trouble starting both hot and cold - totally baffled? HELP!
Discussion
Hi Guys - 1st posting here, so any help is much appreciated. Basics are: 350i wedge, 1987, recent new head gasket and head skimmed, and now all coolant problems sorted. Runs sweet at 80 degrees, no overflow. One month afterwards, following a 2 week break of not using the car, it now has difficulty starting both hot and cold.
Symtoms:
It turns over nice and quick (new battery),
I can smell fuel.
Have to pump acclerator to "catch" the engine too make it start, as it coughs/splutters. Usually 3rd time on the key before it finally goes. Same when hot.
Sometimes it helps if i pump the accelerator before turning the key.
During the running its perfect, no lag or smoke from exhaust.
Ideas:
My car mechanic has tried 2 different types of plugs not sure what type yet but, - i brought today some B7 ECS as recommended by Pistonheads. SO i might try those?
Other people said:
1. Loose inlet manifold bolts - air getting in affecting the mixture
2. Ignition module on front of dist.cap might need replacing.
3. More simplier - running too rich?
Any of you guys ever come across this...?
please help!
Chris
Symtoms:
It turns over nice and quick (new battery),
I can smell fuel.
Have to pump acclerator to "catch" the engine too make it start, as it coughs/splutters. Usually 3rd time on the key before it finally goes. Same when hot.
Sometimes it helps if i pump the accelerator before turning the key.
During the running its perfect, no lag or smoke from exhaust.
Ideas:
My car mechanic has tried 2 different types of plugs not sure what type yet but, - i brought today some B7 ECS as recommended by Pistonheads. SO i might try those?
Other people said:
1. Loose inlet manifold bolts - air getting in affecting the mixture
2. Ignition module on front of dist.cap might need replacing.
3. More simplier - running too rich?
Any of you guys ever come across this...?
please help!
Chris
ok,
just spoke to another garage i was considering to use and the mechanic said it sounded like a fuel mixture problem, running too rich.
When i think about it, the original mechanic weakened the mixture to get it through emissions test at the MOT last month, ad then riched it up afterwards. It could be possible that the mixture setting has slipped? What do you reckon?
My original mechanic has the ECU mapping thingy to tune it up/down as well, so i might pop it to him.
just spoke to another garage i was considering to use and the mechanic said it sounded like a fuel mixture problem, running too rich.
When i think about it, the original mechanic weakened the mixture to get it through emissions test at the MOT last month, ad then riched it up afterwards. It could be possible that the mixture setting has slipped? What do you reckon?
My original mechanic has the ECU mapping thingy to tune it up/down as well, so i might pop it to him.
Been busy, There is a handy site
http://www.tvrwedgepages.co.uk/maintenance.html
It has a good few pointers and the epistles. Worth a read. Also there is a search function on here for up to 2 years ago. Problem I had was the throttle pot was set wrong (screws came undone), it gave the wrong reading to the ECU that told the gubbins under the bonnet that the throttle was where it was not. So it threw too much fuel in. It would stall on start up from cold and hot. Stall at the lights, flood and so on. It eventually stopped on my way home one night, flooding whilst driving! Set the the pot back to the correct setting and it was fine.
My case mind you but if it is the same on a flapper then easy to check.
http://www.tvrwedgepages.co.uk/maintenance.html
It has a good few pointers and the epistles. Worth a read. Also there is a search function on here for up to 2 years ago. Problem I had was the throttle pot was set wrong (screws came undone), it gave the wrong reading to the ECU that told the gubbins under the bonnet that the throttle was where it was not. So it threw too much fuel in. It would stall on start up from cold and hot. Stall at the lights, flood and so on. It eventually stopped on my way home one night, flooding whilst driving! Set the the pot back to the correct setting and it was fine.
My case mind you but if it is the same on a flapper then easy to check.
chris doe said:
i have no idea - how can i check?
If its got an Air Flow Meter like the one connected to the air intake box here its a flapper.
Check out all your components here:
http://www.vintagemodelairplane.com/pages/Rover_Te...
The majority of all Rover Efi probs are caused by air leaks closely followed by Efi wiring loom connector issues.
Read the Plenum Essay for the former, and for the latter, check the main index for wiring and connector maintenance solutions, followed by a test program from the same index.
hurray hurray! I think i've fixed it! Whilst in the garage with the tubes up its arse reading fuel mixture etc, tinkering with the gub screws on the air filter, we accidently touched the air filter induction hose (one into the plenum), the car misfired and spluttered. Upon further investigation, the hose has punctured a finger size hole, 2" by 1/2" long, we taped this up and voila, the car starts beautiful twice now, on both different days.
Now my thinking is where there was a huge hole on the hose pipe this "tricked" the car into thinking there was more air than there was, thereby weakening the mixture, hence i had to previously pump the accelerator to get it started. Once moving, the air flow was normally regulated by the air filter, hence it was running fine. Does this theory sound plausable?
On a plus side its worked both times, first turn. Its only a relatively cheap part to get. Down side...where do i get such a part?
Someone recommended tvrparts.com or bellhillgarage.co.uk?
Chris
Now my thinking is where there was a huge hole on the hose pipe this "tricked" the car into thinking there was more air than there was, thereby weakening the mixture, hence i had to previously pump the accelerator to get it started. Once moving, the air flow was normally regulated by the air filter, hence it was running fine. Does this theory sound plausable?
On a plus side its worked both times, first turn. Its only a relatively cheap part to get. Down side...where do i get such a part?
Someone recommended tvrparts.com or bellhillgarage.co.uk?
Chris
chris doe said:
Now my thinking is where there was a huge hole on the hose pipe this "tricked" the car into thinking there was more air than there was, thereby weakening the mixture, hence i had to previously pump the accelerator to get it started. Once moving, the air flow was normally regulated by the air filter, hence it was running fine. Does this theory sound plausable?
Chris
About right. You're thinking in terms of a carburettor, where pumping the pedal causes the acceleration pump of the carb to throw in more fuel.Chris
Well the Rover injection does something similar: if you open the throttle rapidly it tells the ECU to squirt all of the injectors at once for extra enrichment. There was probably enough juice floating around for the sparks to light it.
Under normal circumstances the air flow meter knows all the air that is going into the engine although a small bleed is allowed via the tiny filter at the back of one of the rocker covers to aid crankcase fume extraction. A leak upstream of the meter will do as you describe.
Pumping the pedal would almost certainly not work on a modern closed-loop injection system as you'd be confusing the ECU with varying data; good job the Rover system is only one step removed from a carb
Chris - P/No ERC9117
http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/rimmer/rover/v8engine/...
Check back to the index link I gave you for your fault identified in the first bullet on page 4 of the Plenum PDF.
Roger - if it was a river wouldn't it be "downstream" of the AFM.
http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/rimmer/rover/v8engine/...
Check back to the index link I gave you for your fault identified in the first bullet on page 4 of the Plenum PDF.
Roger - if it was a river wouldn't it be "downstream" of the AFM.
Thanks guys for all your help and guidance.
Dare i say it....but i was a bit scepitical if anyone would assist or even answer my queries, so a huge thank you to you all.
I got the part from TVRPARTS.COM for £37 so no damage there and it could be the solution. Once i'll have the new part on, i'll go back and tune it up.
Thanks again for the time being!!!!!!!
Dare i say it....but i was a bit scepitical if anyone would assist or even answer my queries, so a huge thank you to you all.
I got the part from TVRPARTS.COM for £37 so no damage there and it could be the solution. Once i'll have the new part on, i'll go back and tune it up.
Thanks again for the time being!!!!!!!
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