K-series used prices
Discussion
Prices of gas guzzling cars are crashing at the moment due to the potential recession, new tax bands and cost of petrol
Do we think that k-series cars will see a small increase in value given that they now offer an even more attractive financial prospect?
A S2 111S with 163g CO2/Km and 40+mpg still offers cheap running costs and must offer just about the biggest bang per buck on the road apart from a westy
Or is the slump in the market more to do with the credit crunch than running costs?
discuss
Do we think that k-series cars will see a small increase in value given that they now offer an even more attractive financial prospect?
A S2 111S with 163g CO2/Km and 40+mpg still offers cheap running costs and must offer just about the biggest bang per buck on the road apart from a westy
Or is the slump in the market more to do with the credit crunch than running costs?
discuss
<runs outside and pats s2 111s, fondly remembers chopping out of e46m3 at right time last year>
Prices will still fall, but for 12K or so you can get a damnned pretty car. With the mileage I'm doing depreciation will occur, but I don't expect to lose the £500/month I did on the m3
Your money would be a LOT safer in a s2 111s than a new focus IMO
Prices will still fall, but for 12K or so you can get a damnned pretty car. With the mileage I'm doing depreciation will occur, but I don't expect to lose the £500/month I did on the m3
Your money would be a LOT safer in a s2 111s than a new focus IMO
Edited by stuthemong on Tuesday 26th August 15:03
the Elise is a low volume niche market car, there are less in the world than most mass production cars like Mondeos are built and sold in a day, it wont even be on the public radar for fuel consumption 
I doubt the credit crunch crap will make any difference whatsoever, except maybe to hurt new sales a bit...I mean if petrol goes up another £1 a gallon, and you do 10K miles a year at 30mpg, thats £6 per week extra to find ...now dont get me wrong, but If I was a person that £6 per week was going to bankrupt, I wouldnt be considering a sports car !
How anyone with enough cash to splash out on an £8K Elise, let alone a new one, is worried about fuel economy I cannot comprehend, the same goes for all sportscars really as they are luxury items....
I doubt the credit crunch crap will make any difference whatsoever, except maybe to hurt new sales a bit...I mean if petrol goes up another £1 a gallon, and you do 10K miles a year at 30mpg, thats £6 per week extra to find ...now dont get me wrong, but If I was a person that £6 per week was going to bankrupt, I wouldnt be considering a sports car !
How anyone with enough cash to splash out on an £8K Elise, let alone a new one, is worried about fuel economy I cannot comprehend, the same goes for all sportscars really as they are luxury items....
The difference for me is that my £8k Elise is my sportscar, my shopping car, my commuting car etc... all rolled into one. I'd love something like an E39 M5 which wouldn't cost a whole load more to buy, but my fuel bills would double. I can see the Elise starting to appeal more to people who like their performance motoring but wish to reign in the spending a little.
Sure,I can understand fuel economy is a great plus point in Elise ownership and yeah, mine was an only car for the 1st 3 years and did 60K miles so at .40p a mile from my employer, it made sense for me to buy it as a company car and it helped pay for itself in the end
I just find it amusing thats all, when you get on a luxury sportscar forum and people are wondering about 20mpg or 25mph making a real difference to them, when they do like 10K miles a year...its pence FFS ! ...Ive seen this on the Aston forums too ...right, you are about to blow £80K + on a car and are worried whether it will do 15 or 20mpg avg for your 5K miles per year ...errrrr
The cost of fuel, for most people, is still the smallest cost of sportscar ownership, like £4-6K over 3 years/30K miles in an Elise ...sure, if you are buying a 10 yr old used Elise, its a bigger part of it, but not if you are buying new and throwing away £10-20K just in depreciation for the fun of it
I just find it amusing thats all, when you get on a luxury sportscar forum and people are wondering about 20mpg or 25mph making a real difference to them, when they do like 10K miles a year...its pence FFS ! ...Ive seen this on the Aston forums too ...right, you are about to blow £80K + on a car and are worried whether it will do 15 or 20mpg avg for your 5K miles per year ...errrrr
The cost of fuel, for most people, is still the smallest cost of sportscar ownership, like £4-6K over 3 years/30K miles in an Elise ...sure, if you are buying a 10 yr old used Elise, its a bigger part of it, but not if you are buying new and throwing away £10-20K just in depreciation for the fun of it
I have to agree, I don't give a flying f
k about how many miles per my car does,
Have to say the depreciation is a little worrying at £3,600 per month so far
On the bright side I had a drive in Maidstone Sports demo Honda SII/Exige today
Now that is one fast car!
I thought Andy was quite a steady driver
I MUST have one
Oh! hang on I wonder how many miles per it does
F.C.
k about how many miles per my car does,Have to say the depreciation is a little worrying at £3,600 per month so far
On the bright side I had a drive in Maidstone Sports demo Honda SII/Exige today
Now that is one fast car!
I thought Andy was quite a steady driver
I MUST have one
Oh! hang on I wonder how many miles per it does
F.C.
bogie said:
the Elise is a low volume niche market car, there are less in the world than most mass production cars like Mondeos are built and sold in a day, it wont even be on the public radar for fuel consumption
I doubt the credit crunch crap will make any difference whatsoever, except maybe to hurt new sales a bit...I mean if petrol goes up another £1 a gallon, and you do 10K miles a year at 30mpg, thats £6 per week extra to find ...now dont get me wrong, but If I was a person that £6 per week was going to bankrupt, I wouldnt be considering a sports car !
How anyone with enough cash to splash out on an £8K Elise, let alone a new one, is worried about fuel economy I cannot comprehend, the same goes for all sportscars really as they are luxury items....
yeah, what he said...I doubt the credit crunch crap will make any difference whatsoever, except maybe to hurt new sales a bit...I mean if petrol goes up another £1 a gallon, and you do 10K miles a year at 30mpg, thats £6 per week extra to find ...now dont get me wrong, but If I was a person that £6 per week was going to bankrupt, I wouldnt be considering a sports car !
How anyone with enough cash to splash out on an £8K Elise, let alone a new one, is worried about fuel economy I cannot comprehend, the same goes for all sportscars really as they are luxury items....
Values wont firm, but you may find some people trading down from boxsters and the like to an elise, which may help residuals...
but your always going to lose money Im afraid.
One of the main reasons we all buy Lotus' is also the reason it will never enter into the mainstream debate regarding motoring - simply, the Elise is a non mainstream, niche, different car.
It does not appeal to the mainstream. In fact, it could do 80mpg and people still would not buy it a) because of the two seats and lack of carrying space
b) the getting in and out effort
C) the purchase price compared to your basic used all purpose box
Sounds overly simple and exaggerated, but it really is as simple and clear as that for most people!
It does not appeal to the mainstream. In fact, it could do 80mpg and people still would not buy it a) because of the two seats and lack of carrying space
b) the getting in and out effort
C) the purchase price compared to your basic used all purpose box
Sounds overly simple and exaggerated, but it really is as simple and clear as that for most people!
Let's not also forget that the Elise is a second car to many - a weekend treat.
When times are tough, it's the luxuries that get the chop - I'd expect to see more hitting the market therefore weakening residuals.
However, when cmparing a lower VED and more efficient 111S to the 111R in terms of pure performance terms, the economy factor could, for some people, make a difference.
When times are tough, it's the luxuries that get the chop - I'd expect to see more hitting the market therefore weakening residuals.
However, when cmparing a lower VED and more efficient 111S to the 111R in terms of pure performance terms, the economy factor could, for some people, make a difference.
bogie,
You miss the point IMO.
I went from a e46 m3 to a 111s elise. My motoring costs have HALVED. literally halved. Cheaper servicing, cheaper tyres, tiny depreciation, cheaper insurance, better economy. It all adds up. It's the reason I chopped out the m3 and into an elise, and it was the right one
It all adds up.
FWIW my M3 'claimed' to get 22 mpg. My ass it did, I calculate 32 on the elise, and I spend £35/week now .vs. £55 in the m3, and that was when fuel was £104.9/l. I think the M3 must have been around a real 18mpg or so, and then 18-32mpg is a difference, almost pays for a A service in a month of motoring!
You miss the point IMO.
I went from a e46 m3 to a 111s elise. My motoring costs have HALVED. literally halved. Cheaper servicing, cheaper tyres, tiny depreciation, cheaper insurance, better economy. It all adds up. It's the reason I chopped out the m3 and into an elise, and it was the right one
It all adds up.
FWIW my M3 'claimed' to get 22 mpg. My ass it did, I calculate 32 on the elise, and I spend £35/week now .vs. £55 in the m3, and that was when fuel was £104.9/l. I think the M3 must have been around a real 18mpg or so, and then 18-32mpg is a difference, almost pays for a A service in a month of motoring!
Edited by stuthemong on Wednesday 27th August 13:14
thats a choice thing though isnt it Stu? youve still got a sportscar thats a luxury to most people, you just choose not to spend so much of your spare cash on it - Im sure there are a quite a few people doing the same right now for various reasons (as highlighted in the auction article in this weeks Autocar)
the Elise is cheap to run overall, but the man in the street just thinks its another flash sportscar, its only us car enthusiasts that know the Elise is generally a relatively cheap car to run in comparison with most other "sportscars" ...i really cant see prices going up, just because its cheaper to run than a Porsche, the potential owners (us enthusiasts !) have known this for 10 years anyway
maybe Lotus should start offering a "TLC" package - free servicing etc for 3 years and that to appeal to the budget end of the market ....and interest free credit as well ...hey...maybe a 1.8TDI version to pull in the eco-green punters some more
the Elise is cheap to run overall, but the man in the street just thinks its another flash sportscar, its only us car enthusiasts that know the Elise is generally a relatively cheap car to run in comparison with most other "sportscars" ...i really cant see prices going up, just because its cheaper to run than a Porsche, the potential owners (us enthusiasts !) have known this for 10 years anyway
maybe Lotus should start offering a "TLC" package - free servicing etc for 3 years and that to appeal to the budget end of the market ....and interest free credit as well ...hey...maybe a 1.8TDI version to pull in the eco-green punters some more
Bogie,
A 1.8tDi would peak my interest
Seriously though, I think the frugal nature of the elise has been priced into the market already. I'm not expecting to 'make' money on the elise, but it definitely appears that I'm losing less than I thought I would. Whereas all other sportscars have bombed recently, the elise hasn't - and thats a good thing for us owners.
I think longer term we will struggle though, as so many elises have been built, so prices on the older K's will be supressed.. but they aren't going too bad really for what they are - economy and tax bracket will help the K engine though, that's a brucy bonus the tax stuff.
I don't expect Mr Smith with his 'out there' 07 plate diesel hatchback in a 'brave' colour will be stepping into the elise.. but I do think that 90% of PH members do know that elises are quite frugal, and people will consider the step into these from other sports cars (as I did) full well in the knowledge of why it makes sense to do so... this can only be good for prices of elises and bad for 3l+ engine sportscars in terms of respective depreciation.
Of course, the main problem with an elise is that it only takes one moment of weakness, and BAM, you are 8-10K down & 1 week later you have a SC honda behind your head. This is where the real 'cost of ownership' of an elise can bite
A 1.8tDi would peak my interest
Seriously though, I think the frugal nature of the elise has been priced into the market already. I'm not expecting to 'make' money on the elise, but it definitely appears that I'm losing less than I thought I would. Whereas all other sportscars have bombed recently, the elise hasn't - and thats a good thing for us owners.
I think longer term we will struggle though, as so many elises have been built, so prices on the older K's will be supressed.. but they aren't going too bad really for what they are - economy and tax bracket will help the K engine though, that's a brucy bonus the tax stuff.
I don't expect Mr Smith with his 'out there' 07 plate diesel hatchback in a 'brave' colour will be stepping into the elise.. but I do think that 90% of PH members do know that elises are quite frugal, and people will consider the step into these from other sports cars (as I did) full well in the knowledge of why it makes sense to do so... this can only be good for prices of elises and bad for 3l+ engine sportscars in terms of respective depreciation.
Of course, the main problem with an elise is that it only takes one moment of weakness, and BAM, you are 8-10K down & 1 week later you have a SC honda behind your head. This is where the real 'cost of ownership' of an elise can bite
Edited by stuthemong on Wednesday 27th August 14:09
Most of my costs have been upgrades. Servicing's £115 a year, £250 every 3 years, other than that it's the silly things like alternators but they can fail on shopping cars.
In 4 years and 40,000 miles I've saved £2,500 over a 111R in fuel and VED - £625 a year buys a lot of stuff and that's just going from great to reasonable mpg.
A story in today's Independent confirms traffic volumes are dropping, as is the average speed as drivers try to save fuel. It's making a difference and I can see cars with good mpg being sought after - some people have even speculated whether a Tesla will work out over time, unlikely as that is!
In 4 years and 40,000 miles I've saved £2,500 over a 111R in fuel and VED - £625 a year buys a lot of stuff and that's just going from great to reasonable mpg.
A story in today's Independent confirms traffic volumes are dropping, as is the average speed as drivers try to save fuel. It's making a difference and I can see cars with good mpg being sought after - some people have even speculated whether a Tesla will work out over time, unlikely as that is!
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