Rear brake hoses.
Discussion
More advice needed.
Does anyone know what vevicle the rear flexi brake hoses come from or better still a part number. Car is an S3 with drum brakes and the hoses are the ones from the fixed chassis mount to the rigid pipe on the trailing arm (just in case some are different).
Thanks
Tony
Does anyone know what vevicle the rear flexi brake hoses come from or better still a part number. Car is an S3 with drum brakes and the hoses are the ones from the fixed chassis mount to the rigid pipe on the trailing arm (just in case some are different).
Thanks
Tony
Hi Tony, once again we come up against the problem of obsolete pipes! Faced this with the S1 front pipes as well. I have been through the Lockheed/Delphi hydraulic parts catalogue. I cannot find any pipe listed which meets that precise spec. The nearest I can find are:
L1741 Rover SD1 257mm M10 x 1 plain thread ends 23mm ends
LH2295 Saab 99 267mm M10 x 1, plain thread ends 23 and 15mm ends.
Both however appear to be discontinued so you will almost certainly struggle to find them.
I did however spot
LH5142 279mm long, M10 x 1, plain thread ends, 23 and 15mm. That is listed for the Metrocab! They should certainly still be available. You need to check if the slightly longer pipe will cause any problems.
Another interesting possibility is
L2102, 253mm M10 x1 both ends which is listed as Escort/Orion, it wont be on all models but should be available. The difficulty with this one is that one end is designed for clip fastening but I suspect it would be readily adaptable by either using a clip and nut, or two nuts on the threaded section. If you get stuck I will try to get hold of one and see.
Small word of warning, many of these screw ended pipes come without new nuts so keep hold of any good nuts from old piping!
L1741 Rover SD1 257mm M10 x 1 plain thread ends 23mm ends
LH2295 Saab 99 267mm M10 x 1, plain thread ends 23 and 15mm ends.
Both however appear to be discontinued so you will almost certainly struggle to find them.
I did however spot
LH5142 279mm long, M10 x 1, plain thread ends, 23 and 15mm. That is listed for the Metrocab! They should certainly still be available. You need to check if the slightly longer pipe will cause any problems.
Another interesting possibility is
L2102, 253mm M10 x1 both ends which is listed as Escort/Orion, it wont be on all models but should be available. The difficulty with this one is that one end is designed for clip fastening but I suspect it would be readily adaptable by either using a clip and nut, or two nuts on the threaded section. If you get stuck I will try to get hold of one and see.
Small word of warning, many of these screw ended pipes come without new nuts so keep hold of any good nuts from old piping!
Speak to the guys at http://www.brakeparts.co.uk they will make pipes up if they haven't got them on the shelf - cheap too and very helpful.
I think there have been a few issues with cars having imperial threaded cylinders on the back - so beware!
Chris
I think there have been a few issues with cars having imperial threaded cylinders on the back - so beware!
Chris
Be careful with these 'standard' tables. Mine had metric connections at the brake drum but imperial connections to the solid pipe on the trailing arm. Ended up sending the old flexi pipes off to have new custom copies made. I don't think mine came from another manufacturer. I reckon TVR made them up (probably on a Friday).
Ralph
Ralph
Hi Tony, I brought mine from Rally design - braided, I think they where £50 - £60 for front and rear 6 lines in total, metric fitting. You have to check which threads you have by looking at the nut - if it has a diamond shape pressed into the edge of each flat, then they are metric, no markings imperial.
They are not on their internet site, just ring them.
Regards Sean
They are not on their internet site, just ring them.
Regards Sean
Finaly sorted out the rear brake hoses. Two hoses I have identified are:
1. Lucas TRW PHC 202, same size but with M10 x 1.0 threads listed for Jaguar XJS plus others.
2. Lucas TRW PHC 138, 5mm longer than standard with 3/8 UNF threads. Listed for Lotus Europa and Talbot Sunbeam Avenger.
Both hoses were readily available at the local motor factor. Mine turned out to be the 3/8 UNF thread.
Tony
1. Lucas TRW PHC 202, same size but with M10 x 1.0 threads listed for Jaguar XJS plus others.
2. Lucas TRW PHC 138, 5mm longer than standard with 3/8 UNF threads. Listed for Lotus Europa and Talbot Sunbeam Avenger.
Both hoses were readily available at the local motor factor. Mine turned out to be the 3/8 UNF thread.
Tony
Sorry, it took a long time to get back on those parts numbers. I think you were very lucky Tony! I've now had a chance to check the TRW database. Both the hoses are old items and listed as not to be re-manufactured. When you see an exact listing of the applications you will see why!
PHC202 is M10x 1 both ends, 252mm long. Listed for XJS coupe, but ONLY the 5.3litre from 1975 to December 1979! Most XJS's use a longer hose PHC134. The other application, and the one I picked up on before, was the Reliant Scimitar, but only the convertible! Not therefore exactly a hose in big demand!
PHC138 is 3/8UNF both ends, 255mm long. Listed for Lotus Europa 1.6 1970-76 and for Talbot Avenger 1.3 and 1.6 1970-81, but not all models.
I think the moral of the story is that we check out which hoses our own car has, then try to get new hoses 'for stock' while there are still stocks.
PHC202 is M10x 1 both ends, 252mm long. Listed for XJS coupe, but ONLY the 5.3litre from 1975 to December 1979! Most XJS's use a longer hose PHC134. The other application, and the one I picked up on before, was the Reliant Scimitar, but only the convertible! Not therefore exactly a hose in big demand!
PHC138 is 3/8UNF both ends, 255mm long. Listed for Lotus Europa 1.6 1970-76 and for Talbot Avenger 1.3 and 1.6 1970-81, but not all models.
I think the moral of the story is that we check out which hoses our own car has, then try to get new hoses 'for stock' while there are still stocks.
Chaps I'm going to resurrect this thread - I have just been speaking to Mike at http://www.brakeparts.co.uk telephone 01706 666999.
I've been through the flexible hoses I need for my V8S - the rear one talked about above from the chassis to the trailing arm seemed to present a bit of a problem - mine is 205mm from flange to flange (so excluding the thread sticking out the ends) but the nearest available is 190mm (or 265mm which is too long I think). I've looked at mine and I really can't see the 15mm difference being an issue.
As soon as I have the hoses I will post some pics up, Mike will also give me the part numbers so I can post them here.
The only difference I can see between the rear on the V6 (drum) and the V8S (disc) is the outer flexible hose (and I know there's the metric / imperial issue aswell) , so if we can collate all the info together I'll see if we can get a wiki sorted with all the info on it.
Finally a question regarding the copper pipes - I am undecided whether to reuse existing (they are in decent nick, I just planned to polish them up) or make new ones for the hell of it. All comments / advice appreciated.
Chris
I've been through the flexible hoses I need for my V8S - the rear one talked about above from the chassis to the trailing arm seemed to present a bit of a problem - mine is 205mm from flange to flange (so excluding the thread sticking out the ends) but the nearest available is 190mm (or 265mm which is too long I think). I've looked at mine and I really can't see the 15mm difference being an issue.
As soon as I have the hoses I will post some pics up, Mike will also give me the part numbers so I can post them here.
The only difference I can see between the rear on the V6 (drum) and the V8S (disc) is the outer flexible hose (and I know there's the metric / imperial issue aswell) , so if we can collate all the info together I'll see if we can get a wiki sorted with all the info on it.
Finally a question regarding the copper pipes - I am undecided whether to reuse existing (they are in decent nick, I just planned to polish them up) or make new ones for the hell of it. All comments / advice appreciated.
Chris
Chris, I'd go for new copper pipes every time for what they cost. I'd also think about re routing the one that goes all the way from front to rear, just in case it ever goes like mine did a while ago....pig of a job.
I've also considered (if I ever do a body off) running individual pipes to each rear wheel, so I could then rig a diagional split instead of the front/rear split like it is a present (would need to use a second proportioning valve for that though).
Cheers
Ant
I've also considered (if I ever do a body off) running individual pipes to each rear wheel, so I could then rig a diagional split instead of the front/rear split like it is a present (would need to use a second proportioning valve for that though).
Cheers
Ant
I think you're right - I've just been on holiday so I'm in scrooge mode!
My pipes have brass unions - but all the new parts seem to be cheap looking metal unions - would you make up new pipes and reuse the existing brass fittings?
Also Ant have you got one of the cheap pipe flarers?
Some comments I've read says they are crap but then I only need to do 18 flares in total - 15 single flares and 3 duals to connect to the master cylinder.
Chris
My pipes have brass unions - but all the new parts seem to be cheap looking metal unions - would you make up new pipes and reuse the existing brass fittings?
Also Ant have you got one of the cheap pipe flarers?
Some comments I've read says they are crap but then I only need to do 18 flares in total - 15 single flares and 3 duals to connect to the master cylinder.
Chris
Edited by Barkychoc on Monday 8th September 22:13
Hello Chris
I bought a pipe flarer..it cost about 30 quid and is a draper one (I think). Managed with it really well considering I had to flare the pipe on the car halfway up the side of the gearbox. You can borrow it if you like, and it'll give me a good excuse to pop down and see how the rebuild is going.
Cheers
Ant
I bought a pipe flarer..it cost about 30 quid and is a draper one (I think). Managed with it really well considering I had to flare the pipe on the car halfway up the side of the gearbox. You can borrow it if you like, and it'll give me a good excuse to pop down and see how the rebuild is going.
Cheers
Ant
Hi Chris
These people say they can supply a kit http://www.automec.co.uk/frame_set.html and obviously like TVRs and offer brass unions
Or these http://www.stevsonmotors.co.uk/brakeunions.htm
Or these https://www.europaspares.com/BRAKE_PARTS/ in fact on Ebay as well auction ref 290258158788
When i built a kit car some years ago I borrowed a flaring tool from my local garage as they only used once in a blue moon
These people say they can supply a kit http://www.automec.co.uk/frame_set.html and obviously like TVRs and offer brass unions
Or these http://www.stevsonmotors.co.uk/brakeunions.htm
Or these https://www.europaspares.com/BRAKE_PARTS/ in fact on Ebay as well auction ref 290258158788
When i built a kit car some years ago I borrowed a flaring tool from my local garage as they only used once in a blue moon
Edited by Gerald-TVR on Monday 8th September 22:30
Tant said:
Hello Chris
I bought a pipe flarer..it cost about 30 quid and is a draper one (I think). Managed with it really well considering I had to flare the pipe on the car halfway up the side of the gearbox. You can borrow it if you like, and it'll give me a good excuse to pop down and see how the rebuild is going.
Cheers
Ant
I will take you up on that if you don't mind Ant - I'm off work all this week if it helps.I bought a pipe flarer..it cost about 30 quid and is a draper one (I think). Managed with it really well considering I had to flare the pipe on the car halfway up the side of the gearbox. You can borrow it if you like, and it'll give me a good excuse to pop down and see how the rebuild is going.
Cheers
Ant
Norman thanks for the links I'll have a look.
Chris
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