Recruitment consultants question

[dcw@pr]

if an agency says they want 20% of salary as a fee, how negotiable is this likely to be?

[Soovy]

dcw@pr said:

if an agency says they want 20% of salary as a fee, how negotiable is this likely to be?

In this market, very.


Make sure you get a clawback if the person leaves a short time after they start. Pereferably pay some of the fee (say 20%) when they start, and the rest 3 months in.

[mondeoman]

Depends.....

How desperate are they for your business, how good is the candidate, what the salary is etc etc etc..

Its like any commodity, you eventually get what you pay for. If you screw them down too hard on price, they'll put more effort into another client that hasn't screwed them. They have overheads just like any other business.

Turn the question around - how far will YOU allow one of your clients to negotiate prices down for your product.

[dcw@pr]

mondeoman said:

Depends.....

How desperate are they for your business, how good is the candidate, what the salary is etc etc etc..

Its like any commodity, you eventually get what you pay for. If you screw them down too hard on price, they'll put more effort into another client that hasn't screwed them. They have overheads just like any other business.

Turn the question around - how far will YOU allow one of your clients to negotiate prices down for your product.

of course, im not expecting them to do it for free - but what is realistic? 15% 10% 5%???

[tigger1]

dcw@pr said:

of course, im not expecting them to do it for free - but what is realistic? 15% 10% 5%???

If you get an agency down to 15% (12 / 10 whatever) from the 25% they asked for originally, how good a candidate do you think they'll send your way? Will you get the best one's from them - or the one's other employers won't touch.

I'm (sort of) in the recruitment "game" - and it is *just* that, a game.

I don't recruit as such, never will

[dcw@pr]

that's an argument for never getting a discount from anyone though

[KingRichard]

dcw@pr said:

if an agency says they want 20% of salary as a fee, how negotiable is this likely to be?

I used to charge 30% of annual basic salary, but then wouldn't negotiate and give the best service I could. Only had a very small client base, but huge fee's.

Some of the other consultants would take roles for 8-10% of annual. Never made sense to me as they'd have more jobs to resource candidates for and would end up in a right state, missing deadlines and stuff because they didn't have the time.

You pays your money and takes your choice. 20% is about average though, if you're confident in the consultant then it doesn't seem unreasonable.

Always put it out to a few agencies though, with the promise of repeat business to the successful consultant. Give them loads of info but don't be overly specific unless the role DEMANDS it... you can miss some good people by being too picky. Let the consultants make suggestions and you may form a great relationship for future recruitment.

[Dick Dastardly]

What kind of role is it for? The more specialist then the least likely they are to reduce fees as it often costs more for them to find good candidates.

[amir_j]

dcw@pr said:

if an agency says they want 20% of salary as a fee, how negotiable is this likely to be?

Post an ad on Monster, answer and make a few phone calls. Thats all most do

[mondeoman]

We do negotiate down, but once you start down that route you start to lose our guarantee and we want paying quickly and the lowest we'll go, except under VERY exceptional circumstances is 17.5%.

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

[KingRichard]

Dick Dastardly said:

What kind of role is it for? The more specialist then the least likely they are to reduce fees as it often costs more for them to find good candidates.

Yes it does. Some of the posters here seem to think all a recruiter does is trawl monster - yes, monster etc was always a useful source, but the real skill comes in gaining trust from candidates and colleagues in the organisations involved in your target market - then networking through them to find your man. From there it could cost several lunches etc... when the good candidates think about moving, they give you a call.

You don't really think the best candidates need to advertise themselves on a website do you?

In fact, the best candidates a business can get won't have come through a recruiter at all - the most motivated candidates will research their move and target the companies themselves.

[KingRichard]

mondeoman said:

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

God, what a tired old line... Out of interest, what percentage of new clients offer you repeat business?

[amir_j]

mondeoman said:

We do negotiate down, but once you start down that route you start to lose our guarantee and we want paying quickly and the lowest we'll go, except under VERY exceptional circumstances is 17.5%.

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

Those CV databases are easy to access- have done Jobserves myself for a client. And no, if you write a specfic ad then you will get a better response, so many generic roles advertised no wonder. Recruitment is a piece of piss, thats why there is so much competition. The reason clients use you is to reduce Full time HR, plus as an industry most of you are slimy enough to lie through the teeth which HR wouldnt do.

[mondeoman]

KingRichard said:

mondeoman said:

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

God, what a tired old line... Out of interest, what percentage of new clients offer you repeat business?

For me its running at about 75-80%. Nuff said

[mondeoman]

amir_j said:

mondeoman said:

We do negotiate down, but once you start down that route you start to lose our guarantee and we want paying quickly and the lowest we'll go, except under VERY exceptional circumstances is 17.5%.

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

Those CV databases are easy to access- have done Jobserves myself for a client. And no, if you write a specfic ad then you will get a better response, so many generic roles advertised no wonder. Recruitment is a piece of piss, thats why there is so much competition. The reason clients use you is to reduce Full time HR, plus as an industry most of you are slimy enough to lie through the teeth which HR wouldnt do.

Never lied to a client or a candidate thank you.

Take your tar brush and stick it somewhere else.....

[Austin3000]

mondeoman said:

amir_j said:

mondeoman said:

We do negotiate down, but once you start down that route you start to lose our guarantee and we want paying quickly and the lowest we'll go, except under VERY exceptional circumstances is 17.5%.

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

Those CV databases are easy to access- have done Jobserves myself for a client. And no, if you write a specfic ad then you will get a better response, so many generic roles advertised no wonder. Recruitment is a piece of piss, thats why there is so much competition. The reason clients use you is to reduce Full time HR, plus as an industry most of you are slimy enough to lie through the teeth which HR wouldnt do.

Never lied to a client or a candidate thank you.

Take your tar brush and stick it somewhere else.....

Although there are some good recruitment consultants out there 95% of the ones I have dealt with have been very unprofesional.

When im looking for new contracts I must get 10 calls a day and im lucky if one of those is a real job, the rest are fishing for contacts "where were you last, is Joe Blogs still the IT manager there? No? Who is it now then?"...cheeky f**kers!

When the contract/job is real they have often mis-sold it and in some cases altered my CV without my knowledge. It awful when you get into an interview and they ask you things you know nothing about because its been mis-sold to you and they client.

Having said all that, in the last 5 years I have dealt with 2 exceptional recruitment consultants who I trust and have never let me down.

[digger_R]

Have to agree with most of the above sentiment regarding recruitment agencies most of them have simply been wide boys. To be fair it's fairly easy to tell when the agent is full of hot air and just fishing.
No doubt if the market dips which it looks as though it may it should see some of the lower end of the market go to the wall

[amir_j]

mondeoman said:

amir_j said:

mondeoman said:

We do negotiate down, but once you start down that route you start to lose our guarantee and we want paying quickly and the lowest we'll go, except under VERY exceptional circumstances is 17.5%.

They way we look at it is if we do our job properly (and mostly we do) you'll get just two or three candidates that meet YOUR spec (and no, its not just monster that gets used - we have access to about a dozen CV databases so we do get a good trawl through) so you don't have to go through a load of dross to get the right person.

YOu pay for what you get......

If you want to put an add on Monster then sift through 70/100 CVs (and miss all the other CVs that are out there) then feel free.

Those CV databases are easy to access- have done Jobserves myself for a client. And no, if you write a specfic ad then you will get a better response, so many generic roles advertised no wonder. Recruitment is a piece of piss, thats why there is so much competition. The reason clients use you is to reduce Full time HR, plus as an industry most of you are slimy enough to lie through the teeth which HR wouldnt do.

Never lied to a client or a candidate thank you.

Take your tar brush and stick it somewhere else.....

I said most

[Mr POD]

Try make vs buy analysis.

How much would it cost you to put an advert on the main recruitment websites, and in the appropriate trade journal, get someone to sift through the CV's, and come up with an interview short list ?

Assuming the job pays say £30K, do you think you could do it for less than £6K ? I think so.

The company I work with have an employee reference scheme. If you forward someone's CV for a vacancy and that person is employed, you get £1500 after he's been there 6 months. I'm due one payment in 3 months and have another guy being interviewed tomorrow.