When is a classic car a classic car?

When is a classic car a classic car?

Author
Discussion

dinkel

Original Poster:

26,334 posts

241 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Age or reputation maybe?

crankedup

25,764 posts

226 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Warning - this is a can of worms! not the car but the thread subject. Something that it seems nobody can agree upon is when / what / how / why a classic car. I suppose we at least have a definition for Veteran and vintage. I understand that moves are in the offing for a definition for a post vintage class?

austin

1,161 posts

186 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
What do you mean by classic?

It's a fairly meaningless phrase if you ask me...

I'll start by saying that the car concerned can't still be in production.

dinkel

Original Poster:

26,334 posts

241 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Can of worms . . . I know.

How old should it be then? 10, 15, 20 years?

In Holland if a car is over 25 years old you don't need to pay roadtaxes anymore . . . and it's called a classic then.

I'm asking this because Ace Cafe is having a Classic Car Night June 10th. I managed to reserve 12 spaces for us PHers. Some friends have 80s and 90s cars that I regard as classics, dunno if the Ace does as well though. I want to have the proper arguements.

;)

. . . and about 8 more cars please. PM if you can make it and want your classic wheels at the Ace display.

Gretchen

18,367 posts

199 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
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I've just looked on one of the 'classic' car insurance websites i've used in the past to see what they stipulate, but there's no real information. Might be worth phoning one, or browsing a few other sites to see what the given is?


a8hex

5,739 posts

206 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
My 94 X300 XJ6 is considered as a classic by the insurance company if I keep it as a classic, but not if I want to be allowed to drive it for business. Where as they were quite happy for me to drive my XK150 for business without affecting the premiums.

I wouldn't even use the "not in production" test. Some cares remained in production for years. How about Morgans? are they classics straight off the production line? It's possible that there will be more C-Types built this year than at any time in the 50s, admittedly most of them won't be aiming at qualifying for FIA papers, but do they count as classics?

I don't think you will ever come up with a consistent definition even for your own usage let alone one you'll get anyone else to agree on.

A few weeks ago here I quipped that "Any Alfa is a classic" and no one disagreed.
How old does a Jag have to be to be a classic?
How old does a BMW have to be to be a classic?
A Merc?
A Ford, does it make a difference whether the Ford is also a Cosworth?
If a Mk2 Golf GTI is considered a classic, will a Mk3 ever be? (why isn't there a smilie for stirring?)


900T-R

20,393 posts

240 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
dinkel said:
In Holland if a car is over 25 years old you don't need to pay roadtaxes anymore . . . and it's called a classic then.
Not exactly - a car over 25 years old is considered an 'oldtimer' which doesn't necessarily mean that it's a classic (and vice versa).

1980 Opel Kadett 1.2N = oldtimer
2008 Morgan Roadster = classic smile

absolutely

3,168 posts

175 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Veteran cars upto 1918 supposedly, Vintage pre-WW2, Classic any time post-war.

A classic can be anything, a Smart car is a classic, so it an original KA.

crankedup

25,764 posts

226 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Vintage cars are only classed as such if said car was built from the end of veteran era up to 1930. After 1930 they are classic cars apparently. I have considered for some while that a post vintage classification needs to be formally agreed upon and an modern classic group also. I know this won't help the OP much, sorry.

absolutely

3,168 posts

175 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
crankedup said:
Vintage cars are only classed as such if said car was built from the end of veteran era up to 1930. After 1930 they are classic cars apparently. I have considered for some while that a post vintage classification needs to be formally agreed upon and an modern classic group also. I know this won't help the OP much, sorry.
Big hairy bks! You cannot say a 1931 Phantom II is not a Vintage car!

a8hex

5,739 posts

206 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
absolutely said:
crankedup said:
Vintage cars are only classed as such if said car was built from the end of veteran era up to 1930. After 1930 they are classic cars apparently. I have considered for some while that a post vintage classification needs to be formally agreed upon and an modern classic group also. I know this won't help the OP much, sorry.
Big hairy bks! You cannot say a 1931 Phantom II is not a Vintage car!
That is the problem with any formal classification. You have to draw a line in the sand somewhere and when things fall the wrong side then someone will be upset.

plasticpig

12,924 posts

208 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
absolutely said:
crankedup said:
Vintage cars are only classed as such if said car was built from the end of veteran era up to 1930. After 1930 they are classic cars apparently. I have considered for some while that a post vintage classification needs to be formally agreed upon and an modern classic group also. I know this won't help the OP much, sorry.
Big hairy bks! You cannot say a 1931 Phantom II is not a Vintage car!
You can if you are the VSCC. The CCOA reckon the vintage cut off is 1925 IIRC.

Gretchen

18,367 posts

199 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
plasticpig said:
You can if you are the VSCC. The CCOA reckon the vintage cut off is 1925 IIRC.
So, in effect, they could also say anything post 1973 (ie not tax exempt) should not be considered a 'classic'... ??

Dictionary defines 'classic' as;

a. Belonging to the highest rank or class.
b. Serving as the established model or standard: a classic example of colonial architecture.
c. Having lasting significance or worth; enduring.


dilbert

7,740 posts

214 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
absolutely said:
Veteran cars upto 1918 supposedly, Vintage pre-WW2, Classic any time post-war.

A classic can be anything, a Smart car is a classic, so it an original KA.
Nah, anything after or about 1990, is just plain knackered!
biggrin

austin

1,161 posts

186 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
a8hex said:
I wouldn't even use the "not in production" test. Some cares remained in production for years. How about Morgans? are they classics straight off the production line? It's possible that there will be more C-Types built this year than at any time in the 50s, admittedly most of them won't be aiming at qualifying for FIA papers, but do they count as classics?
Who are the C-Types made by? It's not Jaguar so they aren't even Jaguar C-Types...

Personally I wouldn't class a new Morgan as a classic either, in fact I would say nothing pre 1980 as an absolute minimum.

The problem is that it is a personal thing.

The other question is why do we need to answer the question at all, they are after all just old cars. Just enjoy them and stop arguing the toss about what you call it.

Mr POD

5,153 posts

175 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Who are they ? Who decides ? Via the mk2cav.com (mk2 cavalier owners club) I have attended the VBOA at Billing Aquadrome and seen all sorts of Modern Classics - is a mk3 cavalier turbo a classic ?

I think it's rare enough and special enough.

Is the allegro Vandom plas a classic.

It's old enough and rare enough and crap enough.

williamp

18,492 posts

256 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
As the second poster says, its a can of worms. We all have our definitions, but I'm happy with the following:

A Classic car is a car which leaves and indelible impression on you

It could be any vehicle, from any age which qualifies as a classic, simply because you remember it well. Of course its different for different people. Thats the joy of our hobby.

bigbadbikercats

621 posts

191 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
dinkel said:
Age or reputation maybe?
Hmmm...

Totally personal subjective judgement for me, and doesn't follow any consistent pattern, all I know is that I recognise it when I see it, that not everybody agrees on it (and that's half the fun), and that every attempt I've seen at a rigid definition both includes and excludes at least a few things which it clearly shouldn't! As an example, a few contributors have played the "Definitely not if it's still in production" card - Where does this leave (for instance) the (original and genuine) Mini? - OK it's out of production now and it's an exceptional case given the length of its production run but a lot of people would agree that there was a very strong case to be made for it well before the last example rolled off the line.

--
JG

Simes205

4,268 posts

211 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
williamp said:
A Classic car is a car which leaves and indelible impression on you
It could be any vehicle, from any age which qualifies as a classic, simply because you remember it well. Of course its different for different people. Thats the joy of our hobby.
Perfect.

absolutely

3,168 posts

175 months

Wednesday 21st May 2008
quotequote all
Our 32' Austin 7 was allowed in to the VSCC. They use the pre-war as vintage.