Wednesday 26th November 2008

War on Whiplash

New tests force manufacturers to use their heads

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NCAP rear impact whiplash test

The whiplash insurance gravy train could be running into the buffers as the Euro NCAP regime tightens its rulebook for rear end collisions.

A so-called 'war on whiplash' will use tests devised by UK road safety research centre Thatcham, an insurance-company funded operation that claims to have made pioneering advances in the field of seat collision testing.

It’s no wonder Thatcham has an interest in the whiplash phenomena – figures for 2007 show more than 430,000 individuals claimed they had suffered a whiplash injury, accounting for £1.9 billion of insurance payouts.

The new tests look certain to focus manufacturer attention on new car seat design, as even models offering 5 star protection under the current occupant safety tests have been found wanting in the whiplash department – Thatcham points its finger at the Citroen C5, Ford Kuga and Peugeot 308 CC as particular culprits.

Models that performed well include the Volvo XC60, Audi A4, GM Insignia, Alfa Romeo Mito and the VW Golf VI.

The sled-mounted seat testing for whiplash protection will be included in all Euro NCAP occupant safety testing from February next year.

[Jeffmaniac]

I went and saw this machine at an insurance company open day... it makes so much sense I am surprised no one has done this before.

Could save people a lot of money on their insurance premiums!!!

[[AJ]]

Just get everyone to drive with a 5 point harness, helmet and Hans. Problem solved!

[Mr Whippy]

Jeffmaniac said:

Could save people a lot of money on their insurance premiums!!!

Sounds like those getting insurance on the Kuga, C5 etc, will have higher ones too

Doh.

So how does it work then? Nice article, and a picture, but what does it actually DO?

Dave

[G0ldfysh]

[AJ] said:

Just get everyone to drive with a 5 point harness, helmet and Hans. Problem solved!

nice idea, would need some more mirrors for looking sideways as well though.


The foam surrounding from Demolition man is still the ideal solution.

[cj_eds]

And the morale of the story is, if you want to commit fraud with a whiplash claim don't drive a modern car that's been tested under the NCAP scheme, do it with an bargain banger.

[mikelondond09]

G0ldfysh said:

The foam surrounding from Demolition man is still the ideal solution.

It doesn't matter about the systems ,50% people claim because they need the money not because they have injuries

Edited by mikelondond09 on Wednesday 26th November 13:02

[Ed.]

mikelondond09 said:

G0ldfysh said:

The foam surrounding from Demolition man is still the ideal solution.

It doesn't matter about the systems ,50% people claim because they need the money not because they have injuries

Edited by mikelondond09 on Wednesday 26th November 13:02

need or want?

[mikelondond09]

Does it really matter ? They still act fraudulently

[Dibby]

Ed. said:

mikelondond09 said:

G0ldfysh said:

The foam surrounding from Demolition man is still the ideal solution.

It doesn't matter about the systems ,50% people claim because they need the money not because they have injuries

Edited by mikelondond09 on Wednesday 26th November 13:02

need or want?

From what my parents were offered for their car when someone drove into the back of them - NEED. They were going to face bills and lost time from work for someone else's accident.

.. and for the record they didn't claim after everyone told them to put in a whiplash claim just so they wouldn't be out of pocket.

If insurance companies paid out fairly and didn't leave people out of pocket there wouldn't be half the claims flying about.

[mikelondond09]

Dibby said:

From what my parents were offered for their car when someone drove into the back of them - NEED. They were going to face bills and lost time from work for someone else's accident.

.. and for the record they didn't claim after everyone told them to put in a whiplash claim just so they wouldn't be out of pocket.

If insurance companies paid out fairly and didn't leave people out of pocket there wouldn't be half the claims flying about.

Of course there are people that are affected by crashes( I never said there wasn't) what is happening people claiming thousands for the lightest of bumps.

How about my friend brushed his van bumper while leaving a petrol station against a brand new Q7 , he took roughly about 1 inch of paint from the fender while the owner was filling his car up .

2 weeks later bill comes for a whole new bumper and whiplash claim of £2000.00 , when clearly he wasnt even in the car

[Mr POD]

cj_eds said:

And the morale of the story is, if you want to commit fraud with a whiplash claim don't drive a modern car that's been tested under the NCAP scheme, do it with an bargain banger.

430,000 individuals claimed they had suffered a whiplash injury, accounting for £1.9 billion of insurance payouts.


Unless you can see the blood, or X-ray the break, then Don't pay out I say.

Mrs Alison Campbell you are one of the fraudulant claimers. I hope the holiday or conservatory was nice. Lying bh. I hit the drivers side wing of your car at about 40 mph and peeled off the front indicator from the back, the impact was nothing. and yet you managed to claim injuries for whiplash. I've been over bigger humps in the road and had more of a jolt. My car was written off by driving up the curb at 40 with both wheels locked, causing much suspension damage. But You? Total Fraud. Bad vibes to you forever you lying scum.

[Mr Whippy]

Mr POD said:

cj_eds said:

And the morale of the story is, if you want to commit fraud with a whiplash claim don't drive a modern car that's been tested under the NCAP scheme, do it with an bargain banger.

430,000 individuals claimed they had suffered a whiplash injury, accounting for £1.9 billion of insurance payouts.


Unless you can see the blood, or X-ray the break, then Don't pay out I say.

Mrs Alison Campbell you are one of the fraudulant claimers. I hope the holiday or conservatory was nice. Lying bh. I hit the drivers side wing of your car at about 40 mph and peeled off the front indicator from the back, the impact was nothing. and yet you managed to claim injuries for whiplash. I've been over bigger humps in the road and had more of a jolt. My car was written off by driving up the curb at 40 with both wheels locked, causing much suspension damage. But You? Total Fraud. Bad vibes to you forever you lying scum.

Whiplash isn't a break.

Infact it's pretty bloody nasty really. In my case I didn't get symptoms right away, as my heavily bruised foot and the pain killers for that, masked any other pain for a week or so...

They can tell, as far as I know, clinically, by checking your neck and doing movement checks with certain verterbrae locked to find the spasmodic muscles or locked muscles.

I guess some people just go in lying and it's hard to check 100% either way.

But either way, proper whiplash isn't nice. BUT, good exercise is an easy and effective cure... I think my problem was no one educated me what whiplash really was, or how to make it better with exercise over time, it just seemed total obsession over reports and claims and the money side, not the quick recovery side.



Dave

[Mr POD]

Mr Whippy said:

Mr POD said:

cj_eds said:

And the morale of the story is, if you want to commit fraud with a whiplash claim don't drive a modern car that's been tested under the NCAP scheme, do it with an bargain banger.

430,000 individuals claimed they had suffered a whiplash injury, accounting for £1.9 billion of insurance payouts.


Unless you can see the blood, or X-ray the break, then Don't pay out I say.

Mrs Alison Campbell you are one of the fraudulant claimers. I hope the holiday or conservatory was nice. Lying bh. I hit the drivers side wing of your car at about 40 mph and peeled off the front indicator from the back, the impact was nothing. and yet you managed to claim injuries for whiplash. I've been over bigger humps in the road and had more of a jolt. My car was written off by driving up the curb at 40 with both wheels locked, causing much suspension damage. But You? Total Fraud. Bad vibes to you forever you lying scum.

Whiplash isn't a break.

Infact it's pretty bloody nasty really. In my case I didn't get symptoms right away, as my heavily bruised foot and the pain killers for that, masked any other pain for a week or so...

They can tell, as far as I know, clinically, by checking your neck and doing movement checks with certain verterbrae locked to find the spasmodic muscles or locked muscles.

I guess some people just go in lying and it's hard to check 100% either way.

But either way, proper whiplash isn't nice. BUT, good exercise is an easy and effective cure... I think my problem was no one educated me what whiplash really was, or how to make it better with exercise over time, it just seemed total obsession over reports and claims and the money side, not the quick recovery side.



Dave

Yes. And the 90% who are faking it, do those in real pain No favours. If there was NO money in it, then the 10% would have better treatment.

[collateral]

Jeffmaniac said:

Could save people a lot of money on their insurance premiums!!!

Not unless there's a big change in the groupings.

The industry's fixation on 0-60 and displacement is what forces people into flimsy, cheap to insure tin cans in the first place

[tps23]

Example of very dodgy claims. i slid into the back of a car on a wet roundabout when they started to pull off then stopped and barely nudged it. Having got out, apologised and asked if anyone was hurt i was told everyone was ok. No insurance claim was processed as no damage was done. 8 month later my insurance contacted me to say a whiplish claim had been submitted...

[ebo]

Why are there legions of otherwise unemployable oiks armed with clipboards allowed to wander our streets haranguing passers-by for any chance of a 'Where there's blame there's a claim' scenarios?

[tridave]

Mr Whippy said:

Jeffmaniac said:

Could save people a lot of money on their insurance premiums!!!

Sounds like those getting insurance on the Kuga, C5 etc, will have higher ones too

Doh.

So how does it work then? Nice article, and a picture, but what does it actually DO?

Dave

The test works with the dummy set in design position ? Does not matter how good the seat design it will not stop a whiplash injury if you are leaning forward and anything not in design position - how many people do yyou see that sit like test dummy ? Will not reduce claims 1 bit.

[phat_phil1987]

[AJ] said:

Just get everyone to drive with a 5 point harness, helmet and Hans. Problem solved!

dont rule out anyting with the current Health and Safety crazyness

[Ed.]

Dibby said:

Ed. said:

mikelondond09 said:

G0ldfysh said:

The foam surrounding from Demolition man is still the ideal solution.

It doesn't matter about the systems ,50% people claim because they need the money not because they have injuries

Edited by mikelondond09 on Wednesday 26th November 13:02

need or want?

From what my parents were offered for their car when someone drove into the back of them - NEED. They were going to face bills and lost time from work for someone else's accident.
.. and for the record they didn't claim after everyone told them to put in a whiplash claim just so they wouldn't be out of pocket.
If insurance companies paid out fairly and didn't leave people out of pocket there wouldn't be half the claims flying about.

I'm not referring to genuine claims which clearly need the money but the theiving bds making the false claims, staged crashes etc. that abuse the system and give the insurance companies a valid reason to make the claims process a nightmare.

[Mr POD]

I wrote off my car and was offered £650 (minus the excess). In the end we agreed £1350 minus the excess.
Is it some wonder that given the opportunity most people would fake the severity of of their mild discomfort, given that most people believe insurance companies to be no better than muggers ?

Anyway, thinking out of the box for one monent. If it was not for whiplash claims the holiday industry would be on it's arse.