Motown engines
Discussion
I'm considering one of these... www.worldcastings.com/docs/03catalog/engines.pdf when I repower.
Will it fit under the hood of my Spyder? I notice the inlet manifold is fairly high, what is the maximum I can get away with?
Has anyone already used this engine, are they as good as advertised?
Thanks
>>> Edited by MattYorke on Monday 20th October 17:32
Will it fit under the hood of my Spyder? I notice the inlet manifold is fairly high, what is the maximum I can get away with?
Has anyone already used this engine, are they as good as advertised?
Thanks
>>> Edited by MattYorke on Monday 20th October 17:32
I was looking at this block spec the other day.
It gets the 454ci from the 4" stroke and 4.25" bore.
It's still a SBC with standard deck height so there is no reason why it should not fit.
It may be that some of the power comes from the long induction path using a tall inlet with spacers. If so then you may have to forfit some of that power and use a lower inlet.
Steve
It gets the 454ci from the 4" stroke and 4.25" bore.
It's still a SBC with standard deck height so there is no reason why it should not fit.
It may be that some of the power comes from the long induction path using a tall inlet with spacers. If so then you may have to forfit some of that power and use a lower inlet.
Steve
Hi Matt:
I have one of those 454 in my GTR. The engine has terrific performances. Amazing power, amazing torque.....but amazing fuel comsumption. The problem on this engine is the Holley Dominator. My god ! It drinks everything (including J&B and Johnny Walker ). I have recorded 27litres each 60miles !!.
But after all....well...it´s a 7.4litre engine.
Be carefull with the gearbox. The torque is abusive. You will need to modify the oil pan because it comes with a deep style pan. You will need to drill a vaccum port on the air intake to manage the vaccum advanced HEI distributor. By any other side, the engine is probably one of the best options you can find on the market. The engine block is fantastic. All internals are top brand and the balance is perfect.
Only a dark point:
The power they declare doesn´t match with the dyno sheet which comes with the engine. They claims 600hp and 590lbs of torque....and my dyno sheet shows 583hp and 572lbs of torque. I was talking with them and the excuse is that at the dyno they pull the engine a little bit over rich of fuel and only to 6000 rpm. So, I think that the power is more than enought. The car is a true catapult at all rpm range.
Please take in mind that these 454´s are very close to the physic limits for an small block tolerances. I´m not sure what can happens at 25000 miles. But after all........A GOOD OPTION.
Cheers,
Javier
I have one of those 454 in my GTR. The engine has terrific performances. Amazing power, amazing torque.....but amazing fuel comsumption. The problem on this engine is the Holley Dominator. My god ! It drinks everything (including J&B and Johnny Walker ). I have recorded 27litres each 60miles !!.
But after all....well...it´s a 7.4litre engine.
Be carefull with the gearbox. The torque is abusive. You will need to modify the oil pan because it comes with a deep style pan. You will need to drill a vaccum port on the air intake to manage the vaccum advanced HEI distributor. By any other side, the engine is probably one of the best options you can find on the market. The engine block is fantastic. All internals are top brand and the balance is perfect.
Only a dark point:
The power they declare doesn´t match with the dyno sheet which comes with the engine. They claims 600hp and 590lbs of torque....and my dyno sheet shows 583hp and 572lbs of torque. I was talking with them and the excuse is that at the dyno they pull the engine a little bit over rich of fuel and only to 6000 rpm. So, I think that the power is more than enought. The car is a true catapult at all rpm range.
Please take in mind that these 454´s are very close to the physic limits for an small block tolerances. I´m not sure what can happens at 25000 miles. But after all........A GOOD OPTION.
Cheers,
Javier
Javier,
Does a larger than stock oil pan fit at all? I was thinking of using a stock depth aftermarket pan and an accusump. Would consider going down the dry sump route but seems to be prohibitively expensive for all the components, though obviously cheap in comparison to blowing an engine from oil starvation.
How high is the inlet manifold on it? I'm trying to work out if it would fit under the hood of my spyder. If I used a dry sump I could potentially lower the engine slightly more I think, but that would open another can of worms as I bet the exhaust would foul the chassis then.
Cheers
Matt
Does a larger than stock oil pan fit at all? I was thinking of using a stock depth aftermarket pan and an accusump. Would consider going down the dry sump route but seems to be prohibitively expensive for all the components, though obviously cheap in comparison to blowing an engine from oil starvation.
How high is the inlet manifold on it? I'm trying to work out if it would fit under the hood of my spyder. If I used a dry sump I could potentially lower the engine slightly more I think, but that would open another can of worms as I bet the exhaust would foul the chassis then.
Cheers
Matt
Hi Matt,
Have to make a comment about stock pans. Unfortunately, these cars can't take much deeper than a stock pan. I've gone through a few pans only to go back to a stock pan. Supposedly a Canton road race pan will fit, but I have this pan and was never able to make it work. I ended up with a stock pan and crankshaft scraper. On my next engine rebuild, I'm going to have my machinast bore the mains with the special windage tray mainbolts from ARP. This way I can go with a full length diamond or canton windage tray. I'm running a canton accusump with an oil cooler and am pretty impressed with the accusump. W/O the accusump I've seen the oil pressure drop almost to zero under full braking. Switch it on and you won't even see the oil pressure budge. How serious you get with this, really all depends on how often you'll have your car out on the track.
Cheers!
-Mack
p.s. Holy cow? What happened to the GTR Matt? Have I been gone that long?
Have to make a comment about stock pans. Unfortunately, these cars can't take much deeper than a stock pan. I've gone through a few pans only to go back to a stock pan. Supposedly a Canton road race pan will fit, but I have this pan and was never able to make it work. I ended up with a stock pan and crankshaft scraper. On my next engine rebuild, I'm going to have my machinast bore the mains with the special windage tray mainbolts from ARP. This way I can go with a full length diamond or canton windage tray. I'm running a canton accusump with an oil cooler and am pretty impressed with the accusump. W/O the accusump I've seen the oil pressure drop almost to zero under full braking. Switch it on and you won't even see the oil pressure budge. How serious you get with this, really all depends on how often you'll have your car out on the track.
Cheers!
-Mack
p.s. Holy cow? What happened to the GTR Matt? Have I been gone that long?
Hi Mack. When we first talked, you'd just taken delivery of your sports, so it's been a while. 
I had a chat with Richard @ the factory today, he concurred with you on the sump. I'm keen on the accusump, it seems like a good option, it's just a case of seeing what inlet manifolds I can use now to fit under the spyder hood.
>> Edited by MattYorke on Tuesday 21st October 15:31
I had a chat with Richard @ the factory today, he concurred with you on the sump. I'm keen on the accusump, it seems like a good option, it's just a case of seeing what inlet manifolds I can use now to fit under the spyder hood.
>> Edited by MattYorke on Tuesday 21st October 15:31
We have the Canton sump with the wings. No accusump. After several hundred miles of track time, we have never seen the "Low Oil Pressure" light come on which will if the pressure drops below 5 pounds. It would be a hard light to miss. (it's that big one just to the right of the Stack)
http://home.comcast.net/~rosenracing4/wsb/html/view.cgi-photo.html--SiteID-697937.html
Just be sure that you keep 9 qts (U.S.) in the sump.
Jack
http://home.comcast.net/~rosenracing4/wsb/html/view.cgi-photo.html--SiteID-697937.html
Just be sure that you keep 9 qts (U.S.) in the sump.
Jack
Matt:
In my particular situation a large modification was needed in the oil pan because my car is a LHD and is running drysumped. However, the oil pan which comes with the engine (MILODON..I thing) must be modified, as well as the oil pump pickup, to clear the chassis. In fact, the oil pan comes modified internally to clear the downside of the rods. This can be a point to take care if you are going to change it to another.
About the intake....the distance from the intake runners (in the heads) to the top of the Dominator is 23,5cm. Don´t forget the size of the air filter.
Regards,
Javier
In my particular situation a large modification was needed in the oil pan because my car is a LHD and is running drysumped. However, the oil pan which comes with the engine (MILODON..I thing) must be modified, as well as the oil pump pickup, to clear the chassis. In fact, the oil pan comes modified internally to clear the downside of the rods. This can be a point to take care if you are going to change it to another.
About the intake....the distance from the intake runners (in the heads) to the top of the Dominator is 23,5cm. Don´t forget the size of the air filter.
Regards,
Javier
MattYorke said:
Javier,
Does a larger than stock oil pan fit at all? I was thinking of using a stock depth aftermarket pan and an accusump. Would consider going down the dry sump route but seems to be prohibitively expensive for all the components, though obviously cheap in comparison to blowing an engine from oil starvation.
How high is the inlet manifold on it? I'm trying to work out if it would fit under the hood of my spyder. If I used a dry sump I could potentially lower the engine slightly more I think, but that would open another can of worms as I bet the exhaust would foul the chassis then.
Cheers
Matt
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