Sag warm-up procedures - advice needed

[puckrup]

Advice given was to keep below 2500rpm until oil temp gets to 60 degrees C. I am finding this impossible to achieve in cold weather (even today @ 12 degrees outside air temp car struggles to get above 44 degrees on open road after 30 minutes)

Heats up very quick once in slow traffic/city but as soon as you start pickup up speed on open road it drops.

What procedure should I be using? Many thanks. Neil

[Chris Marriott]

the famous question!!! The oil temp sensor sits right at the front of the car therefore on open roads at 50/60mph it will show it to be cooling due to the cool air hitting it (if that makes sense) its easier to warm the car up round slow roads then once you establish 60 degress your be fine even if it shows the temp dropping below. I asked the same question when i got my TVR last year. Enjoy

[BertBert]

You are not getting an accurate reading. The great big tank of oil is not that affected by the air rushing by it at 12 degrees. You have an oil temp reading problem.

Also there have been no empirical tests or engineering theory applied to 2500 rpm and 60 degrees oil temp. It's just the folk lore that built up around engines going bang on the first place. It's one of the first rules of avoiding liability claims on duff product development. First the manufacturer denies the problem, then they admit small numbers of failures due to any reason they can think of which is not product defect related. This is usually find some user incompetence - easy, you are abusing the engine before it is properly warm sir. After all it is a high spec/race tuned/blueprinted/hand built. Anyway that's long and cynical for don;t get too hung up over it. Clearly don't take it to the red line when cold and be nice to it. Religously watching the oil temp for 60 before going over 2500rpm is nuts.

Bert

[rpa.janwell]

puckrup said:

Advice given was to keep below 2500rpm until oil temp gets to 60 degrees C. I am finding this impossible to achieve in cold weather (even today @ 12 degrees outside air temp car struggles to get above 44 degrees on open road after 30 minutes)

Heats up very quick once in slow traffic/city but as soon as you start pickup up speed on open road it drops.

What procedure should I be using? Many thanks. Neil

Start car. Grin for appropriate period. Get out of car, finish breakfast, amble outside with half finished cup of tea, admire car, grin again at by now settled and warmed engine gentle rumbling, ditch remainder of cup of tea in adjacent and strategically placed flower bed, leave cup on exterior window ledge, get in car and off.......

[puckrup]

Sound practical pragmatic advice as ever rpa! I was in danger of becoming anally retentive about a) keeping car spotless b) not taking car out of garage if roads dirty (impossible around here, tractor: Sagaris ratio 50:1) and c) driving like a pensioner each time I went into Aberdeen!

Recieved wisdom seems to be warm engine sensibly, press the loud pedal and enjoy!!!

[kmpowell]

rpa.janwell said:

Start car. Grin for appropriate period. Get out of car, finish breakfast, amble outside with half finished cup of tea, admire car, grin again at by now settled and warmed engine gentle rumbling, ditch remainder of cup of tea in adjacent and strategically placed flower bed, leave cup on exterior window ledge, get in car and off.......

You should never leave a S6 car stood still to warm up. It must be driven so that the oil warms whilst 'flowing', which in turn ensures the engine gets maximum lube.

Edited by kmpowell on Tuesday 26th February 09:41

[KillerJim]

kmpowell said:

rpa.janwell said:

Start car. Grin for appropriate period. Get out of car, finish breakfast, amble outside with half finished cup of tea, admire car, grin again at by now settled and warmed engine gentle rumbling, ditch remainder of cup of tea in adjacent and strategically placed flower bed, leave cup on exterior window ledge, get in car and off.......

You should never leave a S6 car stood still to warm up. It must be driven so that the oil warms whilst 'flowing', which in turn ensures the engine gets maximum lube.

Edited by kmpowell on Tuesday 26th February 09:41

I`ve read this before but no-one gives a good reason for not allowing it to idle for a few minutes - my dealer doesn`t have an issue with customers doing this - oil pressure (on an cold engine) is high and therefore oil will get to everywhere its needed. I suspect the only problem is bore glazing but I`m not sure anyone has ever done that..

James

[Oat$y]

kmpowell said:

You should never leave a S6 car stood still to warm up. It must be driven so that the oil warms whilst 'flowing', which in turn ensures the engine gets maximum lube.

More Bt! Please explain how the flow of oil in the S6 or for that matter any engine has the oil pump connected to the drive?

As long as the oil pressure isn't low there is no problem.

Only downside is the gearbox and diff oils will be cold when you do drive away, but at least the engine will be closer to is optimal operating temperature ensuring less wear.

If what you say is true then my friends boat with a BMW M3 engine should be knackered by now.

[kmpowell]

[quote=Oat$y]More Bt!
[/quote]
Ring TVR Power up and ask them to explain. I got told this by my dealer, by TVR themselves (when they were in operation) and also TVR Power when I was looking at getting my engine blueprinted after it started running very rough.

I have no ida why they told me that, due to the fact I am as far from being a mechanic as is humanly possible! I'm only going on what I was told which had something to do with flow & viscosity. If it's good enough for those three sources then it was good enough for me.

Edited by kmpowell on Tuesday 26th February 10:35

[KillerJim]

I was told by a main dealer that the two options are fine and from I beleive a few people have been doing this for years without any problems.

I can`t see the recommendation behind selecting one over the other, if you drive away immediately all your just increasing the oil temperature quicker through increased rev's and engine effort.

[Oat$y]

I agree both ways are fine. Just monitor the oil pressure too high or too low is bad.
If worried buy a pre-oiler, great upgrade if you want to help with engine life.

[tail slide]

Will S6 engine survive frequent warm-ups by idling? Probably.

Will there be less wear if driven away and little load until warm? Yes.

Or if you prefer, there's also less wear the race-engine way, also that recommended for bedding in new cams etc, of holding at middling revs while stationary until warm, with no load on engine.

I had the 'official' advice as related by KMP too, and was for a reason. As an example, remember those aggressive cam profiles - peak loads on the wearing surfaces are at high revs and also at idle, surprisingly.

Edited by tail slide on Tuesday 26th February 13:20

[rpa.janwell]

And this is what I get for being flippant.........

[tail slide]

rpa.janwell said:

And this is what I get for being flippant.........

You knew the risks!



Brings all anal types out (hmm, is that me?)

[GR1FF1F]

Not to worry rpa, I appreciated your wit.

I'd also heard that leaving to sit at idle was not the recommended course, but personally I prefer to sit still and hold the rev's around the 1.5 - 2k mark. There's plenty of st you can do whilst it warms - change the CD, polish the sunglasses, set the air temperature - all from the comfort of the driving seat. And then when you do move off you get the full driving experience instead of having to waste some of the journey dollying at ridiculously low rev's. And I have to say 2.5 sounds really low, I'd been told 3 - 3.5 was OK, but wait for 70 degrees rather than 60 before really opening up.

Other thing to consider is hills. If you have to go up a decent incline early in the journey then doing it at a shade over tickover is a serious strain on the engine. You don't have to be an engineer to know when you're baby is feeling pain.

[JonRB]

I think this is the main thing I miss from my Chimaera 500 - that old alloy wet-sumped Rover V8 sure warmed up quickly. That and bags of low-down torque.

But I do love my new Sag.