Hayabusa car reliability. How is it?
Discussion
I own a Mini Zcars running a K2 GSXR engine. In order to achieve more power I am thinking of replacing the GSXR with a 2008 Hayabusa.
For those running Hayabusa cars what has the reliability been like? Also how have you found the hydraulic clutch system in a car? The K2 is cable operated which is easily adjusted. Given the Hayabusa is hydraulic and the movement needed to operate the clutch on a bike is minimal how have you prevented over exercising the clutch (slave cylinder) in a car? Also any views on strengthening the clutch?
I could put a turbo on the GSXR which is cost effective….anyone put a turbo on the GSXR with a hydraulic clutch?
For those running Hayabusa cars what has the reliability been like? Also how have you found the hydraulic clutch system in a car? The K2 is cable operated which is easily adjusted. Given the Hayabusa is hydraulic and the movement needed to operate the clutch on a bike is minimal how have you prevented over exercising the clutch (slave cylinder) in a car? Also any views on strengthening the clutch?
I could put a turbo on the GSXR which is cost effective….anyone put a turbo on the GSXR with a hydraulic clutch?
JLF said:
For those running Hayabusa cars what has the reliability been like? Also how have you found the hydraulic clutch system in a car? The K2 is cable operated which is easily adjusted. Given the Hayabusa is hydraulic and the movement needed to operate the clutch on a bike is minimal how have you prevented over exercising the clutch (slave cylinder) in a car? Also any views on strengthening the clutch?
The main reasons people use Hayabusas is because of the huge grunt and because they're a strong motor. A Hayabusa will be putting out similar horsepower to your GSXR1000 but with a lot more grunt and tractability.The hydraulic clutch is fine on mine - I use a Powertec billet slave cylinder. For a standard motor all that's needed for the clutch is some uprated springs.
JLF said:
I could put a turbo on the GSXR which is cost effective….anyone put a turbo on the GSXR with a hydraulic clutch?
It might seem cost effective but how long would it last? The litre engine's much more highly stressed than the 1300.The 2008 Hayabusa is relatively unproven in a car environment at the moment. The large majority of people go for 2007 engines and I was in the same quandry about 9 months ago when deciding if I should go for a 2007 or 2008 engine for my Westfield Megabusa kit.
I eventually decided on the 2007 kit as there were plenty of dry sump systems out there for the 2007, less wiring to do (the 2008 has more, including a switch to reduce power for wet weather etc), but ultimately it was the fact that the 2003-2007 spec engine has been proven to work well in a car environment thousands of times over.
The 2008 will probably be just as good in terms of reliability, and with even more power.
You will need a dry sump system and I'm not sure if they exist for the 2008 yet.
As for the clutch, my Westfield kit came with an actuation kit including a Brembo master and slave cylinder and it works really well. The kit can be purchased from Westfield but it's very expensive.
http://www.westfield-sportscars.co.uk/shop/product...
I eventually decided on the 2007 kit as there were plenty of dry sump systems out there for the 2007, less wiring to do (the 2008 has more, including a switch to reduce power for wet weather etc), but ultimately it was the fact that the 2003-2007 spec engine has been proven to work well in a car environment thousands of times over.
The 2008 will probably be just as good in terms of reliability, and with even more power.
You will need a dry sump system and I'm not sure if they exist for the 2008 yet.
As for the clutch, my Westfield kit came with an actuation kit including a Brembo master and slave cylinder and it works really well. The kit can be purchased from Westfield but it's very expensive.
http://www.westfield-sportscars.co.uk/shop/product...
I too have thought about tubocharging my R1. I spoke to Jack Frost at Holeshot about it, and it would realistically cost me about £5k to go from 160 to 250 bhp (no off the shelf kit as injected version, thay have to do the work in Northern Ireland). That same engine would produce 350 - 400 bhp for a few minutes if the boost turned up, but without expensive additional rods and bolts it would apparently end up blowing a big hole in my bonnet! 250bhp sounds good to me, but I could end up with a car which is generally unreliable in regard to clutches and gearboxes, dry sump reqd, with spiky power hard to modulate on corners. It is a tough one to decide, my current thinking is as i am not into drag racing I think it would make the car less enjoyable. A guy (forget his name, think he is on here) turbo'd his Hayabusa Fury for about 5k. In two years later he has hardly ever had it running properly / reliably, and had now spent closer to £10k trying to perfect it. That puts me off a bit too. Has anyone here have experience of an R1 turbo ( 2003 injected) ?
Thanks. I also spoke with Holeshot. The cost of a turbo for the GSXR is going to be somewhere in the region of £4k. That will give 240hp. A Hayabusa 2008 will give 198hp for £3.5k. I should also be able to sell the GSXR engine for £6-800. The Hayabusa is sounding a better bet.
In the back of the Mini the engine remains in its original position as opposed to being turned in Westfields etc. Should be OK with the original sump.....I think
Thanks for all the above help.
In the back of the Mini the engine remains in its original position as opposed to being turned in Westfields etc. Should be OK with the original sump.....I think
Thanks for all the above help.
JLF said:
In the back of the Mini the engine remains in its original position as opposed to being turned in Westfields etc. Should be OK with the original sump.....I think
It doesn't quite work like that I'm afraid. It's not the engine positions, it's the cornering G force.When a bike corners, the sideways G force is counteracted by the bike leaning over, so the oil is pushed down into the bottom of the sump. A perfect result.
In a car it will not lean over during corners, so the sideways G force will cause the oil to surge. Too much and the oil pump will pick up a dry spot and then you've got problems.
At the very least you would need a baffled sump to try and prevent the surge.
^^^^ What he says.
...although... braking and acceleration forces (which, unless you're on a track, tend to bit bigger, more of the time, than cornering forces) do work the same way on a car and a bike. So it can be argued that retaining the original transverse installation gives closer conditions to those envisaged by the designer for braking and acceleration.
For cornering though, as Laurence says, cars and bikes work in different ways.
...although... braking and acceleration forces (which, unless you're on a track, tend to bit bigger, more of the time, than cornering forces) do work the same way on a car and a bike. So it can be argued that retaining the original transverse installation gives closer conditions to those envisaged by the designer for braking and acceleration.
For cornering though, as Laurence says, cars and bikes work in different ways.
Decision made….. Hayabusa engine going in. 2008 if I can get all the parts I need or if not earlier model with Extreme (or the like) upgrade. Either way 198hp is a big jump from the K2. I also think that anything over 230ish is pointless in a short wheelbase Mini used for sprinting and the occasional track day.
I had Zcars convert my Chesil Speedster to Hayabusa, so it carried a bit more weight than most, plus it was running through the beetle box too. ( 2 gearsticks, 2 gearboxes). All went well until my mate wrote it off and put me in a coma! Great engine and even better without a chain drive on the road. I even had 6 reverse gears!
Why not go type R or Volvo turbo instead as Z-Cars do both these engines in their mini installations? Much much more reliable lumps and in a back to back comparison of my 'bird powered westy (which is much slower than a 'busa) the Mini felt faster 2 up than mine 'Bird with just me in it. That said the Mini type-r was their 255bhp demo car so a chunk more power than my westy.
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