Should I risk buying a high mileage S Type diesel?
Discussion
I'm looking into buying a used high mileage s type diesel. I have a budget of around 6.5k - 7k, on autotrader they start around 6k. This will be my first Jag and I've done hours and hours of reading up on the jag forum regarding used s type's. The most common problem I keep stumbling on is the problematic ZF automatic gearbox. I just wanted to know what percentage of Jags this affected as it is the only worry that is putting me off buying one. All the s type's I'm looking at have full Jag service history. Is there any other pitfalls of buying a high mileage post 2004 S type. I've read that the 2.7 twin turbo diesel is supposed to be an excellent engine. I've also read that the ZF gearbox also is used in other manufactures. If it wasn't for the gearbox problems I would go out tomorrow and buy one. A lot of owners say that new software and re-flushing of the gearbox oil with new oil seems to solve the lurching problem, but some owners have had to have new transmissions fitted. That is a worry as I don't have a spare £3-4k lying around.
There's a very, very angry S Type owner with his own site - Google "The Lurch" if you've not already done so, who really needs to get out and meet people a bit more IMO.
Have a look on Honest John's site (Daily Telegraph) for more S Type info. I've considered an S Type and from what I've read a gearbox oil change and / or sofware re load usually does the trick.
You might find it worthwhile joining the Jaguar Enthusiasts' Club before you buy. Club members have free access to technicial experts and there's also a couple of transmission specalists who advertise in the magazine. A few phone calls before you part with lots of beer tokens could be all you need to put your mind at rest....
.....or persuade you to buy an XJ
instead
Have a look on Honest John's site (Daily Telegraph) for more S Type info. I've considered an S Type and from what I've read a gearbox oil change and / or sofware re load usually does the trick.
You might find it worthwhile joining the Jaguar Enthusiasts' Club before you buy. Club members have free access to technicial experts and there's also a couple of transmission specalists who advertise in the magazine. A few phone calls before you part with lots of beer tokens could be all you need to put your mind at rest....
.....or persuade you to buy an XJ
insteadSand1,
I have an S-Type, but not the diesel. I have had some gearbox probs which I have posted on the PH Jag site. I still consider it a great car and have no second thoughts about keeping it for the forseable future. Send me an e-mail if you'd like more info.
BTW, the same 6 speed gearbox is used by BMW and Mercedes and I do know they have had similar problems with it.
It is a great gearbox in my view!
R.
I have an S-Type, but not the diesel. I have had some gearbox probs which I have posted on the PH Jag site. I still consider it a great car and have no second thoughts about keeping it for the forseable future. Send me an e-mail if you'd like more info.
BTW, the same 6 speed gearbox is used by BMW and Mercedes and I do know they have had similar problems with it.
It is a great gearbox in my view!
R.
Thanks Steve and Leaper for the info, it's made me feel more confident about buying an s type. I have checked the Lurch website out, the guy seems very passionate about the gearbox problem. A lot of people have said to me that website forums are places where people write about their cars when they have problems but you never really hear about the cars that don't have problems. I'm sure this gearbox problem only affects a small percentage of Jags compared to how many that don't have the problem. I checked out Honest John and it is a very informative website, thanks. I'm still confident I'll find an 80k to 90k Jag S type diesel especially in these hard times where cars are now so cheap. High mileage does not put me off as cars in this day and age go on to do 250,000 miles with no problems as long as they are serviced regularly. The Jags I've seen have all got main dealer S/History and are mainly one owner cars ( I presume company cars ).
Passionate isn't quite the word I'd use.
We had a couple of customers rather like him when I was in the trade. These idiots are a monumental pain in the rectal area who either really have no idea, can't drive or have impossible expectations of their shiny new car. Unfortunateley he's generated the S Type enough bad publicity to put doubts in people's minds, but frankly if any car really was as problematicial as he claims the S Type is the manufacturer would have gone out of buisness long ago.
Apart from the usual carefull look and think before you buy a used car, you do need to have a listen to the rear suspension, and make sure any clonks are fixed or covered under warranty - the rear wishbone arms have bushes fitted that wear - not that that's anything unusual on a high mileage car but the price of replacements is astromical.
Make sure you buy a good one and on a higher mileage car budget for a full fluid change - the whole lot including the gearbox and 'diff, and keep a few quid aside for regular maintainence. Used Jaguar values have plummeted over the last year and you'll see cars around now you couldn't have even thought about about buying a while ago.
There's even some very reasonably priced S Types on the Jaguar Approved site at the moment
We had a couple of customers rather like him when I was in the trade. These idiots are a monumental pain in the rectal area who either really have no idea, can't drive or have impossible expectations of their shiny new car. Unfortunateley he's generated the S Type enough bad publicity to put doubts in people's minds, but frankly if any car really was as problematicial as he claims the S Type is the manufacturer would have gone out of buisness long ago.
Apart from the usual carefull look and think before you buy a used car, you do need to have a listen to the rear suspension, and make sure any clonks are fixed or covered under warranty - the rear wishbone arms have bushes fitted that wear - not that that's anything unusual on a high mileage car but the price of replacements is astromical.
Make sure you buy a good one and on a higher mileage car budget for a full fluid change - the whole lot including the gearbox and 'diff, and keep a few quid aside for regular maintainence. Used Jaguar values have plummeted over the last year and you'll see cars around now you couldn't have even thought about about buying a while ago.
There's even some very reasonably priced S Types on the Jaguar Approved site at the moment
yeah Steve I agree there are some eccentric people out there. I have to agree S Type's and other luxury cars have really come down in value in the last few months. The only problem is I'm going to have to part exchange my own vehicle which I'm going to take a big hit on. It's a 2005 Seat Ibiza Cupra Tdi in Lunar Grey, 54000 miles, Full Seat S/History, 1 Previous Owner, 4 months AA Warranty remaining. I tried to sell it privately a few months ago but I didn't have any luck, suprising really as it falls in the low CO2 bracket (£120 a year to tax). Seems all cars are are suffering in the credit crunch. I only bought it in May 2008 from a dealer for £8900, I did pay top wack for it. I believe I might get £6k part exchange but not sure, I've got about another £1k in cash to add.
My S went 6 months or so ago at 84K, it was a 54 2.7SE, I must admit if I'd have kept it longer I would have had the gearbox oil changed. The last service was a bit eyewatering at around a grand, lots on small jobs like wipers & brakes which I could have done myself if I'd had the time. I did write a 1/2 page report on it here so have a search.
I replaced it with annuver one so it can't have been that bad
I replaced it with annuver one so it can't have been that bad
Well people I braved it and bought my first Jag (2004 Jag S Type diesel SE). It's done 101,000 miles, Full Jag history and 1 owner from new (ex jag demo), all the extras from the options list. Drives like new and looks beautiful in dark blue. The only thing I noticed was when I lifted the boot carpet to look at the spare wheel there was a tiny amount of water in the corner, I also noticed the nearside rear light cluster had condensation in it. I've just been looking at the Jaguar forum and it seems like it is a common problem. Some people say it is due to the boot seal and others say they have replaced the seal and it has not fixed the problem. They talk about using sealent to seal areas around the light cluster or the boot latch. I've never had a car where the boot has leaked so I hope it won't be a big or expensive problem. Otherwise the car is brilliant!!
Leaks can be a proper PITA to find.
Put the OH in the boot with a torch and run a garden hose over the seals and lights starting at the lowest point and slowly working upwards, or dry it all out with a hairdryer, than use the hose. Any newly wetted point is usually where it's getting in.
If the boot seal is suspect, shut the boot traping strips cut from a piece of A4 paper between the lid and rubber seal and then try to pull the paper out. Work your way round the circumference of the boot lid. Any spot where the paper comes out with little or no resistance is a likley leak. You'll obviously need smaller strips to check the corners.
Chances are it's a seal gone round one of the rear light clusters. A thorough clean and a little Silicon sealant will usually do the trick.
I like doing these type of repairs - they don't cost any money
Put the OH in the boot with a torch and run a garden hose over the seals and lights starting at the lowest point and slowly working upwards, or dry it all out with a hairdryer, than use the hose. Any newly wetted point is usually where it's getting in.
If the boot seal is suspect, shut the boot traping strips cut from a piece of A4 paper between the lid and rubber seal and then try to pull the paper out. Work your way round the circumference of the boot lid. Any spot where the paper comes out with little or no resistance is a likley leak. You'll obviously need smaller strips to check the corners.
Chances are it's a seal gone round one of the rear light clusters. A thorough clean and a little Silicon sealant will usually do the trick.
I like doing these type of repairs - they don't cost any money
Jaguar steve said:
Leaks can be a proper PITA to find.
Put the OH in the boot with a torch and run a garden hose over the seals and lights starting at the lowest point and slowly working upwards, or dry it all out with a hairdryer, than use the hose. Any newly wetted point is usually where it's getting in.
If the boot seal is suspect, shut the boot traping strips cut from a piece of A4 paper between the lid and rubber seal and then try to pull the paper out. Work your way round the circumference of the boot lid. Any spot where the paper comes out with little or no resistance is a likley leak. You'll obviously need smaller strips to check the corners.
Chances are it's a seal gone round one of the rear light clusters. A thorough clean and a little Silicon sealant will usually do the trick.
I like doing these type of repairs - they don't cost any money
talking of leaks, I have borrowed an old L reg 405 whilst saving up for an X Type - it is 1 inch deep in water! - Windows were misting up all the time - found boot carpet soaking so removed it - now find under rear seat (concave well) and under main carpets the soundproofing (diesel) is rotted through and full of water! - Only thing I have found so far is one rear lamp cluster only secured on one side however present owner had changed that and problem was there before.Put the OH in the boot with a torch and run a garden hose over the seals and lights starting at the lowest point and slowly working upwards, or dry it all out with a hairdryer, than use the hose. Any newly wetted point is usually where it's getting in.
If the boot seal is suspect, shut the boot traping strips cut from a piece of A4 paper between the lid and rubber seal and then try to pull the paper out. Work your way round the circumference of the boot lid. Any spot where the paper comes out with little or no resistance is a likley leak. You'll obviously need smaller strips to check the corners.
Chances are it's a seal gone round one of the rear light clusters. A thorough clean and a little Silicon sealant will usually do the trick.
I like doing these type of repairs - they don't cost any money
Checked underneath, drain plugs are present... - think i am going to have to source some replacement sets of insulation and dry out carpets + de-humidify remaining interior trim...
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