TDA - is this legal?

[jamoor]

Well we recieved a circular from the TDA http://www.tda.gov.uk/ with words to the affect that the countrys staff rooms arent as mixed and "ethnically diverse" as the class rooms, and that kids from different ethnic backgrounds respond better to ethnic teachers.

Essentially it says you have a better chance of being a teacher if you're skin colour is different (I kid you not, on the envelope it says "Believe it or not, your skin colour does make a difference)

Now, last time I checked this is discrimination, or are school exempt from it?

[Airbag]

jamoor said:

Well we recieved a circular from the TDA http://www.tda.gov.uk/ with words to the affect that the countrys staff rooms arent as mixed and "ethnically diverse" as the class rooms, and that kids from different ethnic backgrounds respond better to ethnic teachers.

Essentially it says you have a better chance of being a teacher if you're skin colour is different (I kid you not, on the envelope it says "Believe it or not, your skin colour does make a difference)

Now, last time I checked this is discrimination, or are school exempt from it?

Affirmative action =/= unlawful discrimination

discrimination =/= a crime


HTH

[BigLepton]

Airbag said:

jamoor said:

Well we recieved a circular from the TDA http://www.tda.gov.uk/ with words to the affect that the countrys staff rooms arent as mixed and "ethnically diverse" as the class rooms, and that kids from different ethnic backgrounds respond better to ethnic teachers.

Essentially it says you have a better chance of being a teacher if you're skin colour is different (I kid you not, on the envelope it says "Believe it or not, your skin colour does make a difference)

Now, last time I checked this is discrimination, or are school exempt from it?

Affirmative action =/= unlawful discrimination

discrimination =/= a crime


HTH

92% of the UK population are white. Does this mean that more than 92% of teachers are white?

[Airbag]

BigLepton said:

Airbag said:

jamoor said:

Well we recieved a circular from the TDA http://www.tda.gov.uk/ with words to the affect that the countrys staff rooms arent as mixed and "ethnically diverse" as the class rooms, and that kids from different ethnic backgrounds respond better to ethnic teachers.

Essentially it says you have a better chance of being a teacher if you're skin colour is different (I kid you not, on the envelope it says "Believe it or not, your skin colour does make a difference)

Now, last time I checked this is discrimination, or are school exempt from it?

Affirmative action =/= unlawful discrimination

discrimination =/= a crime


HTH

92% of the UK population are white. Does this mean that more than 92% of teachers are white?

What percentage of school age children in the UK are white?

[Tom55]

its legal if encouraging more people from ethnic minority groups to apply, but not if only accepting applications from those groups.

Also just because whole of UK is 91% white according to last census, that isnt spread quite the same way, several areas are far more ethnically diverse and will have a higher percentage of BME schoolchildren so might benefit from having similar ratio of teachers as pupils in that school. Which is what the pamphlet sounds like it is suggesting.

Edited by Tom55 on Sunday 30th November 01:20

[Redneck Rocket]

Tom55]BME[footnote]Edited by Tom55 on Sunday 30th November 01:20[/footnote said:

Help me out? What's BME?

[sjg]

Black / Minority Ethnic.

By the same token, if you're a male primary school teacher you're pretty much guaranteed an interview at any job you apply for. They're in very short supply, and again schools want teaching staff that reflect the mix of pupils in the school.

[bitwrx]

So employers are allowed to use gender/ethnicity as a basis for selection.

Funny, I thought they weren't.

[voyds9]

Tom55 said:

its legal if encouraging more people from ethnic minority groups to apply, but not if only accepting applications from those groups.

Also just because whole of UK is 91% white according to last census, that isnt spread quite the same way, several areas are far more ethnically diverse and will have a higher percentage of BME schoolchildren so might benefit from having similar ratio of teachers as pupils in that school. Which is what the pamphlet sounds like it is suggesting.

Edited by Tom55 on Sunday 30th November 01:20

Does that mean that the whites should fit in with the BME's and not learn English until they get to school.

[scruffy]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

that would've been funny... normally.

[Brown and Boris]

BigLepton said:

Airbag said:

jamoor said:

Well we recieved a circular from the TDA http://www.tda.gov.uk/ with words to the affect that the countrys staff rooms arent as mixed and "ethnically diverse" as the class rooms, and that kids from different ethnic backgrounds respond better to ethnic teachers.

Essentially it says you have a better chance of being a teacher if you're skin colour is different (I kid you not, on the envelope it says "Believe it or not, your skin colour does make a difference)

Now, last time I checked this is discrimination, or are school exempt from it?

Affirmative action =/= unlawful discrimination

discrimination =/= a crime


HTH

92% of the UK population are white. Does this mean that more than 92% of teachers are white?

No, 96% of teachers are White and about 88% of kids. In towens/cities the % of black and asian kids is often higher.

I think the TDA, rather hamfistedly, are saying that youi should encourage people who want to be teachers, and that having some more Asian and Black teachers would help because they tend to be good role models for Black and Asian kids (esp. black boys).


Encouraging isn't positive discrimination, it is positive action. A bit like pointing out to women the careers in engineering and the military or in recruitment ads for trainee primary school teachers having pics of men (who tend not to go into primary teaching).

Thing is they often put the job of selling the meassge into the hands of the terminally stupid who can't see the line between encouraging, and suggesting or even creating favouritism.

Edited by Brown and Boris on Sunday 30th November 09:48

[s3fella]

Maybe we should just recruit teachers, the people charged with the task of educating the future of our country, on the basis of their abilities and desire to do the job, rather than what colour skin they have......?

A crazy idea, but it might just work.....

[Tom55]

voyds9 said:

Tom55 said:

its legal if encouraging more people from ethnic minority groups to apply, but not if only accepting applications from those groups.

Also just because whole of UK is 91% white according to last census, that isnt spread quite the same way, several areas are far more ethnically diverse and will have a higher percentage of BME schoolchildren so might benefit from having similar ratio of teachers as pupils in that school. Which is what the pamphlet sounds like it is suggesting.

Edited by Tom55 on Sunday 30th November 01:20

Does that mean that the whites should fit in with the BME's and not learn English until they get to school.

What an interesting viewpoint, not sure what you mean by it, are you suggesting that parents shouldnt speak to their children until they reach school age? sorry I am really dont undersatnd what your saying

[Tom55]

s3fella said:

Maybe we should just recruit teachers, the people charged with the task of educating the future of our country, on the basis of their abilities and desire to do the job, rather than what colour skin they have......?

A crazy idea, but it might just work.....

I think thats what their trying to do, find the right people to do the job, but also recognise that there may be those not applying, who would be the right people with the the right abilities and desire, because of the coulour of their skin..or because their male, I dont think they are saying apply for this job if your black and we will give it to you

[Eric Mc]

There does seem to be some massive preconception that people from ethnic minorities are somehow reluctant to enter certain professions and therefore the rest of us have to bend over backwards to accomodate people from these backgrounds even if they are not as well qualified as others.

Would it not be better to inculcate in these minorities a desire to educate themselves and progress by hard work and qualification. Having said that, there are many professions which are often over represented by "minorities" and no one seems to be indicating that whites are somewhow being "left out".

[nownek]

Eric Mc said:

Having said that, there are many professions which are often over represented by "minorities" and no one seems to be indicating that whites are somewhow being "left out".

Which professions Eric? Genuine question.

[jamoor]

nownek said:

Eric Mc said:

Having said that, there are many professions which are often over represented by "minorities" and no one seems to be indicating that whites are somewhow being "left out".

Which professions Eric? Genuine question.

Doctors for a start.

[eccles]

nownek said:

Eric Mc said:

Having said that, there are many professions which are often over represented by "minorities" and no one seems to be indicating that whites are somewhow being "left out".

Which professions Eric? Genuine question.

Childrens TV presenters....

[Munter]

Will they be isueing one encouraging men to teach as well?

What % of kids are male?
What % of teachers are male?

[voyds9]

Tom55 said:

voyds9 said:

Tom55 said:

its legal if encouraging more people from ethnic minority groups to apply, but not if only accepting applications from those groups.

Also just because whole of UK is 91% white according to last census, that isnt spread quite the same way, several areas are far more ethnically diverse and will have a higher percentage of BME schoolchildren so might benefit from having similar ratio of teachers as pupils in that school. Which is what the pamphlet sounds like it is suggesting.

Edited by Tom55 on Sunday 30th November 01:20

Does that mean that the whites should fit in with the BME's and not learn English until they get to school.

What an interesting viewpoint, not sure what you mean by it, are you suggesting that parents shouldnt speak to their children until they reach school age? sorry I am really dont undersatnd what your saying

I work in an area with a large Pakistani community and a lot of these children really haven't heard English until they get to school, school then has to spend resources to teach them English before they can teach them the required subjects.