Planning consent question

[MINIrocket]

Apologies if this isn't in the correct forum, but seemed to fit. I'm hoping someone on here has a bit more knowledge of dealing with council planners!

I'm looking to extend my driveway sideways to create a double width space, however the land to the side (I own) is currently behind an open fence. Having spoken to the planners, they were unclear as to whether I could use the land as it may be classed as Amenity land.

From what they said however, it's only once I put in an application for permitted development, that they would decide on whether it was Residential or Amenity land and that in their words "We wouldn't currently have anything on file to show what it's currently designated as".

I have the original application for the development of the entire house/land, and the area concerned is not shown to be any different to any other part of the front garden etc.

So my question is... at what point do they decide whether an area is amenity land or not?
I don't want to apply for permission, only for them to then decide that it's amenity land, if I could theoretically do the work anyway as they would have no proof that the land was previously designated as Amenity land?

Any input would be much appreciated!

Thanks, Dave

[jamesuk28]

We applied for a new driveway and were told by our local authority that if Highways were happy with splays etc, then Planning may not even be required.

[FUBAR]

Im no expert (trust me on this!) but surely if the piece of land is shown on the Land Registery plan as within your demise (e.g. you own it) how can it be amenity space? That being land for the use/benefit of others?

I dont think the fence has anything to do with it (other than you should really relocate it to the boundary of your demise.

I stand to be corrected

[Hobo]

Just do it, don't ask & they won't even notice.

[ginettag27]

Dave YHM!

I think what you're proposing is to enlarge a parking area only, not change a vehicular access.. The land that you want to use to enlarge your parking area is an extra strip of land which adjoins your dwelling plot..

Which District Council is it and what sort of location? What boundary treatments are in place to the dwelling plot and adjoining land?

Effectively you want to increase the curtilage of your dwelling plot to include this strip of land of part thereof?

What is this strip of land currently being used for and what has it been used for historically?

Edited by ginettag27 on Wednesday 6th August 19:30

[MINIrocket]

Thanks for the responses so far. Phil, I have replied to your queries via PM, so thanks in advance.

I just am very wary of asking the council anything... normally it simply open up problems that were never there in the first place!!

Dave

[mk1fan]

Firstly, the Local Authority won't give any formal advice. Indeed, you'll have to make a formal application to obtain a decision.

Secondly, in this case Amenity does not mean Public Space. Simply, it means external space for use of the owner within the curtildge of the property - i.e. a garden. A lot of LA's have relaxed their requirements for amenity.

If you're also wanting to widen the dropped kerb on the pavement you'll have to make an Application to both Planning and Highways.

Personally, I wouldn't waste your PD allocation (if it hasn't already been used) on gaining a parking space. I'd apply for change of use instead. Generally speaking, as long as you're not losing all of your 'garden' then amenity shouldn't be an issue.

Or, if you're not wanting to drop the kerb as well I'd just do it and use Grasscrete or Grassblock style of hard standing so it looks like it's just grass. I'd use them anyway to help alleviate surface water problems.

More specific details would be needed to give a better answer.

[MINIrocket]

mk1fan said:

Firstly, the Local Authority won't give any formal advice. Indeed, you'll have to make a formal application to obtain a decision.

Secondly, in this case Amenity does not mean Public Space. Simply, it means external space for use of the owner within the curtildge of the property - i.e. a garden. A lot of LA's have relaxed their requirements for amenity.

If you're also wanting to widen the dropped kerb on the pavement you'll have to make an Application to both Planning and Highways.

Personally, I wouldn't waste your PD allocation (if it hasn't already been used) on gaining a parking space. I'd apply for change of use instead. Generally speaking, as long as you're not losing all of your 'garden' then amenity shouldn't be an issue.

Or, if you're not wanting to drop the kerb as well I'd just do it and use Grasscrete or Grassblock style of hard standing so it looks like it's just grass. I'd use them anyway to help alleviate surface water problems.

More specific details would be needed to give a better answer.

Hi Mk1fan,

I have copied a post that I have made on another forum below, which hopefully gives a bit clearer guidance. Any advice is much appreciated. Ginettatag has been very helpful via email, however i'm obviously interested in getting as much feedback as possible!

Post from other (non-Pistonhead) Forum:

I'm looking to extend my driveway sideways to create a double width space, however the land to the side (I own) is currently behind an open fence. Having spoken to the planners, they were unclear as to whether I could use the land as it MAY be classed as Amenity land.

From what they said however, it's only once I put in an application for permitted development, that they would decide on whether it was Residential or Amenity land and that in their words "We wouldn't currently have anything on file to show what it's currently designated as".

I have the original application for the development of the entire house/land, and the area concerned is not shown to be any different to any other part of the front garden etc.

So my question is... at what point do they decide whether an area is amenity land or not?

I've uploaded some images here.

Image 1: Shows how the plot appears on Land Registry map.


Image 2: Shows the map on the original planning application for the whole development, including fencing/open fencing as shown on the original development maps:


Image 3: Shows the current plot. Note that the "Secondary" fence had been removed by the previous owner, so that the area to the left of the house now forms an intergral part of the garden.


Image 4: Shows what we would like to do with regards to relocating the fence at the front.


Image 5: Shows the current view from GoogleEarth (picture was taken before the back garden had been extended sideways.


Image 6: Shows the current view taken from standing on the driveway, looking towards the garage.


One main thing to note is that the previous owner applied for planning permission to extend the house sideways, and in the application and subsequent refusal, there was NO mention anywhere about the fact that the land at the side should have been amenity land etc, therefore I would presume that this wasn't an issue with the planners (or they didn't notice!)

Any advice on what to do is much appreciated!

I don't want to apply for permission, only for them to then decide that the area out the front of the house is amenity land, if I could theoretically do the work anyway as they would have no proof that the land was previously designated as Amenity land?

Many thanks
Dave

[FUBAR]

Looks to me that the post & rail fencing has been put up in the wrong place. Going on the Land registry plan alone I cant see a reason for you not to move the fence to your boundary.