Where did it go wrong for Jenson Button?
Discussion
I think he is still a very good driver. Rubens is no slouch, as he showed when he drove for the team whose name cannot be mentioned on Pistonheads, and Jense has outperformed him.
It will be interesting to see the car next year with Ross Brawn's input as apparently they have stopped developing this year's car.
Even if the car is only slightly better than average Jense will have a great chance strategically with Ross there.
It will be interesting to see the car next year with Ross Brawn's input as apparently they have stopped developing this year's car.
Even if the car is only slightly better than average Jense will have a great chance strategically with Ross there.
It went wrong the minute he left Williams. He should have stayed with them rather than take the bigger pay cheque and moved to BAR. Then his next mistake was staying with BAR and trying to improve the car for years and years while seeing little in return for it although they were competitive in some parts of a season. Now his next mistake is staying with Honda thinking that Brawn and all the financial backing will make them a force to be reckoned with. It may do, but Toyota knows all about how far large financial backing takes you in the sport.
Vesuvius 996 said:
He got a yacht and a jet. And he got lazy.
This is a little harsh on Jenson I think.It's easy to look at any F1 driver who hasn't had a lot of success and say that he got lazy as soon as he started coining it in.
The simple fact IMO is that the longer you go without success in F1, the harder it is to achieve it. It's a question of right place, right time and that needs to be early-ish in your career.
If you're not winning races within a few seasons then your chances of WDC success are historically limited.
Look at all the champions - Raikkonen, Alonso, Schumacher, Prost, Senna, Mansell, they all started winning races within a few seasons and went on to the title. Possible exception here is Hakkinen but he got into McLaren when they were in a low.
Jenson's problem is that he's in a 'new' team. Can someone tell me the last time the WDC was won by a driver not driving for a McLaren, Williams, Ferrari or Bennetton/Renault?**
I remember in 2004 when Jenson had all those podiums at Honda without a win. People were touting him as a replacement for Schumacher at Ferrari.
Jenson's response:
"I can't see the point apart from getting a nice company car"
Failing to see the long-term future of Schumacher retiring and the chance of a race-winning car saw him in the wilderness too long.
I hope Honda improve and do well next season and think that's it very possible for them to score highly in the early season. But I think the established teams will catch up very quickly....
- 1983 by the way - Nelson Piquet in a Brabham-BMW
Muzzer said:
Vesuvius 996 said:
He got a yacht and a jet. And he got lazy.
This is a little harsh on Jenson I think.It's easy to look at any F1 driver who hasn't had a lot of success and say that he got lazy as soon as he started coining it in.
The simple fact IMO is that the longer you go without success in F1, the harder it is to achieve it. It's a question of right place, right time and that needs to be early-ish in your career.
If you're not winning races within a few seasons then your chances of WDC success are historically limited.
Look at all the champions - Raikkonen, Alonso, Schumacher, Prost, Senna, Mansell, they all started winning races within a few seasons and went on to the title. Possible exception here is Hakkinen but he got into McLaren when they were in a low.
Jenson's problem is that he's in a 'new' team. Can someone tell me the last time the WDC was won by a driver not driving for a McLaren, Williams, Ferrari or Bennetton/Renault?**
I remember in 2004 when Jenson had all those podiums at Honda without a win. People were touting him as a replacement for Schumacher at Ferrari.
Jenson's response:
"I can't see the point apart from getting a nice company car"
Failing to see the long-term future of Schumacher retiring and the chance of a race-winning car saw him in the wilderness too long.
I hope Honda improve and do well next season and think that's it very possible for them to score highly in the early season. But I think the established teams will catch up very quickly....
- 1983 by the way - Nelson Piquet in a Brabham-BMW
i think it was pat symmonds at the weekend when talking about Alonso next season that "dont base your deicsion on a single performance" or something along those lines.
button has been given dreams by Honda which have never prevailed, now other teams don't want him as he's paid to highly, and he's know waiting for brawn to make Honda competitive which imo wont happen till 2010 which i think if they haven't sorted it by then button may leave.
button has been given dreams by Honda which have never prevailed, now other teams don't want him as he's paid to highly, and he's know waiting for brawn to make Honda competitive which imo wont happen till 2010 which i think if they haven't sorted it by then button may leave.
Rich VRS said:
i think it was pat symmonds at the weekend when talking about Alonso next season that "dont base your deicsion on a single performance" or something along those lines.
button has been given dreams by Honda which have never prevailed, now other teams don't want him as he's paid to highly, and he's know waiting for brawn to make Honda competitive which imo wont happen till 2010 which i think if they haven't sorted it by then button may leave.
Too much money, too much doing Dani, not enough drive to get the very very best you can out of what you have. button has been given dreams by Honda which have never prevailed, now other teams don't want him as he's paid to highly, and he's know waiting for brawn to make Honda competitive which imo wont happen till 2010 which i think if they haven't sorted it by then button may leave.
In any team there will always be a driver who has same equipment and gets so much more out of it than the teamate...except at Honda where Reubens is in his twilight years and Jenson has pretty much given up.
If I could get the cash and birds he can get while circulating at the back fo the grid, saving the planet in my World car, (see how seriously they take the environment, they have not released any CO2 on the podium for ages!!)then I probably would not be arsed either!
If Honda get a good car next year and some new blood in the driving seat, Jenson will either step it up or, more liekly i am afraid, fall apart like a cheap watch.
I dont think he is the only driver in F1 who actually quite enjoys having duff equipment as it always gives them an excuse.
I think he had the F1 world at his feet once, and shafted a team who had gifted him the opportunity to get to F1, (*remember, he was top 3 or 4 not top man before Frank signed him up) to try to further his own selfish ends.
Agree Williams have been int he doldrums recently, but I hope he regrets his decision to shaft them with that contract thing, as he was bang out of order IMO.
Nice beard though!
With regard to the oft-quoted issues with Jenson's contract at Williams it is worth remembering that despite an excellent debut season where he stood up to scrutiny against the well-rated (at the time) Ralf, he was nevertheless released from driving for Williams at the end of that season and shoved into a Renault that was a complete turd and was where Sutil and Fisichella now are.
He looked up the front of the grid, he could see Montoya in the seat he had the previous year, failing to set the world alight as had been expected and doing, at best, no more than Button could have.
So I for one don't blame him one iota for looking after himself first and foremost from that point onwards. He certainly had a contract with Williams, but he also had zero moral obligation either, yet still ensured he was bought out of the contract rather than simply stiffing Frank like one would expect people in F1 to.
The fact that Frank later said that he would gladly have Jenson back in an instant, says enough to me about his talents on and off the track.
I also wonder at the comment that a move from Williams was a bad one. What have they done since Button bought out his Williams contract? Nothing, barely a podium. Honda delivered a great deal more and showed far greater potential around 2004/5 and Williams have simply not.
The fact that Honda lost their way is not a good reason to suggest that Button should shoulder responsibility for his career going down the wrong path, IMO. I thought he made a great call at the time and had the determination to see it through, and the decency to buy himself out.
Had Honda got rid of Gurning Nick Fry at an early juncture I believe the team would have continued to move forward from their second-best position at the end of 2005 (?) and Button would be a multiple race winner by now.
Yes IF is a big word but I have to say, if I was him and without the benefit of 20/20 hindsight later, I'd have done the same and I guess my chin would have dropped well before now as well...
He looked up the front of the grid, he could see Montoya in the seat he had the previous year, failing to set the world alight as had been expected and doing, at best, no more than Button could have.
So I for one don't blame him one iota for looking after himself first and foremost from that point onwards. He certainly had a contract with Williams, but he also had zero moral obligation either, yet still ensured he was bought out of the contract rather than simply stiffing Frank like one would expect people in F1 to.
The fact that Frank later said that he would gladly have Jenson back in an instant, says enough to me about his talents on and off the track.
I also wonder at the comment that a move from Williams was a bad one. What have they done since Button bought out his Williams contract? Nothing, barely a podium. Honda delivered a great deal more and showed far greater potential around 2004/5 and Williams have simply not.
The fact that Honda lost their way is not a good reason to suggest that Button should shoulder responsibility for his career going down the wrong path, IMO. I thought he made a great call at the time and had the determination to see it through, and the decency to buy himself out.
Had Honda got rid of Gurning Nick Fry at an early juncture I believe the team would have continued to move forward from their second-best position at the end of 2005 (?) and Button would be a multiple race winner by now.
Yes IF is a big word but I have to say, if I was him and without the benefit of 20/20 hindsight later, I'd have done the same and I guess my chin would have dropped well before now as well...
thanetspeedshop said:
Nobody since Chris Amon has made such dreadful career choices as Button + that stupid, straggly beard must slow him down a bit as well...
Amon was better than Jenson, and he certainly wasnt being generally outpaced by a close to retirement team mate at Jensons ageGassing Station | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff