Failure to stop (what penalty?)
Discussion
Colleague bumped the back of someone on a roundabout. The car in front continued across the roundabout (and out of sight). He couldn't directly follow due to other traffic on the roundabout, but once he could pull away, he couldn't find the vehicle he hit (or so he says). His car has little more than scratches, but the other car is now being repaired and claimed off his insurance (Police "helped" him exchange details). Next he gets an NIP covering "failure to stop at the scene" which he's filled in and signed along with a covering letter explaining the circumstances.
Anyone got any idea what he's looking at in the way of a penalty? I pointed out not contacting the Police himself doesn't make it look any better, although he says he tried to find the other car but when it wasn't parked the other side of the roundabout, he assumed the other guy "wasn't bothered". He's not interested in avoiding the charge (I suggested the don't sign route), just wants an idea of what he'll get for it.
Sheepy
Anyone got any idea what he's looking at in the way of a penalty? I pointed out not contacting the Police himself doesn't make it look any better, although he says he tried to find the other car but when it wasn't parked the other side of the roundabout, he assumed the other guy "wasn't bothered". He's not interested in avoiding the charge (I suggested the don't sign route), just wants an idea of what he'll get for it.
Sheepy
Not much help I know, but I would have thought he wasn't looking at any sort of penalty at all. If the other guy was nowhere to be found, there is no scene to be stopped at! What was he supposed to do, stop there all on his own & hope matey-boy came back?! I'd get him to talk to a solicitor sharpish 'cos it looks like the powers-that-be may pursue it after all!
Failing to Stop/Report an Accident - sec170(4)RTA'88
The requirement under this section is to do 2 things.
The 1st is to STOP and then to EXCHANGE names and addresses.
Failing to do EITHER is an Offence. The alternative of reporting within 24hrs is only available if there was a very good reason why the driver could not stop or exchange at the time.
It is, however, still an Offence if the driver reports the Accident within 24hrs but could quite clearly have done so earlier.
STOP was defined by Lee v Knapp 1966 as-
To stop and remain at the scene for such time as would provide a sufficient period for a person to require from the driver involved the relevant particulars, name, address, registration number and owner of the vehicle.
In answer to your question, your friend is guilty of the offence whether it be through naivity or not.
He should get himself represented if it goes to Court to put some constructive mitigation.
I would expect him if found guilty to receive a fine and it can carry between 5 and 10 penalty points.
Its not uncommon for a car not to stop for a load of reasons but if he has subsequently reported it, it could have been that he genuinely pulled over in a safe place to await the arrival of the other driver or perhaps he was drunk!! and when hes sobered up 'all is rosy in the garden again'.
Ive encountered all of this over the years but one thing for certain..knowing what i know, if it had of been me i would have called the Police at the very least.
Its very easy for people to make all sorts of allegations at a later date.
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 9th October 16:40
The requirement under this section is to do 2 things.
The 1st is to STOP and then to EXCHANGE names and addresses.
Failing to do EITHER is an Offence. The alternative of reporting within 24hrs is only available if there was a very good reason why the driver could not stop or exchange at the time.
It is, however, still an Offence if the driver reports the Accident within 24hrs but could quite clearly have done so earlier.
STOP was defined by Lee v Knapp 1966 as-
To stop and remain at the scene for such time as would provide a sufficient period for a person to require from the driver involved the relevant particulars, name, address, registration number and owner of the vehicle.
In answer to your question, your friend is guilty of the offence whether it be through naivity or not.
He should get himself represented if it goes to Court to put some constructive mitigation.
I would expect him if found guilty to receive a fine and it can carry between 5 and 10 penalty points.
Its not uncommon for a car not to stop for a load of reasons but if he has subsequently reported it, it could have been that he genuinely pulled over in a safe place to await the arrival of the other driver or perhaps he was drunk!! and when hes sobered up 'all is rosy in the garden again'.
Ive encountered all of this over the years but one thing for certain..knowing what i know, if it had of been me i would have called the Police at the very least.
Its very easy for people to make all sorts of allegations at a later date.
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 9th October 16:40
I don't know all the circumstances, but from what he has told me, the other driver has told the police he did stop once clear of the roundabout. I'm suspicious my colleague didn't stop for a reason (may be one too many 
for example, but I've just got a suspicious mind 
). I've a feeling he didn't look too hard for the other driver 
Might explain his willingness just to get on and take whatever they want to dish out.
Anyway, any advice on the penalty welcome
Edited to complete the post, and to add thanks to those who replied whilst I was typing
>> Edited by sheepy on Thursday 9th October 16:43
for example, but I've just got a suspicious mind ). I've a feeling he didn't look too hard for the other driver Might explain his willingness just to get on and take whatever they want to dish out. Anyway, any advice on the penalty welcome
Edited to complete the post, and to add thanks to those who replied whilst I was typing
>> Edited by sheepy on Thursday 9th October 16:43
tonyrec said:
Failing to Stop/Report an Accident - sec170(4)RTA'88
The requirement under this section is to do 2 things.
The 1st is to STOP and then to EXCHANGE names and addresses.
Failing to do EITHER is an Offence. The alternative of reporting within 24hrs is only available if there was a very good reason why the driver could not stop or exchange at the time.
It is, however, still an Offence if the driver reports the Accident within 24hrs but could quite clearly have done so earlier.
STOP was defined by Lee v Knapp 1966 as-
To stop and remain at the scene for such time as would provide a sufficient period for a person to require from the driver involved the relevant particulars, name, address, registration number and owner of the vehicle.
In answer to your question, your friend is guilty of the offence whether it be through naivity or not.
He should get himself represented if it goes to Court to put some constructive mitigation.
I would expect him if found guilty to receive a fine and it can carry between 5 and 10 penalty points.
Its not uncommon for a car not to stop for a load of reasons but if he has subsequently reported it, it could have been that he genuinely pulled over in a safe place to await the arrival of the other driver or perhaps he was drunk!! and when hes sobered up 'all is rosy in the garden again'.
Ive encountered all of this over the years but one thing for certain..knowing what i know, if it had of been me i would have called the Police at the very least.
Its very easy for people to make all sorts of allegations at a later date.
>> Edited by tonyrec on Thursday 9th October 16:40
Interesting! I called the police to report an accident (where I was a passenger, and the other driver was at fault - reversed out of a minor road) where the other driver got out of his car and looked at his damage then came halfway towards me (my driver was examining his damage) before turning and getting back in his car and driving off (I don't think I looked threatening
). I was asked whether anyone was injured. I said not to my knowledge. Whomsoever had answered the telephone (and wheresoever it was, not 999 BTW), said that in that case it was nothing to do with the police and I should report it to my insurers. I said that I had the registration number of the other vehicle and that the driver had smelled of beer, but they were not at all interested. 
The disparity of treatment is one of the gripes that Middle England has with the police system(s).
Streaky
>> Edited by streaky on Thursday 9th October 17:49
It makes no sense to call the POLICE where the other person you drove into the back of has driven off, surely? Does tonyrec seriously think it's ok to call the BiB for this - what a big fat waste of their time. I thought they had better things to do (no disrespect tonyrec, yertis says you're a good bloke and I believe him).
VioletBeauregard said:
It makes no sense to call the POLICE where the other person you drove into the back of has driven off, surely? Does tonyrec seriously think it's ok to call the BiB for this - what a big fat waste of their time. I thought they had better things to do (no disrespect tonyrec, yertis says you're a good bloke and I believe him).
failing to exchange details is an offence, therefore you should call the bib that what they are there for.
alans said:
It makes no sense to call the POLICE where the other person you drove into the back of has driven off, surely? Does tonyrec seriously think it's ok to call the BiB for this - what a big fat waste of their time. I thought they had better things to do (no disrespect tonyrec, yertis says you're a good bloke and I believe him).
failing to exchange details is an offence, therefore you should call the bib that what they are there for.
Yes, but if the other person is obviously not bothered and obviously doesn't want your details, why should you involve the police? If no one was hurt, can't the two parties invovled make their own minds up?
VioletBeauregard said:
It makes no sense to call the POLICE where the other person you drove into the back of has driven off, surely? Does tonyrec seriously think it's ok to call the BiB for this - what a big fat waste of their time. I thought they had better things to do (no disrespect tonyrec, yertis says you're a good bloke and I believe him).
It makes every sense.....all you are doing is looking after yourself first.
Without stating the obvious here.....i see it all the time and if you dont report it then you are leaving yourself wide open.
Anyway, this type of thing should be reported to the Police Stn direct (its the Law after all!) and a Station Reception Officer will take the details....you are certainly not wasting a patrol Officers time at all.
Another thing...yes, iam a good bloke
If either party in an RTA does not stop at the scene, they must rpeort the incident at the nearest Police station/Police officer to the incident and in any case within 24 hours of the accident occuring.
It is not sufficient to continue 200 miles to your scheduled meeting bypassing several Police stations or Officers then driving home and reporting it at your local nick. In essence this is what happens but does not strictly comply with the law as it is intended.
Any person who hits someone/something, fails to make any attempt to report it, and then gets an awkward enquiry to bat off from the Police after they have hoped it has gone away have only themselves to blame, regardless of the circumstances in which the failure to report came about!
It is not sufficient to continue 200 miles to your scheduled meeting bypassing several Police stations or Officers then driving home and reporting it at your local nick. In essence this is what happens but does not strictly comply with the law as it is intended.
Any person who hits someone/something, fails to make any attempt to report it, and then gets an awkward enquiry to bat off from the Police after they have hoped it has gone away have only themselves to blame, regardless of the circumstances in which the failure to report came about!
madcop said:
If either party in an RTA does not stop at the scene, they must rpeort the incident at the nearest Police station/Police officer to the incident and in any case within 24 hours of the accident occuring.
If you are in an area/town/city that you don't know how do you find out the nearest Police station to the incident?
lancelot said:
If either party in an RTA does not stop at the scene, they must rpeort the incident at the nearest Police station/Police officer to the incident and in any case within 24 hours of the accident occuring.
If you are in an area/town/city that you don't know how do you find out the nearest Police station to the incident?
Maybe ask someone lancelot said:
If either party in an RTA does not stop at the scene, they must rpeort the incident at the nearest Police station/Police officer to the incident and in any case within 24 hours of the accident occuring.
If you are in an area/town/city that you don't know how do you find out the nearest Police station to the incident?
ask a policeman
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