Helping out or being taken for a ride
Discussion
I've a friend called John and I feel like I'm being dragged into his problems which mostly are about money, or a lack of. I think it's got worse as whatever credit crunch we're in has deepened. The help John's asking for from me seems to be increasing in frequency and value and I need to draw a line on it.
Generally I'll help anyone if I can, but for this one I dont know how to do it tactfully. I'm not the sort to tell someone to go f
k themselves, and my subtle rebuttals have gone ignored.
Bit of history, John is divorced and lives with his old aunt in her house. Always skint, works on a seemingly low paid job and is messed about with work a bit with hours and pay. Has a car on tick and cant repay it
Runs up bills on utils, struggles to pay them. Asks to borrow money, only a few quid here and there but fairly regularly. Likes a drink, whether it's to get away from problems or not I dont know, but I've a good suspicion he'll be drink driving, which I've warned him about.
I feel I have to do something because the Aunts health is slowly getting worse, and it's not a particularly happy life she's leading. Whether thats being used as a tug on the old heartstrings by John so I do something I dont know. It's not right though.
I doubt I'd ever see back what I gave out, and it's not really about that. Up until recently it was the odd few quid for diesel, a lift here and there, pack of smokes that kind of thing.
But it's getting a bit more involved now, asking for guarantors on loans was a recent one, which I turned down as I didnt want to get involved in it
Unless something changes, it's going to get to a point where the Aunts house is going to get pulled out from under them, it's still mortgaged and they're a good few months behind and planning to make it good with more credit from another source. John's had it signed over to him since the Aunt retired, and is supposed to be paying it but doesnt earn enough or have enough left in the pot to sort it out. I shouldnt know all this, but I've been told it in the course of conversation.
I could probably buy it off them, but if John's not paying a mortgage, what chance have I got in seeing mates rates rent.
I cant see how John's going to get himself out of the hole he's in. He doesnt seem able to do it himself, so either it's going to go tits, or he's going to need bailing out in a big way by someone who'll probably never be repaid.
Is it wrong to let him sink or swim on his own?
Generally I'll help anyone if I can, but for this one I dont know how to do it tactfully. I'm not the sort to tell someone to go f
k themselves, and my subtle rebuttals have gone ignored.Bit of history, John is divorced and lives with his old aunt in her house. Always skint, works on a seemingly low paid job and is messed about with work a bit with hours and pay. Has a car on tick and cant repay it
Runs up bills on utils, struggles to pay them. Asks to borrow money, only a few quid here and there but fairly regularly. Likes a drink, whether it's to get away from problems or not I dont know, but I've a good suspicion he'll be drink driving, which I've warned him about.
I feel I have to do something because the Aunts health is slowly getting worse, and it's not a particularly happy life she's leading. Whether thats being used as a tug on the old heartstrings by John so I do something I dont know. It's not right though.
I doubt I'd ever see back what I gave out, and it's not really about that. Up until recently it was the odd few quid for diesel, a lift here and there, pack of smokes that kind of thing.
But it's getting a bit more involved now, asking for guarantors on loans was a recent one, which I turned down as I didnt want to get involved in it
Unless something changes, it's going to get to a point where the Aunts house is going to get pulled out from under them, it's still mortgaged and they're a good few months behind and planning to make it good with more credit from another source. John's had it signed over to him since the Aunt retired, and is supposed to be paying it but doesnt earn enough or have enough left in the pot to sort it out. I shouldnt know all this, but I've been told it in the course of conversation.
I could probably buy it off them, but if John's not paying a mortgage, what chance have I got in seeing mates rates rent.
I cant see how John's going to get himself out of the hole he's in. He doesnt seem able to do it himself, so either it's going to go tits, or he's going to need bailing out in a big way by someone who'll probably never be repaid.
Is it wrong to let him sink or swim on his own?
Cut loose, avoid him like the plague, because, as you know, he is not going to suddenly get flush and stop asking for money and favours.
He is not going to land on his feet with a good job, pay back all he owes, and anybody who can afford to go out drinking to drown their sorrows can afford to pay their debts, or they SHOULD do.
He is not going to land on his feet with a good job, pay back all he owes, and anybody who can afford to go out drinking to drown their sorrows can afford to pay their debts, or they SHOULD do.
King Herald said:
Cut loose, avoid him like the plague, because, as you know, he is not going to suddenly get flush and stop asking for money and favours.
He is not going to land on his feet with a good job, pay back all he owes, and anybody who can afford to go out drinking to drown their sorrows can afford to pay their debts, or they SHOULD do.
Good advice. The chaps not helping himself so why should you.He is not going to land on his feet with a good job, pay back all he owes, and anybody who can afford to go out drinking to drown their sorrows can afford to pay their debts, or they SHOULD do.
robinhood21 said:
. The chaps not helping himself so why should you.
Good point, explain it to him in those words and see what his response is. That is assuming you can actually have a discussion about it without him asking you for a fiver, if you don't he will just continue to do what he's doing. He didn't ask you for a loan, though. Being a guarantor may amount to the same thing if he doesn't pay but if he genuinely needs a loan what choice has he got if he can't get credit?
I suppose it depends how much the loan is for, and what he intends to do with it. If he wants £10K to buy booze and fags tell him to piss off. If he wants a few K to buy a van so he can improve his income then I'd help him out. In fact, I did do that earlier this year but instead of being guarantor (I don't deal with loan companies, they are mostly scum) I loaned the guy the money myself. He's now paying me back over three years. If he fails to do that then I'll know not to help out in future. If everything goes OK, like it seems to be, then we're both winners.
I suppose it depends how much the loan is for, and what he intends to do with it. If he wants £10K to buy booze and fags tell him to piss off. If he wants a few K to buy a van so he can improve his income then I'd help him out. In fact, I did do that earlier this year but instead of being guarantor (I don't deal with loan companies, they are mostly scum) I loaned the guy the money myself. He's now paying me back over three years. If he fails to do that then I'll know not to help out in future. If everything goes OK, like it seems to be, then we're both winners.
I suppose it depends on his ability or will to repay you. I have a few good mates who I have known for 20 years or more, and would help them out if I knew they were in the st, even if they could never re pay it..that is what friendship is about...I also had a mate a few years ago who would borrow all he could, tell lies about when he'd pay it back, promise to meet you for a pint and never show up and generally take the piss...I learned from him to never lend to someone who wasn't a true friend who I felt would never reciprocate...cost me a grand but I suppose it was a cheap lesson..
Go with your feelings ... a real mate will always see you right...
t, even if they could never re pay it..that is what friendship is about...I also had a mate a few years ago who would borrow all he could, tell lies about when he'd pay it back, promise to meet you for a pint and never show up and generally take the piss...I learned from him to never lend to someone who wasn't a true friend who I felt would never reciprocate...cost me a grand but I suppose it was a cheap lesson..Go with your feelings ... a real mate will always see you right...
lending to friends will always be grief and i wouldnt unless its under say 1000
saying that though 17years ago my dad lent his friend money to save the business became joint owner and for the ten years has made his money back 10fold and continues to receive payouts so worked out really really well.
J
saying that though 17years ago my dad lent his friend money to save the business became joint owner and for the ten years has made his money back 10fold and continues to receive payouts so worked out really really well.
J
Thanks for the replies.
Just to address this one in particular
I think I know what to do with the rest of it
Just to address this one in particular
carmonk said:
He didn't ask you for a loan, though. Being a guarantor may amount to the same thing if he doesn't pay but if he genuinely needs a loan what choice has he got if he can't get credit?
The issue I had was the 46% APR and that the loan company wanted copies of the deeds to my house if I stood to guarantor it. I'd never take out that kind of a loan myself, but I'd be doing it by proxy if John decided enough was enough and did a runner. I think the intention was to get back level with mortgage and a couple of other things hanging around. It just didnt make sense to me to take out that kind of financeI think I know what to do with the rest of it
andy-xr said:
The issue I had was the 46% APR and that the loan company wanted copies of the deeds to my house if I stood to guarantor it. I'd never take out that kind of a loan myself, but I'd be doing it by proxy if John decided enough was enough and did a runner. I think the intention was to get back level with mortgage and a couple of other things hanging around. It just didnt make sense to me to take out that kind of finance
Exactly the same thing happened to me. When I checked out the company I refused to send them any of my details and therefore could not be guarantor. No way were some scum in a grubby office in chavland going to get their hands on my passport and bank details! It was as a compromise that I offered a lesser amount as a direct loan, at only 6% interest instead of 40-odd %
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