Want 2003-2005 Impreza, WRX and STI what's the difference?
Discussion
Hi
I've been driving for some time and have had all sorts of vehicles from hot hatches to Lotus Elise's. My commute is longer than it once was and I'm thinking about getting a 2003-2005 shape Impreza for around £9-£10K and was wondering if someone can advise me on the specs, bhp, etc.
I'd like a Subaru UK Main Dealer supplied car, but i'm uncertain what the differences are between WRX and STI? (i think they were both available as UK spec cars?) Also, around this time there was the option for the lower boot spoiler, what was this spec called? Was it called anything? I also notice that the majourity of vehicles for sale have material seats and Leather seems uncommon. Was it full or part leather. Is there a sportier type of interior with more track biased sports seats?
And most importantly do they all sound like rally car burble or do i need to replace the rear silencer / exhasut system to get the full effect?
Hope you can help, regards, D4V KC
I've been driving for some time and have had all sorts of vehicles from hot hatches to Lotus Elise's. My commute is longer than it once was and I'm thinking about getting a 2003-2005 shape Impreza for around £9-£10K and was wondering if someone can advise me on the specs, bhp, etc.
I'd like a Subaru UK Main Dealer supplied car, but i'm uncertain what the differences are between WRX and STI? (i think they were both available as UK spec cars?) Also, around this time there was the option for the lower boot spoiler, what was this spec called? Was it called anything? I also notice that the majourity of vehicles for sale have material seats and Leather seems uncommon. Was it full or part leather. Is there a sportier type of interior with more track biased sports seats?
And most importantly do they all sound like rally car burble or do i need to replace the rear silencer / exhasut system to get the full effect?
Hope you can help, regards, D4V KC
Hi mate,
Ok, lots of questions. The WRX and Sti both come as uk spec, the WRX is the 225bhp base turbo model and the Sti is the 265bhp top of the range model(not including special editions).
WRX has a low level spoiler and grey cloth interior. There is a WRX SL model with heated leather and sunroof.
The Sti has a high level spoiler, bigger brakes, better springs, sports exhaust, 6 speed box, larger intercooler and injectors, bigger turbo, different seats more power and fog light covers. Some models also had a switchable dif. There is an Sti spec-D (Discreat) which is the above with a low level spoiler, heated leather and sunroof, which only came in grey.
Both models can be fitted with a prodrive performance pack from the dealer (PPP) which gives some of that burble back, which the standard cars lack, and will give more power, WRX up to 265bhp and Sti up to 300bhp, IIRC.
Dont be afraid of imports though. If they are Euro imports they will be almost the exact spec as a uk car, save side airbags and alarm, but at a fraction of the price. The JDM (Japanese Domestic Market) imports have better internals and more power, amoungst other things, they are overall better than the car that carries the same badge in the UK.
Hope this helps,
Ian
Ok, lots of questions. The WRX and Sti both come as uk spec, the WRX is the 225bhp base turbo model and the Sti is the 265bhp top of the range model(not including special editions).
WRX has a low level spoiler and grey cloth interior. There is a WRX SL model with heated leather and sunroof.
The Sti has a high level spoiler, bigger brakes, better springs, sports exhaust, 6 speed box, larger intercooler and injectors, bigger turbo, different seats more power and fog light covers. Some models also had a switchable dif. There is an Sti spec-D (Discreat) which is the above with a low level spoiler, heated leather and sunroof, which only came in grey.
Both models can be fitted with a prodrive performance pack from the dealer (PPP) which gives some of that burble back, which the standard cars lack, and will give more power, WRX up to 265bhp and Sti up to 300bhp, IIRC.
Dont be afraid of imports though. If they are Euro imports they will be almost the exact spec as a uk car, save side airbags and alarm, but at a fraction of the price. The JDM (Japanese Domestic Market) imports have better internals and more power, amoungst other things, they are overall better than the car that carries the same badge in the UK.
Hope this helps,
Ian
Cheers Ian, that has certainly answered a lot of the questions. Thanks for the time and effort. I suppose i just need to find the right car for me! Though I see the road tax will be hitting it hard in the next couple of years unfortunately!
http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/road-tax/?deriv=2795...
Sti Spec D seems the way forward for me I reckon
http://www.parkers.co.uk/cars/road-tax/?deriv=2795...
Sti Spec D seems the way forward for me I reckon
The Spec D STi's are very nice with all leather interior, satnav and better Pioneer stereo system, very unassuming with that little spoiler on the back just like the WRX's, however i would like to point out that the STi has a big dockoff spoiler on the back for good reasons which include downforce and straight line stability as well as a front lip that gives some extra front downforce and stability while braking from high speed.
Standard STi's still have more grunt than a WRX in PPP format but were known to go a bit light at the front when pushing on at the top end due to the flattish undertray under the engine catching air and making like a wing. The newer ones have a small lip on them as does the Spec D.
The Spec D STi will press on a fraction quicker than the std STi as it doesn't have a great big wing on the back to slow it down but to be honest i'd rather be hitting a bend at 158mph with a big wing on the back than with a WRX wing.
Stats:- WRX 145mph / STi 158mph(limited), 15mph and a big wing at those speeds IMHO makes all the differnece to staying on or flying off
Anyway...what do i know....i'm just a knobhead with an old hybrid Frankenscoobyraggywagon
Standard STi's still have more grunt than a WRX in PPP format but were known to go a bit light at the front when pushing on at the top end due to the flattish undertray under the engine catching air and making like a wing. The newer ones have a small lip on them as does the Spec D.
The Spec D STi will press on a fraction quicker than the std STi as it doesn't have a great big wing on the back to slow it down but to be honest i'd rather be hitting a bend at 158mph with a big wing on the back than with a WRX wing.
Stats:- WRX 145mph / STi 158mph(limited), 15mph and a big wing at those speeds IMHO makes all the differnece to staying on or flying off
Anyway...what do i know....i'm just a knobhead with an old hybrid Frankenscoobyraggywagon
Edited by ScoobieWRX on Tuesday 12th August 16:42
The spec.D was only built 06> in the "hawkeye" shape, not in the 03>05 "blobeye" shape the OP is referring to.
The STI spec.D does not have the lower lip, neither does the hawkeye STI.
I've not found the lower WRX spoiler worrying when taking very fast long corners and I've never felt it go light at the front. I have added a small front splitter to mine as it finishes the front end off much more nicely and I may remove my wrx style spoiler for just a boot lip in the future.
The STI is FAR harder, faster, stiffer and much more the pseudo rally car experience IMHO compared to my previous 03 WRX, which was a much more relaxed car. The STI is IMO a totally different vehicle. Drive them both and try and get a decent test drive as they are very different.
The spec.D does not have heated leather, it does have leather and black carpets as standard however. There were only 300 UK spec.D's built. The import version is known as the "A line".
Great fun and very capable cars.
The STI spec.D does not have the lower lip, neither does the hawkeye STI.
I've not found the lower WRX spoiler worrying when taking very fast long corners and I've never felt it go light at the front. I have added a small front splitter to mine as it finishes the front end off much more nicely and I may remove my wrx style spoiler for just a boot lip in the future.
The STI is FAR harder, faster, stiffer and much more the pseudo rally car experience IMHO compared to my previous 03 WRX, which was a much more relaxed car. The STI is IMO a totally different vehicle. Drive them both and try and get a decent test drive as they are very different.
The spec.D does not have heated leather, it does have leather and black carpets as standard however. There were only 300 UK spec.D's built. The import version is known as the "A line".
Great fun and very capable cars.
Totally agree with Dover Nige. Just swapped my 03 WRX PPP for an 06 STI Spec D with PPP. The WRX is a much more relaxed drive than the STI. The STI handles much better, less understeer, but also less forgiving on bumpy roads. The engine response and torque curves are different in both cars. The 06> cars have 2.5l engines too. Take a test drive. Both are great cars to drive and I'd commute in either.
NBON said:
Totally agree with Dover Nige. Just swapped my 03 WRX PPP for an 06 STI Spec D with PPP. The WRX is a much more relaxed drive than the STI. The STI handles much better, less understeer, but also less forgiving on bumpy roads. The engine response and torque curves are different in both cars. The 06> cars have 2.5l engines too. Take a test drive. Both are great cars to drive and I'd commute in either.
NBON, how do you find the ppp on the spec.D..?Was thinking about either ppp or biting the bullet with an aftermarket map.
What's your average out of a tank and what's the throttle response like when you pull off..?
Dover Nige
I test drove the car without PPP, got a price reduction from the garage and had it fitted prior to picking it up. The car still had a years warranty so the PPP still makes that valid when an aftermarket doesn't. The extra power is noticeable top end with better acceleration. The main benefit for me was the extra torque, meaning more flexibility and less gear changes for when I don't want to be such a hooligan. I also like the burble from the prodrive exhaust. Have found the throttle response in 1st and 2nd a bit more delicate but really nothing to be bothered about. Fuel consumption has been around 22/23 mpg. I'd reccommend it, some after markets are similar though, give more power and cost less...... depends if you have a reputable tuner near you and are bothered about the warranty I'd say.
I test drove the car without PPP, got a price reduction from the garage and had it fitted prior to picking it up. The car still had a years warranty so the PPP still makes that valid when an aftermarket doesn't. The extra power is noticeable top end with better acceleration. The main benefit for me was the extra torque, meaning more flexibility and less gear changes for when I don't want to be such a hooligan. I also like the burble from the prodrive exhaust. Have found the throttle response in 1st and 2nd a bit more delicate but really nothing to be bothered about. Fuel consumption has been around 22/23 mpg. I'd reccommend it, some after markets are similar though, give more power and cost less...... depends if you have a reputable tuner near you and are bothered about the warranty I'd say.
Aftermarket tunes are better and more individual to the car whereas PPP tune is basically pretty much set and straight forwards, little tweaking done for fine tuning but pretty much generic. What they charge for a few branded bits and some very mild tweaking is ridiculous. Aftermarkets tunes cost a lot less, give you more flexibility, much more properly useable power and definately more MPG!!
I get 25mpg on a run no problem out of an STi8 engine making c.340bhp, and that was fully laden a little while back on a trip to Scotland. Much better than when my car was a std WRX, even when i'd mapped the WRX it was still no better that c.21mpg tops.
PPP tune is fine for in warranty but personally i would save the £1600 or so and put that towards a mother of all aftermarket tunes when the warranty had run out. You have a choice of very fine tuning houses like Zen Performance, Area52, GRD, ScoobyClinic, Powerstation etc...etc... Lots of reputable tuners to choose from.
I get 25mpg on a run no problem out of an STi8 engine making c.340bhp, and that was fully laden a little while back on a trip to Scotland. Much better than when my car was a std WRX, even when i'd mapped the WRX it was still no better that c.21mpg tops.
PPP tune is fine for in warranty but personally i would save the £1600 or so and put that towards a mother of all aftermarket tunes when the warranty had run out. You have a choice of very fine tuning houses like Zen Performance, Area52, GRD, ScoobyClinic, Powerstation etc...etc... Lots of reputable tuners to choose from.
I don't have much experience of aftermarket tuners, am sure your right. There aren't many good ones in the area of Scotland I live though, otherwise I may have been tempted when the warranty ran out. I'm sure mpg isn't the biggest consideration to anyone who buys these cars, certainly not mine.
For £11K you could get a 2006 model WRX.
I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
NBON said:
I don't have much experience of aftermarket tuners, am sure your right. There aren't many good ones in the area of Scotland I live though, otherwise I may have been tempted when the warranty ran out. I'm sure mpg isn't the biggest consideration to anyone who buys these cars, certainly not mine.
http://www.awdmotorsport.co.uk(Perth) - Brilliant chaps. I have first hand experience of their service and they know Scooby's inside out!! The outside parking bit of their workshop is scoobyheaven!! Top bods and they get Andy Forrest to do all their mapping. Can't ask for better.
http://andyforrestperformance.co.uk
(East Lothian) - Proper tuner, and very successful with it. This chaps reputation goes before him and highly knowledgeable. Another top Scot!!
You've got no excuses now
Reidy10_0 said:
For £11K you could get a 2006 model WRX.
I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
EDM 2006 WRX is every 10K miles for servicing...no different to UK cars. If you're that meticulous to change the oil and filter in between normal services fair play to you, and whoever buys your car after you're finished with it will be getting a cracking motor, but at least do it yourself every 5000 in-between services and save a bloody fortune. Use proper oil (Millers 10W40 on a WRX) and OEM oil filter and you're almost guaranteed a permanently healthy engine. It's really easy to do on Subaru's and will give you some experience on finding your way around your own engine. I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
Also what upset me the most was that they charged me for topping up the washer fluid as an extra job they'd supposedly done when it was already done by me and was topped up just before it's service, so when i saw that on the bill i told them they were taking the pi55 and said i wasn't paying for something that had already been done, for which in the end they didn't charge me for.
I do mine every 5K and used to let Subaru do my servicing up to 70K, but since they wanted to charge me over £160 + extras for a minor service i decided to do all my own servicing and mech work, and the fact it doesn't use a WRX engine any more and what it does now use has been slightly modified
so i prefer to do it myself. That way i know it's been done properly, best materials have been used and no corners have been cut!! Subaru dealerships, no matter how nice they are, can be skanky buggers and their cars are always way over priced!! I had to beat them with a very large stick before they gave me the deal i wanted on my WRX wagon, and in the end they relented.
Right now it's a buyers market...so get buying!!
ScoobieWRX said:
Reidy10_0 said:
For £11K you could get a 2006 model WRX.
I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
EDM 2006 WRX is every 10K miles for servicing...no different to UK cars. If you're that meticulous to change the oil and filter in between normal services fair play to you, and whoever buys your car after you're finished with it will be getting a cracking motor, but at least do it yourself every 5000 in-between services and save a bloody fortune. Use proper oil (Millers 10W40 on a WRX) and OEM oil filter and you're almost guaranteed a permanently healthy engine. It's really easy to do on Subaru's and will give you some experience on finding your way around your own engine. I would not shy away from imports as they are sometimes looked after better than UK cars.
My 2006 WRX is a grey import from Malta with full european warranty, it has been serviced by my local Subaru garage every 4K miles as per the Malta Subaru spec.
So in theory my car is better serviced than a UK car, I have also claimed new alloys etc through my warranty so don’t believe everything a dealer tells you about imports depreciation and warranty problems etc.
UK Subaru dealers are also bloody expensive to buy a second hand car from.
Shop around, my opinion is that Subaru owners generally look after there cars so there must be a few gems out there.
Good luck
Also what upset me the most was that they charged me for topping up the washer fluid as an extra job they'd supposedly done when it was already done by me and was topped up just before it's service, so when i saw that on the bill i told them they were taking the pi55 and said i wasn't paying for something that had already been done, for which in the end they didn't charge me for.
I do mine every 5K and used to let Subaru do my servicing up to 70K, but since they wanted to charge me over £160 + extras for a minor service i decided to do all my own servicing and mech work, and the fact it doesn't use a WRX engine any more and what it does now use has been slightly modified
so i prefer to do it myself. That way i know it's been done properly, best materials have been used and no corners have been cut!! Subaru dealerships, no matter how nice they are, can be skanky buggers and their cars are always way over priced!! I had to beat them with a very large stick before they gave me the deal i wanted on my WRX wagon, and in the end they relented.
Right now it's a buyers market...so get buying!!
The services are around £200 a time.
I know it is a rip off but i knew that when buying the car and got the car cheap so decided that it was the price i would have to pay.
I dont do a lot of miles so it is not too bad and like you said the car is getting well looked after.
Thats the price you have to pay when buying a car with a manufacturers warranty.
Subaru also pulled a fly move on me during my last visit.
I left the car with them and went shopping for a couple of hours.
I arranged to phone and find out when it would be ready before returning.
When i phoned the receptionist said she did not have my number on file and could not contact me to let me know that i needed new front pads so they just changed them for me.
That was very nice of them!
When i asked the cost she told me that the pads were £110.00+VAT plus labour.
I asked for my old pads to put back on the car which they did.
When i got home i whipped the wheel off and the pads looked pretty good to me.
As my services are every 4K i am sure they would last to the next service.
I have since bought the pads from my local car shop for £35 and i will fit them myself.
Oh and they fitted a windscreen wiper and filled my screen wash up to.
I can understand paying someone £40 or £50 per hour if they are fitting a new clutch, ECU, pistons etc but i am not paying that for someone to change bloody windscreen wipers.
4K-5K official services are not correct for an EDM 2006 WRX. They should be 10K which is the correct service schedule for your car. It is absolutely identical to UK cars therefore i would stick to 10K services and your oil/filter change every 5K miles in between.
The official 4.5K service was for Pre-NewAge scoobys. NewAge and onwards WRX and STi cars is 10K servicing.
Subaru stealerships are such a fecking con it's unreal and they will always try it on. My local stealership won't put anything on my car until they have spoken to me, that's always been the arrangement, so what your dealership did was reprehensible.
Thank god they make such a bloody good car it's worth putting up with their b0ll0x for at least the first 50K miles till you get the first cambelt change done by the dealer, thereafter you're better off DIYing.
The official 4.5K service was for Pre-NewAge scoobys. NewAge and onwards WRX and STi cars is 10K servicing.
Subaru stealerships are such a fecking con it's unreal and they will always try it on. My local stealership won't put anything on my car until they have spoken to me, that's always been the arrangement, so what your dealership did was reprehensible.
Thank god they make such a bloody good car it's worth putting up with their b0ll0x for at least the first 50K miles till you get the first cambelt change done by the dealer, thereafter you're better off DIYing.
ScoobieWRX said:
NBON said:
I don't have much experience of aftermarket tuners, am sure your right. There aren't many good ones in the area of Scotland I live though, otherwise I may have been tempted when the warranty ran out. I'm sure mpg isn't the biggest consideration to anyone who buys these cars, certainly not mine.
http://www.awdmotorsport.co.uk(Perth) - Brilliant chaps. I have first hand experience of their service and they know Scooby's inside out!! The outside parking bit of their workshop is scoobyheaven!! Top bods and they get Andy Forrest to do all their mapping. Can't ask for better.
http://andyforrestperformance.co.uk
(East Lothian) - Proper tuner, and very successful with it. This chaps reputation goes before him and highly knowledgeable. Another top Scot!!
You've got no excuses now
[/quote]
Still a bit of a distance but worth thinking about for when 316 bhp isn't enough
[/quote]
Andy Forrest is worth a drive from almost anywhere. He has mapped both my cars and is paid to travel all over the country/world to map cars and that speaks for it self. As has been mentioned several times if the warranty is up then you will achieve more for your money getting a sport cat and a remap than getting ppp fitted.
ScoobieWRX said:
4K-5K official services are not correct for an EDM 2006 WRX. They should be 10K which is the correct service schedule for your car. It is absolutely identical to UK cars therefore i would stick to 10K services and your oil/filter change every 5K miles in between.
The official 4.5K service was for Pre-NewAge scoobys. NewAge and onwards WRX and STi cars is 10K servicing.
Subaru stealerships are such a fecking con it's unreal and they will always try it on. My local stealership won't put anything on my car until they have spoken to me, that's always been the arrangement, so what your dealership did was reprehensible.
Thank god they make such a bloody good car it's worth putting up with their b0ll0x for at least the first 50K miles till you get the first cambelt change done by the dealer, thereafter you're better off DIYing.
I phoned Subaru at the weekend and asked about the service intervals for my car.The official 4.5K service was for Pre-NewAge scoobys. NewAge and onwards WRX and STi cars is 10K servicing.
Subaru stealerships are such a fecking con it's unreal and they will always try it on. My local stealership won't put anything on my car until they have spoken to me, that's always been the arrangement, so what your dealership did was reprehensible.
Thank god they make such a bloody good car it's worth putting up with their b0ll0x for at least the first 50K miles till you get the first cambelt change done by the dealer, thereafter you're better off DIYing.
I was told to stick to the intervals in my service book which is every 4 or 5K miles.
It makes no difference now anyway as i only have six months of warranty to go.
It doesn't surprise me that they would say that because it just means more money for your local stealership!! I asked my local Subaru stealership the other day and the service manager who is a very nice chap and i get on with really well told me 10K servicing is what it should be regardless of what the book says so it's definately money for old rope!!
Glad your warranty is on the way out now, means that pretty soon you can spend some money on the car and get some proper tuning done. When you're ready for some mapping give me a shout
Get a Scooby specialist thereafter to do the servicing if you intend to sell the car one day and need the service history, or if like me you will keep it for ever, retire it and turn it into a dedicated track day weapon then service it yourself.
Good luck!!
Glad your warranty is on the way out now, means that pretty soon you can spend some money on the car and get some proper tuning done. When you're ready for some mapping give me a shout
Get a Scooby specialist thereafter to do the servicing if you intend to sell the car one day and need the service history, or if like me you will keep it for ever, retire it and turn it into a dedicated track day weapon then service it yourself.
Good luck!!
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