Lotus Europa SE
Discussion
That version isn't, it looks like an Escort Cabriolet!
Damn shame, instead of wasting money turning the Europa into a chav wagon, they could have dropped the price of the standard car to £25K. And what's with the SE??? So now we have S, R, S/C, Cup...it's about time we had a coherent system.
Poor effort IMHO, bit of a shame as the Eagle news looked very promising.
Damn shame, instead of wasting money turning the Europa into a chav wagon, they could have dropped the price of the standard car to £25K. And what's with the SE??? So now we have S, R, S/C, Cup...it's about time we had a coherent system.
Poor effort IMHO, bit of a shame as the Eagle news looked very promising.
Its hardly a chav wagon!! And escort cab, well its not like one I have ever seen!!!
Have you actually driven a Europa with the 225 etc? If not I suggest you go and try one, its a very very good car. I really can't understand some of the open hostility to the Europa, I really don't get it! It's almost as if some elise / Exige owner feel insecure by it...
Actually I spoke to an engineer that said if they were given full range with the Europa they could have a car that would beat and exige all ways round as its aerodynamics are much better. As it is, its just a bit slower but not by that much...
Have you actually driven a Europa with the 225 etc? If not I suggest you go and try one, its a very very good car. I really can't understand some of the open hostility to the Europa, I really don't get it! It's almost as if some elise / Exige owner feel insecure by it...
Actually I spoke to an engineer that said if they were given full range with the Europa they could have a car that would beat and exige all ways round as its aerodynamics are much better. As it is, its just a bit slower but not by that much...
Twit said:
Its hardly a chav wagon!! And escort cab, well its not like one I have ever seen!!!
Have you actually driven a Europa with the 225 etc? If not I suggest you go and try one, its a very very good car. I really can't understand some of the open hostility to the Europa, I really don't get it! It's almost as if some elise / Exige owner feel insecure by it...
Actually I spoke to an engineer that said if they were given full range with the Europa they could have a car that would beat and exige all ways round as its aerodynamics are much better. As it is, its just a bit slower but not by that much...
I think the Europa is a fine car, just that Lotus don't know what to do with it. From the start it was poorly marketed, from the original shots to the compromised power/handling and ridiculous price tag.Have you actually driven a Europa with the 225 etc? If not I suggest you go and try one, its a very very good car. I really can't understand some of the open hostility to the Europa, I really don't get it! It's almost as if some elise / Exige owner feel insecure by it...
Actually I spoke to an engineer that said if they were given full range with the Europa they could have a car that would beat and exige all ways round as its aerodynamics are much better. As it is, its just a bit slower but not by that much...
Then it was 'facelifted' last year, with some leather in the interior but initally no increase in power or drop in price.
Now they've released something that frankly looks embarrassing. If any of it is based on Thorney's excellent work then they've obviously not improved in the marketing stakes, which makes me fear for the Eagle.
If the car can't be tweaked for 225 as standard, good delivery, comfortable interior and at £25,000 then no manner of covering with paint/leather is going to make it sell. And that's before mentioning the Traction Control it needs for its target audience.
You said it in the last paragraph. How many Exige owners buy one to blast down the Autobahn?
Edited by kevin ritson on Monday 3rd March 18:46
One thing i never understood is lotus claimed performace figures for the europa
The engine is the same or a later revision of that in the VX220 turbo and has i believe more torque
The car is about the same weight
Yet lotus claim is max speed is 140 (VX 150)
And it 0 - 60 is 5.5 (VX under 5)
have lotus fitted a much longer legged box or are they downplaying the performance so as not to clash with the 111r?
The engine is the same or a later revision of that in the VX220 turbo and has i believe more torque
The car is about the same weight
Yet lotus claim is max speed is 140 (VX 150)
And it 0 - 60 is 5.5 (VX under 5)
have lotus fitted a much longer legged box or are they downplaying the performance so as not to clash with the 111r?
The figures for the revised Europa, e.g 225 are 4.9 to 60 and 155 flat out. Not been in one flat out but the 4.9 is certainly believable.
I have driven the Exige S as well and in outright speed terms they feel about the same. The Exige delivers it in a different way and handles differently but unless you are in the upper limits you don't really notice. The Europa feels nicer because it is a big softer but that is only in Lotus terms not broader terms.
I guess the one thing you would say about the revised version is that it will still be seeking a market. Assuming they have made the handling more exige-like then surly you would buy an exige. The Europa market revolves around people who just like it for what it is. It has to be judged on those terms and not against the Exige or Elise.
I have driven the Exige S as well and in outright speed terms they feel about the same. The Exige delivers it in a different way and handles differently but unless you are in the upper limits you don't really notice. The Europa feels nicer because it is a big softer but that is only in Lotus terms not broader terms.
I guess the one thing you would say about the revised version is that it will still be seeking a market. Assuming they have made the handling more exige-like then surly you would buy an exige. The Europa market revolves around people who just like it for what it is. It has to be judged on those terms and not against the Exige or Elise.
I dont know what it is because the body seems no different but the europa in that picture just looks really "right" for some reason. Those wheels are stunning. It's a pity that there is no pictures of the interior. I wonder if it is even better than the tan coloured "super luxury" one. Could it even be a "practice" for the finishes / style that will be used in the eagle.
As long as it is cheap enough and has the right spec, I hope it does well because it's just what i've been looking for. In the picture the rear wheels look alot wider than the fronts. I wonder if the original critisicms of the handling balance will stand with the new set-up? Will it be possible to get sticky tires in those sizes? Perhaps lotus have been listening to us after all.
I have always found it curious that an every-day rodified elise derivative should have no traction control. Surely the unit cost for that particular piece of kit must be about 20p (maybe even just a program added to the ecu?)
As long as it is cheap enough and has the right spec, I hope it does well because it's just what i've been looking for. In the picture the rear wheels look alot wider than the fronts. I wonder if the original critisicms of the handling balance will stand with the new set-up? Will it be possible to get sticky tires in those sizes? Perhaps lotus have been listening to us after all.
I have always found it curious that an every-day rodified elise derivative should have no traction control. Surely the unit cost for that particular piece of kit must be about 20p (maybe even just a program added to the ecu?)
I absolutely love the Europa, always have. However, I've got to agree the SE looks bloody awful!! It does look like a cheap halfords chav upgrade. Mesh grills, lowered & bling wheels 
Maybe its just unflattering in white.
I'm just glad they've priced the S more reasonably. Now it will compete with TT's not Porsche's. Most importantly means I can get one next year 2nd hand for f* all
Maybe its just unflattering in white.I'm just glad they've priced the S more reasonably. Now it will compete with TT's not Porsche's. Most importantly means I can get one next year 2nd hand for f* all
peter450 said:
One thing i never understood is lotus claimed performace figures for the europa
The engine is the same or a later revision of that in the VX220 turbo and has i believe more torque
The car is about the same weight
Yet lotus claim is max speed is 140 (VX 150)
And it 0 - 60 is 5.5 (VX under 5)
have lotus fitted a much longer legged box or are they downplaying the performance so as not to clash with the 111r?
Actually, the listed kerb weight is around 60kg heavier than the VXT. But the improved aerodynamics should help. The engine is the same or a later revision of that in the VX220 turbo and has i believe more torque
The car is about the same weight
Yet lotus claim is max speed is 140 (VX 150)
And it 0 - 60 is 5.5 (VX under 5)
have lotus fitted a much longer legged box or are they downplaying the performance so as not to clash with the 111r?
I quite like this 'SE' but can't help thinking its just an 'S' with the leather upgrade (only in a wider range of colours than just saddle tan). Not sure whether I prefer the wheels to the originals, but the article does list them as 18" rear/17" front when I'm sure the standard car runs on 17" all round a la VX, so the handling will be a little different.
Overall, nice car, but still too expensive for me...
I'll have to bargain hard on an ex-dem JJ
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