Divorce and kids.......
Discussion
Many years ago, I was working for a railway, and I was the youngest in the department. We used to go ot for a beer at night, and over a few year I got to know everyone. The were great, tough mates. Many of the had been divorced many years before and I heard all the horror stories, but the ones that struck me were those f guys trying to reconnect with their kids. If the divorce had been really bitter , some of them had lost contact with their children , and many were trying to reconnect,doing their best to establish a connection.
Sometimes they had screwed their wives financially, These were the ones where the kids had been in the middle, and many years later were lost to their fathers. It was hard to see the sadness of those guys looking to establish a relationship with their kids,even if they deserved the consequences.
As a young single man it I could not see the future, but eventually I married into a disastrous marriage, which ended in a vivid divorce twelve years later, with a 10 year old son. I was 45 at the time when I left my wife and son, and all those lost fathers had made a vivid impression on me. So, for the most selfish of reasons, I simply left 100% of the assets to my wife, not because of generosity, but because I did not want him to move from his childhood home and possessions. She never had a decline in her standard of living. There was no goodness on my part...just fear of losing a future relationship. If I had not worked with the older guys, I would have made different decisions.
There were very rocky moments,but I spent a great night last night with my son, (now 25), and we have all survived a time to which the parents contributed a lot of pain, but my son is a great person, and all of those bad old times have gone away.
I see the odd divorce thread here, and all I can say, for what little its worth, is that the money is less of an issue than the future relationship with your kids, and the short term win can hurt hugely in the long term. I am curious to hear of the experience of others. My son is an adult now, and its a delight to go for a beer, the past now done, and just enjoy the present.
Maybe it just proves that beer is good!
Sometimes they had screwed their wives financially, These were the ones where the kids had been in the middle, and many years later were lost to their fathers. It was hard to see the sadness of those guys looking to establish a relationship with their kids,even if they deserved the consequences.
As a young single man it I could not see the future, but eventually I married into a disastrous marriage, which ended in a vivid divorce twelve years later, with a 10 year old son. I was 45 at the time when I left my wife and son, and all those lost fathers had made a vivid impression on me. So, for the most selfish of reasons, I simply left 100% of the assets to my wife, not because of generosity, but because I did not want him to move from his childhood home and possessions. She never had a decline in her standard of living. There was no goodness on my part...just fear of losing a future relationship. If I had not worked with the older guys, I would have made different decisions.
There were very rocky moments,but I spent a great night last night with my son, (now 25), and we have all survived a time to which the parents contributed a lot of pain, but my son is a great person, and all of those bad old times have gone away.
I see the odd divorce thread here, and all I can say, for what little its worth, is that the money is less of an issue than the future relationship with your kids, and the short term win can hurt hugely in the long term. I am curious to hear of the experience of others. My son is an adult now, and its a delight to go for a beer, the past now done, and just enjoy the present.
Maybe it just proves that beer is good!
Agreed! kids should come first, especially if they are young, like your child was at the time!
I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
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gathore said:
gathore said: Agreed! kids should come first, especially if they are young, like your child was at the time!
I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
That's the heart of the problem indeed. At the time its sort of unreal. Looking back at it it was like a sort of drugged state going through it . Most people are basically fairly decent,but the heat of divorce is staggeringly vicious at times, and the kids dont have a clue. The parents who represented security are now representing fear and conflict. For me it was a tough road, but nothing like it was for my son. Nobody wants to get shafted ,,rightly so, Yet,in the future there is a relationship with a future adult, your kid, and you will be called to account. Its a moment that is painful to face. I am OK now with my son,but when he was 13 he threw everything at me in anger and despair. Now,its all good,,anger gone , weapons laid down. ...I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
RDMcG said:
sgathore said:
gathore said: Agreed! kids should come first, especially if they are young, like your child was at the time!
I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
That's the heart of the problem indeed. At the time its sort of unreal. Looking back at it it was like a sort of drugged state going through it . Most people are basically fairly decent,but the heat of divorce is staggeringly vicious at times, and the kids dont have a clue. The parents who represented security are now representing fear and conflict. For me it was a tough road, but nothing like it was for my son. Nobody wants to get shafted ,,rightly so, Yet,in the future there is a relationship with a future adult, your kid, and you will be called to account. Its a moment that is painful to face. I am OK now with my son,but when he was 13 he threw everything at me in anger and despair. Now,its all good,,anger gone , weapons laid down. ...I think the bitterness comes from blokes working hard to provide for their family and keep a roof over their heads, then they get divorced and the wife tries to shaft them.
I'd be pretty pissed off if that happenend to me. obviously I would want the child to have everything and the wife to have nothing, unfortunately it doesn't always work like that!
Now he's older it'll all be put into perspective and he'll understand why you made the decisions you did.
When we're young we are convinced are parents are doing everything to make life harder for us, yet, when we grow up, it all starts to make sense! Adding a divorce in to that would have made it alot harder aswell.
Edited by sgathore on Friday 9th January 02:00
gathore on Friday 9th January 02:00Gives me something to look forward to, considering I am just younger than the OP's son but going through the same events in life as the OP has done. Sometimes i wonder what the future holds for me. Sometimes i wonder how it is i will cope without having both my sons by my side. Whenever i see them all it takes is one smile from them to reawaken the courage and motivation within me and battle what's to come. But essentially, giving them the good life now with their mother and all possesions will establish them in life later. Even if their mother was to give them 'her side of the story'. The OP has proved to me that this is actually a better way forward, as when we die, we take only our memories with us.
I am no saint..far from it..but the particular lesson was from one man I worked with, He was about 60,(I was 30) and he was trying to reach his sons. Years before he had left his wife destitute and the two kids later became incredibly successful. He was not trying to reach them to get anything for himself, but to congratulate them and express his pride. They never spoke to him or acknowledged his existence. Despite his earlier story, I felt sorry for him. He died without ever connecting, and they did not come to his funeral.
It was merely the things I saw the prevented me from my normal level of fight and destroy, so in a way, I owe him one......because I ended up with a life with my son. Perhaps it was good behaviour for bad reasons but I'll take it. That's the damn problem with kids....
you have to fess up later.
This is no defence of those who try to take you for every penny and leave you in a one roomed flat. Just a recollection of some bad times long ago that turned out to be not so bad after all.
It was merely the things I saw the prevented me from my normal level of fight and destroy, so in a way, I owe him one......because I ended up with a life with my son. Perhaps it was good behaviour for bad reasons but I'll take it. That's the damn problem with kids....
you have to fess up later.
This is no defence of those who try to take you for every penny and leave you in a one roomed flat. Just a recollection of some bad times long ago that turned out to be not so bad after all.
Isnt it more about just having regular contact, and showing them in every way possible that youre there for them and always will be.
im not with my baby mother, but when i say im going to be there for the kids.. im there, on time, every time.
theres only so many times a child is going to accept being let down. yes you'll get away with it while their young, but once they get older and decide to reflect on your past performance, they'll make up their own mind to just not bother with you.
thats my view anyway. so ill just keep doing what i do, and hope they dont end up hating me! money does'nt come into it ( for me )
im not with my baby mother, but when i say im going to be there for the kids.. im there, on time, every time.
theres only so many times a child is going to accept being let down. yes you'll get away with it while their young, but once they get older and decide to reflect on your past performance, they'll make up their own mind to just not bother with you.
thats my view anyway. so ill just keep doing what i do, and hope they dont end up hating me! money does'nt come into it ( for me )
I'm no longer with my (now ex) wife, and mother of my 2 children, but I see them very regularly, and probably spend more quality time with them now, than when I was married.
My children are 8 and 4, but were 6 and 2 when we split up. I've always made an effort to get on with my ex, and she has to me, initially for the sake of the children. This has made things easier for me and the ex, and we both still consider the other a good friend, after a period of hating each others guts.
That is not to say we don't have our moments, but on the whole we get along fine (probably better than when we were married).
My kids know that I am there for them and their mum, should the need arise, and that they only have to pick up the phone and I'll be there for them.
However, this then presents another problem. My 4 year old wasn't old enough to fully understand what was going on when we split up, and now only sees the good side of me and the ex's relationship. This leads to the difficult situation when she asks "Why can't you live with me, and (insert sisters name here) and mummy?" I don't want to lie to her, but what has happened is in the past, and needn't worry her. All that matters is that I see her and her sister, and that mummy and daddy get on.
My children are 8 and 4, but were 6 and 2 when we split up. I've always made an effort to get on with my ex, and she has to me, initially for the sake of the children. This has made things easier for me and the ex, and we both still consider the other a good friend, after a period of hating each others guts.
That is not to say we don't have our moments, but on the whole we get along fine (probably better than when we were married).
My kids know that I am there for them and their mum, should the need arise, and that they only have to pick up the phone and I'll be there for them.
However, this then presents another problem. My 4 year old wasn't old enough to fully understand what was going on when we split up, and now only sees the good side of me and the ex's relationship. This leads to the difficult situation when she asks "Why can't you live with me, and (insert sisters name here) and mummy?" I don't want to lie to her, but what has happened is in the past, and needn't worry her. All that matters is that I see her and her sister, and that mummy and daddy get on.
Edited by AndrewTait on Friday 9th January 13:12
Great sentiment - but (im guessing) you have a decent job and a steady income; people less well off might need to fight for what they deserve (be that half the savings / equity of the house or whatever) to be able to live their life after the split. And just because you left them with a chunk of money doesnt mean your ex isn't going to convince your kids you were in the wrong.
Maybe I'll have a different view when I have kids (...and some money!)
Maybe I'll have a different view when I have kids (...and some money!)
Ozone said:
It helps if your ex doesn't turn in to a complete psycho bh and has a family that poisons the kids against you as well.
+1 Ex and family stopped me seeing my kids for 3 years, and I was a generous as the OP with the asset division - Ex 100% Me Nil...h and has a family that poisons the kids against you as well.They came back to me earlier this year, eldest now 14, youngest 11, and now they can't stay away.. Lifes great in that respect, although we have had some emotional turmoil for the first 4 months being back.
I am absolutely aware of the huge fighting that goes on during a divorce. My ex actually crashed her car into mine as she tried to drive me off the road.
There is a very valid point made earlier which is when yuor child says "why did it happen and why not come back?"..my only answer was to say that I and my wife did not get on and fought with each other, but it had nothing at all to do with my son who we both loved.
Strangely, my son tells me he cannot remember the fights when he was young, and I do no remind him.(My ex once whacked me with a frying pan). When I left it was very painful and guilt inducing as my ex made my son stand in the door and watch.
There are few happy divorces and mine was no worse than many.It was merely looking at the lessons of the older guys that gave me a way to work it our to my son's benefit. As someone observed I had a good job, but I determined to keep the payments to my ex the same as if I had been there. You can get pretty ingenious though..I had a company cell phone and car, and moved to a dirt cheap one bedroom for two years,because I wanted to send my son to a good boarding school, which got him out of the post-divorce trauma. In the end I improved my career,remarried, and my son grew up to be a very goos human being. ..which is all we can ask for of our kids.
My ex absolutely sgged me to my son,but it faded, and I refused to join the discussion, just told him that people say hurtful things when they are hurt themselves. Nobody goes into a mariage without hope for the future and many achives their goals, but breakups do cause a sense of disappointment,failure,fear for the future, and regret.
Anyway, it was just a typical divorce ..and all of the replies resonate with my experience too.
There is a very valid point made earlier which is when yuor child says "why did it happen and why not come back?"..my only answer was to say that I and my wife did not get on and fought with each other, but it had nothing at all to do with my son who we both loved.
Strangely, my son tells me he cannot remember the fights when he was young, and I do no remind him.(My ex once whacked me with a frying pan). When I left it was very painful and guilt inducing as my ex made my son stand in the door and watch.
There are few happy divorces and mine was no worse than many.It was merely looking at the lessons of the older guys that gave me a way to work it our to my son's benefit. As someone observed I had a good job, but I determined to keep the payments to my ex the same as if I had been there. You can get pretty ingenious though..I had a company cell phone and car, and moved to a dirt cheap one bedroom for two years,because I wanted to send my son to a good boarding school, which got him out of the post-divorce trauma. In the end I improved my career,remarried, and my son grew up to be a very goos human being. ..which is all we can ask for of our kids.
My ex absolutely s
gged me to my son,but it faded, and I refused to join the discussion, just told him that people say hurtful things when they are hurt themselves. Nobody goes into a mariage without hope for the future and many achives their goals, but breakups do cause a sense of disappointment,failure,fear for the future, and regret.Anyway, it was just a typical divorce ..and all of the replies resonate with my experience too.
Thanks for sharing.
After 4 or more years of not getting on it looks like we will be ending our marriage of ten years but which has resulted in our lovely 3, 6 and 10 year olds. The big plus point of our relationship.
Financially we can not afford to separate and do not want to upset the kids so for the time being we will live in the same house together. Strange situation I know, but we have basically lived apart/together for ages and do not have other lovers.
I would hate to live outside the family home as that is where my kids live and to see them at set times would tear me apart.
My Mum and Dad divorced when I was ten and as my Dad moved out and lived in shytty bedsits for years, we grew apart and even 30 odd years later, even though he comes to stay a number of times a year, the damage is done and I just don't want that to happen to me and my kids.
On the financial side, I have virtually bankrupted myself in order to help get my wife's business going over the last few years so if I end up on the scrape heap whilst her business takes off, I will not be too happy.
After 4 or more years of not getting on it looks like we will be ending our marriage of ten years but which has resulted in our lovely 3, 6 and 10 year olds. The big plus point of our relationship.
Financially we can not afford to separate and do not want to upset the kids so for the time being we will live in the same house together. Strange situation I know, but we have basically lived apart/together for ages and do not have other lovers.
I would hate to live outside the family home as that is where my kids live and to see them at set times would tear me apart.
My Mum and Dad divorced when I was ten and as my Dad moved out and lived in shytty bedsits for years, we grew apart and even 30 odd years later, even though he comes to stay a number of times a year, the damage is done and I just don't want that to happen to me and my kids.
On the financial side, I have virtually bankrupted myself in order to help get my wife's business going over the last few years so if I end up on the scrape heap whilst her business takes off, I will not be too happy.
croyde said:
Thanks for sharing.
After 4 or more years of not getting on it looks like we will be ending our marriage of ten years but which has resulted in our lovely 3, 6 and 10 year olds. The big plus point of our relationship.
Financially we can not afford to separate and do not want to upset the kids so for the time being we will live in the same house together. Strange situation I know, but we have basically lived apart/together for ages and do not have other lovers.
I would hate to live outside the family home as that is where my kids live and to see them at set times would tear me apart.
My Mum and Dad divorced when I was ten and as my Dad moved out and lived in shytty bedsits for years, we grew apart and even 30 odd years later, even though he comes to stay a number of times a year, the damage is done and I just don't want that to happen to me and my kids.
On the financial side, I have virtually bankrupted myself in order to help get my wife's business going over the last few years so if I end up on the scrape heap whilst her business takes off, I will not be too happy.
That's more common than you think, and I wish you the very best with it. When you care deeply for your kids there are sometimes very tough times. I hope things work out for you, but for sure your heart in in the right place, mate.After 4 or more years of not getting on it looks like we will be ending our marriage of ten years but which has resulted in our lovely 3, 6 and 10 year olds. The big plus point of our relationship.
Financially we can not afford to separate and do not want to upset the kids so for the time being we will live in the same house together. Strange situation I know, but we have basically lived apart/together for ages and do not have other lovers.
I would hate to live outside the family home as that is where my kids live and to see them at set times would tear me apart.
My Mum and Dad divorced when I was ten and as my Dad moved out and lived in shytty bedsits for years, we grew apart and even 30 odd years later, even though he comes to stay a number of times a year, the damage is done and I just don't want that to happen to me and my kids.
On the financial side, I have virtually bankrupted myself in order to help get my wife's business going over the last few years so if I end up on the scrape heap whilst her business takes off, I will not be too happy.
RDMcG said:
I am absolutely aware of the huge fighting that goes on during a divorce. My ex actually crashed her car into mine as she tried to drive me off the road.
There is a very valid point made earlier which is when yuor child says "why did it happen and why not come back?"..my only answer was to say that I and my wife did not get on and fought with each other, but it had nothing at all to do with my son who we both loved.
Strangely, my son tells me he cannot remember the fights when he was young, and I do no remind him.(My ex once whacked me with a frying pan). When I left it was very painful and guilt inducing as my ex made my son stand in the door and watch.
I don't mean to sound judgemental, but how could you leave you son with someone who is so violent? Didn't you worry that she'd do the same to him?There is a very valid point made earlier which is when yuor child says "why did it happen and why not come back?"..my only answer was to say that I and my wife did not get on and fought with each other, but it had nothing at all to do with my son who we both loved.
Strangely, my son tells me he cannot remember the fights when he was young, and I do no remind him.(My ex once whacked me with a frying pan). When I left it was very painful and guilt inducing as my ex made my son stand in the door and watch.
Edited because I missed important words out!
Edited by Mrs Trackside on Friday 9th January 15:52
AndrewTait said:
I'm no longer with my (now ex) wife, and mother of my 2 children, but I see them very regularly, and probably spend more quality time with them now, than when I was married.
My children are 8 and 4, but were 6 and 2 when we split up. I've always made an effort to get on with my ex, and she has to me, initially for the sake of the children. This has made things easier for me and the ex, and we both still consider the other a good friend, after a period of hating each others guts.
That is not to say we don't have our moments, but on the whole we get along fine (probably better than when we were married).
My kids know that I am there for them and their mum, should the need arise, and that they only have to pick up the phone and I'll be there for them.
Only the one child with my ex wife, but the same here - I now get considerably more "quality" time with him than I did when I was marriage.My children are 8 and 4, but were 6 and 2 when we split up. I've always made an effort to get on with my ex, and she has to me, initially for the sake of the children. This has made things easier for me and the ex, and we both still consider the other a good friend, after a period of hating each others guts.
That is not to say we don't have our moments, but on the whole we get along fine (probably better than when we were married).
My kids know that I am there for them and their mum, should the need arise, and that they only have to pick up the phone and I'll be there for them.
Edited by AndrewTait on Friday 9th January 13:12
At least your ex seems reasonable, mine however generally comes across as slightly unhinged, and my mum reckons that the ex has slightly mental issues.
Heck, even the ex's sister wonders how I put up with her for so long!!!
The only reason I get on better with her is due to not seeing her every day ....
Thankfully the current girlfriend has restored my faith in women, and has demonstrated that they aren't all a bunch of money grabbing snakes with tits.
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