the pit lane.
Main issue with buckles is that strictly speaking you have to be able to do up a harness with one hand to pass an MOT. In reality very few stations will check this - turn-buckles are supposed to be two-handed in operation yet Caterhams are sold with them and regularly pass SVA tests with them fitted, too.
5th point is the one that comes up between your legs and unless you have a motorsport seat with a hole in the bottom, then dont bother and only get a 4 point.
I have the twist style aircraft buckle which can be a pain as you have to plug each belt into it but it looks great and works.
No real difference between brands. Just look for the strap width. Go for 3 inch width if possible as its more comfortable than the smaller 2 ".
I have the twist style aircraft buckle which can be a pain as you have to plug each belt into it but it looks great and works.
No real difference between brands. Just look for the strap width. Go for 3 inch width if possible as its more comfortable than the smaller 2 ".
Most people seem to go for these ones....
http://english.schroth.com/racing/produktdetail.ph...
There the same ones as fitted to the 2-11.
10% discount with MSAR Safety (The website doesnt seem to be working) if you join SELOC.
http://english.schroth.com/racing/produktdetail.ph...
There the same ones as fitted to the 2-11.
10% discount with MSAR Safety (The website doesnt seem to be working) if you join SELOC.
I have Schroth and am pretty happy with them, never been a fan of the Luke ones but that's just personal preference. I did however have Willans in the Landy which were much easier to use but stiffer webbing so not quite as comfy.
I'd have a think about 2" lap belts and 3" shoulder but that really depends on your physique. Quick release is a must^^^ Mr Ritson. Bolt-in over clip-in (stops em getting nicked too!!) I also like the aircraft buckle but I think that's just the child in me.
Oh yeah, DON'T EVER BUY HARNESS PADS!!!!!!!
I'd have a think about 2" lap belts and 3" shoulder but that really depends on your physique. Quick release is a must^^^ Mr Ritson. Bolt-in over clip-in (stops em getting nicked too!!) I also like the aircraft buckle but I think that's just the child in me.
Oh yeah, DON'T EVER BUY HARNESS PADS!!!!!!!
I prefer either the Schroth (Profi) or Willans (Silverstone). You want 2in lap belts and 3in shoulder straps, with a good buckle. Some of the cheaper ones are 2in all over, and have crummy seatbelt buckles with no decent quick release on the shoulder straps. Avoid.
As for the pads. I have Willans ones, and they are much more comfortable with them on the road. Nicely finished in black and white, they are entirely non-chav!
As for the pads. I have Willans ones, and they are much more comfortable with them on the road. Nicely finished in black and white, they are entirely non-chav!
I've got the Luke ones sold by Hanger 111 (and their harness bar). 3" shoulder straps and 2" lap straps. The quick release buckles work fine (easy enough for me to turn my music up/down when I want to). I bought the pads but haven't used them yet. My Harnesses are red with red pads against black/green seats in a silver car (Looks well Halfords
).
).persoanlly I would NOT use 4 point, std 3 point seatbelts are better...
if you are going to go with hernesses, 6 point are the only way forward.
I would also get ones with the buckle on the 5&6 straps, makes doing them up easier.
as for mounts for the 5&6, just extend them straps back to the rear seat frame bolts...
if you are going to go with hernesses, 6 point are the only way forward.
I would also get ones with the buckle on the 5&6 straps, makes doing them up easier.
as for mounts for the 5&6, just extend them straps back to the rear seat frame bolts...
purdy84 said:
Most people seem to go for these ones....
http://english.schroth.com/racing/produktdetail.ph...
There the same ones as fitted to the 2-11.
10% discount with MSAR Safety (The website doesnt seem to be working) if you join SELOC.
These are on my "to be bought" list for the summer / track days http://english.schroth.com/racing/produktdetail.ph...
There the same ones as fitted to the 2-11.
10% discount with MSAR Safety (The website doesnt seem to be working) if you join SELOC.
OK, in summary then:
3" shoulders and 2" lap is a good idea
Quick release
Aircraft buckles are cool but might pose a very remote risk to the MOT
Some debat about 5/6 pt vs 4 however i beliebe my MOG seats will have a hole for the crotch strap so should be able to sort 5/6 pt
Different makes will use different types of webbing which makes a difference to comfort and ease of use (I guess I'll have to try them all - hopefully they'll all be at the autosport show)
Anything I've missed?
Just some quick questions:
If I have 5/6 pt fitted can these be run as 4pt (e.g. a lady witha skirt might not want to have the crotch strap in use - would this be safe?
Are there differences between how the various makes of haness work in terms of the clip and the Quick Releases? Schrolth make a play on their flexible straps allowing either up or down tensioning (is this set once and always up or always down or more dynamic than that?)?
Thanks for all your help on this
Miles
3" shoulders and 2" lap is a good idea
Quick release
Aircraft buckles are cool but might pose a very remote risk to the MOT
Some debat about 5/6 pt vs 4 however i beliebe my MOG seats will have a hole for the crotch strap so should be able to sort 5/6 pt
Different makes will use different types of webbing which makes a difference to comfort and ease of use (I guess I'll have to try them all - hopefully they'll all be at the autosport show)
Anything I've missed?
Just some quick questions:
If I have 5/6 pt fitted can these be run as 4pt (e.g. a lady witha skirt might not want to have the crotch strap in use - would this be safe?
Are there differences between how the various makes of haness work in terms of the clip and the Quick Releases? Schrolth make a play on their flexible straps allowing either up or down tensioning (is this set once and always up or always down or more dynamic than that?)?
Thanks for all your help on this
Miles
The only purpose of the crotch strap is to stop you from "submarining" under heavy braking and front end impacts but in a lotus there is nowhere enough recline on the seats or braking force to make this even a remote possibility. It feels safer but has no real effect other than placebo. It will also when not used fall through the hole in the seat into the "special" place and join the loose change and fluffy sweets, and can be a bastard to get bach through. If you get Willans I have a pair of crotch straps you can have as I got rid of them.
Remember you'll need both left and right handed. (side the buckle's on) I've been told that the buckle has to go on the outside but I don't see what difference it makes so always put it on the inside to reduce the risk of sitting on it or slamming it in the door.
Remember you'll need both left and right handed. (side the buckle's on) I've been told that the buckle has to go on the outside but I don't see what difference it makes so always put it on the inside to reduce the risk of sitting on it or slamming it in the door.
Twin
The Schrolth (I suspect I'm having a little competition with myself to see how many ways I can spell this!) ones have the buckle on the crotch strap so if I get these I'll avoid the special place issue
In respect to the sub thing is this not in the front impact situation which is somewhat independent of braking force - however your point about the seat rake is interesting.
Thanks
Miles
The Schrolth (I suspect I'm having a little competition with myself to see how many ways I can spell this!) ones have the buckle on the crotch strap so if I get these I'll avoid the special place issue
In respect to the sub thing is this not in the front impact situation which is somewhat independent of braking force - however your point about the seat rake is interesting.
Thanks
Miles
Compare to an F1 car for example where the driver is almost horizontal and can generate massive forces under braking (OR in a frontal collision) it's possible that the driver could slither out under the harness without the crotch strap.
Ref. up or down tensioning, I think that's something you set up when fitting them. The ones that tension upwards are usually for open cockpit cars where one of the pitcrew stands on your shoulders to strap you in like the old F1 cars of the early 90's. IIRC
If you're at the autosport show you should have a look at:
Grand Prix Racewear (generally know there stuff, Schroth stockist)
Demon Thieves (Schroth stockist)
Willans
Ref. up or down tensioning, I think that's something you set up when fitting them. The ones that tension upwards are usually for open cockpit cars where one of the pitcrew stands on your shoulders to strap you in like the old F1 cars of the early 90's. IIRC
If you're at the autosport show you should have a look at:
Grand Prix Racewear (generally know there stuff, Schroth stockist)
Demon Thieves (Schroth stockist)
Willans
The other thing about 6 points is that 4pts are a serios PITA to use on the road (if you have removed the inertia reel belts). If I had 6 points, particularly that you couldn't use as 4 (ie ones that had the buckle on the crotch strap) I'd probably not bother using the car unless it was for a 30 mile trip!
Potentially good for the environment however
Potentially good for the environment however
Twin
I have a memory of reading about submarining when at university (ergonomics etc) as being a fairly common problem in "normal" car crashes with peoples ankles and shins being mixed up with the accelerator etc
As such many seats have anti sub measure built in however I can't see a carbon (ish) seat having these. However it has to be said that I'm very out of touch with all this and quite happy to bow to your greater experience etc!
I take the point about ease of use, I'm just worried about the what if (after all having trouble walking again if involved in abig crash vs. 20 seconds extra each time I get in the car...
Miles
I have a memory of reading about submarining when at university (ergonomics etc) as being a fairly common problem in "normal" car crashes with peoples ankles and shins being mixed up with the accelerator etc
As such many seats have anti sub measure built in however I can't see a carbon (ish) seat having these. However it has to be said that I'm very out of touch with all this and quite happy to bow to your greater experience etc!I take the point about ease of use, I'm just worried about the what if (after all having trouble walking again if involved in abig crash vs. 20 seconds extra each time I get in the car...
Miles
Obviously it's your decision, just bringing your attention to it really. I had 6 points and got pissed off with them so removed the crotch strap. Probably also depends what shape you are too, I imagine "rounder" people are more prone to it.
Isn't there someone local to you who has them fitted and could go have a play? There must be someone on here.
Isn't there someone local to you who has them fitted and could go have a play? There must be someone on here.
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