URGENT HELP NEEDED PLEASE
Discussion
We're supposed to be going away on holiday Monday in the Legacy (BH5 GTB - EJ25) but today I popped down the road to the shop and when I came out the car wouldn't start.
Sods law, I only have breakdown cover on the TVR and I can't take that cos I need to take all the luggage and 4 bikes on the bike rack. I've tried joining a breakdown company but they're all saying 48hrs before cover starts and besides that I know more about cars than every recovery driver I've ever encountered and they've never once been able to fix on the roadside.
If anyone can offer any advice, take a look or know someone who can I'd be eternally gratfull and offer a big drink.
I disarm the alarm, the doors unlock, the ignition lights all come on ok and the fuel pump cuts in but there's just nothing when I turn the key. The battery is fine so my only guess is that its alarm or imobilizer related but its never had any problems before and the flashing light goes out as it should. Its a Clifford Concept 300.
The only other possibilities I can think of is starter motor/solonoid or maybe, as its an auto theres some in gear sensor that disables the starter unless its in park?
Please help.
Sods law, I only have breakdown cover on the TVR and I can't take that cos I need to take all the luggage and 4 bikes on the bike rack. I've tried joining a breakdown company but they're all saying 48hrs before cover starts and besides that I know more about cars than every recovery driver I've ever encountered and they've never once been able to fix on the roadside.
If anyone can offer any advice, take a look or know someone who can I'd be eternally gratfull and offer a big drink.
I disarm the alarm, the doors unlock, the ignition lights all come on ok and the fuel pump cuts in but there's just nothing when I turn the key. The battery is fine so my only guess is that its alarm or imobilizer related but its never had any problems before and the flashing light goes out as it should. Its a Clifford Concept 300.
The only other possibilities I can think of is starter motor/solonoid or maybe, as its an auto theres some in gear sensor that disables the starter unless its in park?
Please help.
Doesn't sound like immobilizer to me, although it could be many things, the first I would look at is the instigator connection on the starter.
Pull off and refit or just wiggle the small connector on the starter motor (on the top of the gearbox bellhousing, to the n/s of the engine bay), if that doesn't work, give the starter a sharp tap with something metalic in case it's a sticking brush causing the problem.
Pull off and refit or just wiggle the small connector on the starter motor (on the top of the gearbox bellhousing, to the n/s of the engine bay), if that doesn't work, give the starter a sharp tap with something metalic in case it's a sticking brush causing the problem.
Thanks guys, tried starting it in every gear including N without luck. Also pulled the selector surround and played around the the foorbrake inhibitor relay. Everything seemed to be ok there.
Can't easily get underneath to try the inhibitor switch on the side of the gearbox but I'll try adding 12v to the starter trigger in the morning and see what happens.
Can't easily get underneath to try the inhibitor switch on the side of the gearbox but I'll try adding 12v to the starter trigger in the morning and see what happens.
Sounds 100% like the inhibitor switch.
What year is it?
I think the switch is actually on the gearlever mechanism itself, in which case pop the gear lever cover off (outer cover part first) might be a few hidden screws up the front end of it but it releases from the back end first. Beneath you'll find a small couple of wires, that connect to the lever mech, pop the connector & link the two together with a wire that should fix it.
If its the 2000 shape model & your stuck give me a ring some time midday sunday I've one here & happy to talk you through it if your stuck, I've one here the same & had the cover off yesterday doing sorting a new stereo.
ETA
Quick way to tell, does the light panel on the dash move between D, N & R etc when you move the lever with the ignition on? You might need to have your foot on the brake to do this. Looks the the switch mech may well be in the gearbox with a feed going to the ignition switch. Still may be able to assist with some simple rewiring.
Here's a very useful link if your handy with sparks & stuff
http://www.surrealmirage.com/subaru/swap/electrica...
What year is it?
I think the switch is actually on the gearlever mechanism itself, in which case pop the gear lever cover off (outer cover part first) might be a few hidden screws up the front end of it but it releases from the back end first. Beneath you'll find a small couple of wires, that connect to the lever mech, pop the connector & link the two together with a wire that should fix it.
If its the 2000 shape model & your stuck give me a ring some time midday sunday I've one here & happy to talk you through it if your stuck, I've one here the same & had the cover off yesterday doing sorting a new stereo.
ETA
Quick way to tell, does the light panel on the dash move between D, N & R etc when you move the lever with the ignition on? You might need to have your foot on the brake to do this. Looks the the switch mech may well be in the gearbox with a feed going to the ignition switch. Still may be able to assist with some simple rewiring.
Here's a very useful link if your handy with sparks & stuff
http://www.surrealmirage.com/subaru/swap/electrica...
Edited by cptsideways on Saturday 3rd January 23:06
It is the 2000> shape and I've looked under the gear selector surround but all I can see is is a mechanical relay that unlocks the gear selector when the footbrake is pressed. I think there is another which is a switch that looks for P or N which inhibits the starter motor but I think this might be on the side of the box.
I'll try adding 12v direct to the starter tomorrow and see it turns over.
I'll try adding 12v direct to the starter tomorrow and see it turns over.
There is a seperate starter relay that takes an input from the gearbox switch, this could be fooled easy enough. There is also a feed to the ECU which I'm guessing will go to the circuit opening relay again this could be fooled too.
It might be worth tapping the relays first to see if that helps though
It might be worth tapping the relays first to see if that helps though
hummm... just tried it and can't hear anything like a relay click. It is hard to hear above the creaks and growns from the gear selector movent though but if there is anything it must be impossibly faint.
I'll get a second pair of hands to listen in the fuse box when I do it tomorrow.
Really appreaciate your help on this so far mate.
I'll get a second pair of hands to listen in the fuse box when I do it tomorrow.
Really appreaciate your help on this so far mate.
OK thanks for the help so far getting me mobile. I now have a nice little button mounted on the center console and although I'm quite used to the push button starter on my Cerbera it can't stay 
To recap....
The car has'nt had any starting issues before. I popped down the shop (a 2 min drive) and when I came out it wouldn't go.
There is no live going to the trigger wire on the starter but when I apply a direct feed it starts.
I've looked at the diagrams found below but I can't follow them. I'm guessing its something between ingnition switch and trigger wire but I can't see anything.
http://www.surrealmirage.com/subaru/swap/electrica...
or the full pdf here...
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/empty_space/subaru%20fi...
As mentioned above the biggest suspect is the in gear start inhibit switch so where is it and how do I bypass it. Presumably its on the side of the gearbox but is there any way without getting underneath?
The lights on the dash displaying which gear its in work ok though so not sure if this rules out this inhibit swich or not.
The other possibilty is the Clifford Alarm? Could they have added a relay or something in between this and where do I look?
Before I start digging too much are there any obvious relays or fuses I could have missed?
Thanks again for your help.
To recap....
The car has'nt had any starting issues before. I popped down the shop (a 2 min drive) and when I came out it wouldn't go.
There is no live going to the trigger wire on the starter but when I apply a direct feed it starts.
I've looked at the diagrams found below but I can't follow them. I'm guessing its something between ingnition switch and trigger wire but I can't see anything.
http://www.surrealmirage.com/subaru/swap/electrica...
or the full pdf here...
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/empty_space/subaru%20fi...
As mentioned above the biggest suspect is the in gear start inhibit switch so where is it and how do I bypass it. Presumably its on the side of the gearbox but is there any way without getting underneath?
The lights on the dash displaying which gear its in work ok though so not sure if this rules out this inhibit swich or not.
The other possibilty is the Clifford Alarm? Could they have added a relay or something in between this and where do I look?
Before I start digging too much are there any obvious relays or fuses I could have missed?
Thanks again for your help.
If you havent already Danny, fire a question over here too.
http://www.uklegacy.com/forums/index.php?act=idx
The wiring for the switches etc on the box, travel along the left hand side of the box, to a large multiplug upo near the bellhousing.
I guess if you could trace, bypassing shouldnt be too hard up there somewhere. Well...aside from the IC being in the way etc.
Ive only ever worked on a couple of autos...and that involved removing the box completely, but it was a few years ago on a 99/00 Impreza.
Pretty sure thats's where I bypassed inhibitor switches to get the car to start.
I also recall doing this...there was also a switch to lock the key into the ignition until the car was in park or something.
I ended up breaking this section of the barrel to allow the key to be removed.
http://www.uklegacy.com/forums/index.php?act=idx
The wiring for the switches etc on the box, travel along the left hand side of the box, to a large multiplug upo near the bellhousing.
I guess if you could trace, bypassing shouldnt be too hard up there somewhere. Well...aside from the IC being in the way etc.
Ive only ever worked on a couple of autos...and that involved removing the box completely, but it was a few years ago on a 99/00 Impreza.
Pretty sure thats's where I bypassed inhibitor switches to get the car to start.
I also recall doing this...there was also a switch to lock the key into the ignition until the car was in park or something.
I ended up breaking this section of the barrel to allow the key to be removed.
stevieturbo said:
If you havent already Danny, fire a question over here too.
http://www.uklegacy.com/forums/index.php?act=idx
The wiring for the switches etc on the box, travel along the left hand side of the box, to a large multiplug upo near the bellhousing.
I guess if you could trace, bypassing shouldnt be too hard up there somewhere. Well...aside from the IC being in the way etc.
Ive only ever worked on a couple of autos...and that involved removing the box completely, but it was a few years ago on a 99/00 Impreza.
Pretty sure thats's where I bypassed inhibitor switches to get the car to start.
I also recall doing this...there was also a switch to lock the key into the ignition until the car was in park or something.
I ended up breaking this section of the barrel to allow the key to be removed.
Cheers Steve, I have got a thread running on uklegacy about it too, but no luck yet.http://www.uklegacy.com/forums/index.php?act=idx
The wiring for the switches etc on the box, travel along the left hand side of the box, to a large multiplug upo near the bellhousing.
I guess if you could trace, bypassing shouldnt be too hard up there somewhere. Well...aside from the IC being in the way etc.
Ive only ever worked on a couple of autos...and that involved removing the box completely, but it was a few years ago on a 99/00 Impreza.
Pretty sure thats's where I bypassed inhibitor switches to get the car to start.
I also recall doing this...there was also a switch to lock the key into the ignition until the car was in park or something.
I ended up breaking this section of the barrel to allow the key to be removed.
If I don't find anything elsewhere I'm swapping the primary turbo over soon so I'll try the big multiplug on top of the bellhousing then.
Why are there are so many extra annoyances with auto's???
This was the first auto I'd worked on and I ended up wreaking the gearbox when I fitted the engine by not alighning the torque converter quite right. You'd think I know every inch of this car now as I've had the engine in and out 4 times and gearbox twice but I never did look at this inhibitor switch.
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