SCAM ADVERT!!!

[john_r]

Attention PH hamsters,

The following is a SCAM advert:

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/595074.htm

Email response confirms the car is in Spain for the last 12 months; so why is it registered and insured in UK still (checked on DVLA and ASKMID)...?

Reg number is BT05DZW which does correspond to a Black RR Sport.

They are asking for payment by bank transfer up front before shipping and the car cannot be viewed as it is already with the shipping agent...

The fonesafe number diverts to a fax machine!

I have clicked the report to admin button but the advert is still there?

[bmw2002]

john_r said:

Attention PH hamsters,

The following is a SCAM advert:

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/595074.htm

Email response confirms the car is in Spain for the last 12 months; so why is it registered and insured in UK still (checked on DVLA and ASKMID)...?

Reg number is BT05DZW which does correspond to a Black RR Sport.

They are asking for payment by bank transfer up front before shipping and the car cannot be viewed as it is already with the shipping agent...

The fonesafe number diverts to a fax machine!

I have clicked the report to admin button but the advert is still there?

What you doing looking at RR adverts anyway???

[john_r]

bmw2002 said:

What you doing looking at RR adverts anyway???

Saw it in the Barge thread and it kinda boiled my piss a bit! And at that price it would make a worthy run around to replace the Disco and Passat in one!

[Mr Will]

Deleted and banned, i will investigate further in the morning.

[john_r]

Mr Will said:

Deleted and banned, i will investigate further in the morning.

If you look at the 'bargain barge £5k-£20k' thread you'll see we've found 3 or 4 other scam ad's...

[richardxjr]

These scam ads are causing real problems in the marketplace, not just to mug punters who may be persuaded to pay for an unseen vehicle, but more importantly they are driving down the values of pukka motors.

You have the facility to see how long a member's been on here. Give established members (say 200+ posts AND 12+ months) free ads, and charge everyone else say £10 or £20.

Sorry, but free ads = scammers paradise.

[Mr Will]

richardxjr said:

These scam ads are causing real problems in the marketplace, not just to mug punters who may be persuaded to pay for an unseen vehicle, but more importantly they are driving down the values of pukka motors.

You have the facility to see how long a member's been on here. Give established members (say 200+ posts AND 12+ months) free ads, and charge everyone else say £10 or £20.

Sorry, but free ads = scammers paradise.

Unfortunately thats not the case, that advert (and several others I have removed) are premium adverts which have been paid for. All we can do is keep increasing our security checks and try to make sure nobody gets caught out so that it is easier and more productive for them to go elsewhere and leave us alone.

[john_r]

Mr Will said:

richardxjr said:

These scam ads are causing real problems in the marketplace, not just to mug punters who may be persuaded to pay for an unseen vehicle, but more importantly they are driving down the values of pukka motors.

You have the facility to see how long a member's been on here. Give established members (say 200+ posts AND 12+ months) free ads, and charge everyone else say £10 or £20.

Sorry, but free ads = scammers paradise.

Unfortunately thats not the case, that advert (and several others I have removed) are premium adverts which have been paid for. All we can do is keep increasing our security checks and try to make sure nobody gets caught out so that it is easier and more productive for them to go elsewhere and leave us alone.

So surely you have their name and address then and can report them to the authorities, or at least the credit card companies? It's unlikely that a scammer is going to use their own credit card to place an advert - they'll either be stolen or obtained through deception...

[Mr Will]

There have been several police investigations ongoing for about the past six months, but so far there has been no joy. Maybe the credit card details will help, but if they are using stolen cards then I am not sure it will.

In the mean time all we can do is keep trying to solve the problem at this end.

[V8S]

Mr Will said:

There have been several police investigations ongoing for about the past six months, but so far there has been no joy. Maybe the credit card details will help, but if they are using stolen cards then I am not sure it will.

In the mean time all we can do is keep trying to solve the problem at this end.

I know this sounds stupid, but howsabout taking a leaf from 419eater's book.

Get each advertiser to send a picture of their vehicle with a small note attached saying 'PH' or something, maybe a different word each month so images can't be saved from a genuine ad and re-used in 6 month's time. The picture wouldn't get used on the site, but might weed out most of the tts who never did, nor ever will, have access to the car they are attempting to sell.

Unusual perhaps, but surely most serious sellers would be willing to do this to advertise here. I would but maybe I am in the minority.

Perhaps it could be trialled in one or two sections that suffer most from bogus ads.

[Mr Will]

Its a nice idea but the problem is that it would require somebody to manually check every single advert, which is not really practical with the number of adverts we get submitted every day.

I have a few ideas for automatic checks which should catch a lot of them, but any other ideas, however silly they may sound, will be greatly appreciated.

[DrTre]

how about an alert to mods for certain key phrases appearing in submitted ads?
Not remotely perfect as it's still reliant on manual checking and will miss some/catch legit ads but would flag up some potential dodgy ones.

[TonyHetherington]

DrTre said:

how about an alert to mods for certain key phrases appearing in submitted ads?
Not remotely perfect as it's still reliant on manual checking and will miss some/catch legit ads but would flag up some potential dodgy ones.

That happens already - even on simple stuff such as being in the wrong category.

[V8S]

Mr Will said:

Its a nice idea but the problem is that it would require somebody to manually check every single advert, which is not really practical with the number of adverts we get submitted every day.

I have a few ideas for automatic checks which should catch a lot of them, but any other ideas, however silly they may sound, will be greatly appreciated.

Ah, I thought each advert was checked. It used to be I think. Don't the ads get added to the database and then the pics are checked manually?

Would some kind of check of price against an online Parkers guide weed out much of the dross - say, 10% either way of the Parkers' price and it flags up the advert to be checked manually. Would say you'd have to pay for that kind of access though, so not ideal unless you can work out some exchange for free advertising.

With so many people on PH, and most, I would assume, looking through the classifieds to dream or buy, what about having Advert Moderators? I'd say there must be a number of long-term users who don't want the responsibility and backlash of being a forum moderator, but could help out by checking each new ad.

Each ad would go up, live, in the classifieds when it's added by the user. You have a pool of about 20 advert moderators who log on, when they can, into an admin section which gives them the next unmoderated advert. They click a button to mark it as moderated, and from then on the advert shows a "This advert has been moderated" notice, showing it has been checked and giving a little added kudos. After clicking the button, the moderator is then given the next one to do, and so on.

OK, it doesn't have the 'glamour' of being known on the forums as a mod, but if people keep complaining about scam ads then they should be willing to put some effort in to fix it. It's something I'd be willing to help with for instance.

[Mr Will]

DrTre said:

how about an alert to mods for certain key phrases appearing in submitted ads?
Not remotely perfect as it's still reliant on manual checking and will miss some/catch legit ads but would flag up some potential dodgy ones.

Without going into too much detail, it is improvements to this system that I am planning at the moment. We are also looking to create a system which sends out a warning email to anyone who has contacted the advertiser when we remove it.

V8S said:

Mr Will said:

Its a nice idea but the problem is that it would require somebody to manually check every single advert, which is not really practical with the number of adverts we get submitted every day.

I have a few ideas for automatic checks which should catch a lot of them, but any other ideas, however silly they may sound, will be greatly appreciated.

Ah, I thought each advert was checked. It used to be I think. Don't the ads get added to the database and then the pics are checked manually?

Would some kind of check of price against an online Parkers guide weed out much of the dross - say, 10% either way of the Parkers' price and it flags up the advert to be checked manually. Would say you'd have to pay for that kind of access though, so not ideal unless you can work out some exchange for free advertising.

With so many people on PH, and most, I would assume, looking through the classifieds to dream or buy, what about having Advert Moderators? I'd say there must be a number of long-term users who don't want the responsibility and backlash of being a forum moderator, but could help out by checking each new ad.

Each ad would go up, live, in the classifieds when it's added by the user. You have a pool of about 20 advert moderators who log on, when they can, into an admin section which gives them the next unmoderated advert. They click a button to mark it as moderated, and from then on the advert shows a "This advert has been moderated" notice, showing it has been checked and giving a little added kudos. After clicking the button, the moderator is then given the next one to do, and so on.

OK, it doesn't have the 'glamour' of being known on the forums as a mod, but if people keep complaining about scam ads then they should be willing to put some effort in to fix it. It's something I'd be willing to help with for instance.

The problem is the sheer size of the classifieds now. If we wanted to check every advert at the current rate of submission each of your 20 moderators would have to average 120 adverts per day. The current system uses automatic checks first, which then flag potentially dodgy ads for manual approval, cutting down on the workload drasticly.

What we need to do it tighten up these automatic checks as much as possible and then if necessary we will look into finding somebody to deal with the increase number of adverts that this will flag for moderation.

[V8S]

Mr Will said:

DrTre said:

how about an alert to mods for certain key phrases appearing in submitted ads?
Not remotely perfect as it's still reliant on manual checking and will miss some/catch legit ads but would flag up some potential dodgy ones.

Without going into too much detail, it is improvements to this system that I am planning at the moment. We are also looking to create a system which sends out a warning email to anyone who has contacted the advertiser when we remove it.

V8S said:

Mr Will said:

Its a nice idea but the problem is that it would require somebody to manually check every single advert, which is not really practical with the number of adverts we get submitted every day.

I have a few ideas for automatic checks which should catch a lot of them, but any other ideas, however silly they may sound, will be greatly appreciated.

Ah, I thought each advert was checked. It used to be I think. Don't the ads get added to the database and then the pics are checked manually?

Would some kind of check of price against an online Parkers guide weed out much of the dross - say, 10% either way of the Parkers' price and it flags up the advert to be checked manually. Would say you'd have to pay for that kind of access though, so not ideal unless you can work out some exchange for free advertising.

With so many people on PH, and most, I would assume, looking through the classifieds to dream or buy, what about having Advert Moderators? I'd say there must be a number of long-term users who don't want the responsibility and backlash of being a forum moderator, but could help out by checking each new ad.

Each ad would go up, live, in the classifieds when it's added by the user. You have a pool of about 20 advert moderators who log on, when they can, into an admin section which gives them the next unmoderated advert. They click a button to mark it as moderated, and from then on the advert shows a "This advert has been moderated" notice, showing it has been checked and giving a little added kudos. After clicking the button, the moderator is then given the next one to do, and so on.

OK, it doesn't have the 'glamour' of being known on the forums as a mod, but if people keep complaining about scam ads then they should be willing to put some effort in to fix it. It's something I'd be willing to help with for instance.

The problem is the sheer size of the classifieds now. If we wanted to check every advert at the current rate of submission each of your 20 moderators would have to average 120 adverts per day. The current system uses automatic checks first, which then flag potentially dodgy ads for manual approval, cutting down on the workload drasticly.

What we need to do it tighten up these automatic checks as much as possible and then if necessary we will look into finding somebody to deal with the increase number of adverts that this will flag for moderation.

Oh, I see. Rather larger submission numbers than I thought! Let's put that idea in the bin then

[Mr Will]

V8S said:

Oh, I see. Rather larger submission numbers than I thought! Let's put that idea in the bin then

It's not a bad idea in essence and the extra manpower would allow us to flag up more ads, but it is just not possible to check every single one

[john_r]

john_r said:

Attention PH hamsters,

The following is a SCAM advert:

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/595074.htm

Email response confirms the car is in Spain for the last 12 months; so why is it registered and insured in UK still (checked on DVLA and ASKMID)...?

Reg number is BT05DZW which does correspond to a Black RR Sport.

They are asking for payment by bank transfer up front before shipping and the car cannot be viewed as it is already with the shipping agent...

The fonesafe number diverts to a fax machine!

I have clicked the report to admin button but the advert is still there?

In response to 'her' emailing me again this morning and telling me that I could have first refusal if I could transfer the money today; I asked why the advert was gone from PH:

---

Re: '2005 LAND ROVER RANGE ROVER SPORT V8 HSE BLACK' at PistonHeads.comþ
From: Susan Carter ([e-mail])
Sent: 15 July 2008 11:01:20
To: JR

Hi, The advert was withdrawn from PistonHeads because I sold the car. Regards Susan

---

They never give up!

[Nic Jones]

£10/hour and I will spend a couple of hours each evening going through the classifieds hunting the scammers.

How does that sound?

I am actually being serious, when I finish my placement in September I'll have more spare time than I can shake a stick at (I'll only be in Uni a few days per week) and could devote time to it.

[richardxjr]

Nic Jones said:

£10/hour and I will spend a couple of hours each evening going through the classifieds hunting the scammers.

How does that sound?

I am actually being serious, when I finish my placement in September I'll have more spare time than I can shake a stick at (I'll only be in Uni a few days per week) and could devote time to it.

I'd do that too.

Easy to spot 'em manually. Some are using non-existant phone numbers too on an otherwise kosher looking ad, so these can be checked as part of the service. ETA: This one: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/605456.htm

Edited by richardxjr on Tuesday 15th July 17:24