Gaz - Pro, Gold or Nickel ???
Discussion
god I'm glad you said that thought I'd said a rude word??
as the Nickel versions are £100 a set cheaper than golds which only "appear" to be a tenner less than the pro's.....do you get £100 less or for us mere mortals who just want to drive without the less comforting nature of a Tuscan's handling are they a good buy?
are the golds merely just anodized???
as the Nickel versions are £100 a set cheaper than golds which only "appear" to be a tenner less than the pro's.....do you get £100 less or for us mere mortals who just want to drive without the less comforting nature of a Tuscan's handling are they a good buy?
are the golds merely just anodized???
Just to clarify
Nickel are plated steel shocks with bonded bushes
Gaz gold are composite steel/alloy shocks with bonded bushes
Gaz Gold Pro's are all anodised alloy shocks with spherical bearings.
Yes the GGP are better performing dampers but I think the better quality materials used are a factor in making a choice.
Nickel are plated steel shocks with bonded bushes
Gaz gold are composite steel/alloy shocks with bonded bushes
Gaz Gold Pro's are all anodised alloy shocks with spherical bearings.
Yes the GGP are better performing dampers but I think the better quality materials used are a factor in making a choice.
Edited by Ab Shocks on Tuesday 3rd February 21:57
Funky Jo said:
I also always wondered about the difference...
@ Ab Shocks: Does this conclude the only difference between Nickels and Golds is weight and maybe durability, but the performance is equal ?
No, the GGP are much improved because of a more efficiant combustion chamber and new banded pistons, they also have a better quality high Viscoscity Index oil which all round means you can use them for cruising through to club racing without fade. The banded pistons also give a smoother transition from bump to rebound, giving a slightly better ride for road use. @ Ab Shocks: Does this conclude the only difference between Nickels and Golds is weight and maybe durability, but the performance is equal ?
Funky Jo said:
OK, I see that´s for the GAZ GOLD PROs, right.
What about the difference in performance when comparing normal Gaz Nickel versus normal Gaz Gold (not PRO version)?
Aren´t these 2 (non-PRO) versions the same combustion chamber and viscosity index ?
The old Gaz gold(which will probably be discontinued) only changes from the pro series by means of a steel shock barrel and metalastic bushes, against high tensile aluminium barrels and self lubricating spherical bearings.What about the difference in performance when comparing normal Gaz Nickel versus normal Gaz Gold (not PRO version)?
Aren´t these 2 (non-PRO) versions the same combustion chamber and viscosity index ?
The Gaz nickel are welded up steel loops and barrels, nickel plated for protection and perform well but not as well as either gold brand.
There is an abnormality on pricing at the moment because the pro series should be £46 per kit dearer than the Gaz gold but in this credit crunch I decided to keep the prices down while the dealers assess them, so far so good with 25 kits fitted, the dealers prefer them to the old ones.
@ Ab Shocks - I'm interested in how the GGP's might benefit an '04 Tuscan S. Obviously they are adjustable, but do the spring rates also differ ? I understand the 'S' shocks are different from the standard Tuscan, but not sure in what way. Just under 10k miles so far, so not sure if it would be worth the expense of changing them yet ?
All a bit of a vague area to me, and without having a modded Tuscan to compare it to it's difficult to know what the difference will be. Comments like "night & day" don't assist much ....
Cheers.
All a bit of a vague area to me, and without having a modded Tuscan to compare it to it's difficult to know what the difference will be. Comments like "night & day" don't assist much ....
Cheers.
aquatix said:
@ Ab Shocks - I'm interested in how the GGP's might benefit an '04 Tuscan S. Obviously they are adjustable, but do the spring rates also differ ? I understand the 'S' shocks are different from the standard Tuscan, but not sure in what way. Just under 10k miles so far, so not sure if it would be worth the expense of changing them yet ?
All a bit of a vague area to me, and without having a modded Tuscan to compare it to it's difficult to know what the difference will be. Comments like "night & day" don't assist much ....
Cheers.
I know, the "night and day" does seem a bit overblown but I get more Tuscan owners than any other model who say that their car is trying to kill them and I'm talking mk1,2 and convertables. The fact is that the cars are perceived to be too twitchy and not planted and having driven loads of them, I agree.All a bit of a vague area to me, and without having a modded Tuscan to compare it to it's difficult to know what the difference will be. Comments like "night & day" don't assist much ....
Cheers.
I have tried just a four wheel alignment on some cars but never been that convinced that the improvement was sufficiant. I don't run Tuscans too stiff for road use but I might go up a bit for trackday stars and a proper damper/spring combination, Gaz, Nitron or Ohlins etc all seem to make a huge difference.
OK, well in standard form I don't think mine is 'too' twitchy - but maybe that's because everyone says they are ?? Tramlining is not too bad, although one wheel on the white lines & you can feel it.
Even shallow potholes send a shockwave through the car, and bumpy country lanes are scary, but smooth tarmac is great.
Mostly I would say it is good, but I don't actually know how much better it could be. How much improvement can I expect from shocks/springs compared to say different tyres, or the uprated ARB drop links, or a change in geo set-up ?
I imagine GGP's might suit me fine since it is used at least 95% on the road and barely 5% track, so probably not worth the (almost double) extra for Ohlins or Nitrons. All looks good in theory (unless you have a loan car to show me the difference
) but assuming the geometry is set up properly in my car, and the standard Tuscan S shocks are working fine, what differences am I likely to notice immediately after fitting GGP's ? How close do they come to the Nitrons ?
Cheers
Even shallow potholes send a shockwave through the car, and bumpy country lanes are scary, but smooth tarmac is great.
Mostly I would say it is good, but I don't actually know how much better it could be. How much improvement can I expect from shocks/springs compared to say different tyres, or the uprated ARB drop links, or a change in geo set-up ?
I imagine GGP's might suit me fine since it is used at least 95% on the road and barely 5% track, so probably not worth the (almost double) extra for Ohlins or Nitrons. All looks good in theory (unless you have a loan car to show me the difference
) but assuming the geometry is set up properly in my car, and the standard Tuscan S shocks are working fine, what differences am I likely to notice immediately after fitting GGP's ? How close do they come to the Nitrons ?Cheers
aquatix said:
OK, well in standard form I don't think mine is 'too' twitchy - but maybe that's because everyone says they are ?? Tramlining is not too bad, although one wheel on the white lines & you can feel it.
Even shallow potholes send a shockwave through the car, and bumpy country lanes are scary, but smooth tarmac is great.
Mostly I would say it is good, but I don't actually know how much better it could be. How much improvement can I expect from shocks/springs compared to say different tyres, or the uprated ARB drop links, or a change in geo set-up ?
I imagine GGP's might suit me fine since it is used at least 95% on the road and barely 5% track, so probably not worth the (almost double) extra for Ohlins or Nitrons. All looks good in theory (unless you have a loan car to show me the difference) but assuming the geometry is set up properly in my car, and the standard Tuscan S shocks are working fine, what differences am I likely to notice immediately after fitting GGP's ? How close do they come to the Nitrons ?
Cheers
I think you are descibing a typical Tuscan, ok until you hit undulating or bumpy roads, this is down to the springs not being under proper control and once sorted the car feels much more planted.Even shallow potholes send a shockwave through the car, and bumpy country lanes are scary, but smooth tarmac is great.
Mostly I would say it is good, but I don't actually know how much better it could be. How much improvement can I expect from shocks/springs compared to say different tyres, or the uprated ARB drop links, or a change in geo set-up ?
I imagine GGP's might suit me fine since it is used at least 95% on the road and barely 5% track, so probably not worth the (almost double) extra for Ohlins or Nitrons. All looks good in theory (unless you have a loan car to show me the difference
) but assuming the geometry is set up properly in my car, and the standard Tuscan S shocks are working fine, what differences am I likely to notice immediately after fitting GGP's ? How close do they come to the Nitrons ?Cheers
I am convinced that the majority of lost rear ends are down to lack of rebound control and I watched the Tuscan 2 trying to chase the Saggyarse round Dunsfold, it was obvious that the spring/damper combination did not work.
As a matter of interest,I have taken a pair of Gaz Golds off the back of a customers car and put single Ohlins on for a month just to see if there was a noticable differece on fast road use and according to the customer, "no change at all"
"You pays your money and takes your choice"
Although you say you don't think yours is too bad, if bumpy country lanes are scary I'd suggest you're going to notice a difference. I can only comment on the Gaz shocks as I haven't tried the others, but when I had them put on my Tuscan S the car was much more reassuring to drive. It made B-road blasts fun, and allowed me to exploit the performance of the car without feeling nervous...
Definitely a worth while improvement over the standard set up.
Definitely a worth while improvement over the standard set up.
OK, seems to make sense and similar threads abound for Tam, T350 etc so looks like something to try prior to 12k service & geo set-up. For my budget and mainly fast road use it looks like Racing Reds, Gaz Gold Pro, or possibly Protech would suit. Still a few queries though:
Any other reccomendations other than those 3 ?
Why are the racing reds currentlyunavailable ? Are they worth holding out for ?
Springs & dampers for the Tuscan S are listed as different from standard Tuscan on all TVR parts sites, so how do the spring rates and damper settings differ ? Are the Gaz Gold Pro kits model specific, or just a "one size fits all" compromise ?
Any assistance / feedback appreciated.
Any other reccomendations other than those 3 ?
Why are the racing reds currentlyunavailable ? Are they worth holding out for ?
Springs & dampers for the Tuscan S are listed as different from standard Tuscan on all TVR parts sites, so how do the spring rates and damper settings differ ? Are the Gaz Gold Pro kits model specific, or just a "one size fits all" compromise ?
Any assistance / feedback appreciated.
Get my Tuscan back tomorrow after 12K service and a full set of Gaz Gold Pros fitted plus full geometry set up etc etc.
Snow willing, will give my thoughts next week on the GG Pros against the standard set up. Have tried various adjustments to geometry, tyre pressures etc over the past 4 years on the standard set up and it was still a real handful on certain roads.
Fingers crossed that the GGs will be money well spent.
Snow willing, will give my thoughts next week on the GG Pros against the standard set up. Have tried various adjustments to geometry, tyre pressures etc over the past 4 years on the standard set up and it was still a real handful on certain roads.
Fingers crossed that the GGs will be money well spent.
Well I took the time to call some dealers today to answer my technical queries, so this may help others pondering the same upgrade.
Ohlins & Nitrons with Eibach springs are pretty much the way to go if you are racing & need every last fraction of a second difference per lap (or have money to burn), but not necessarily the best for normal fast road & occasional track day use - particularly if you do limited mileage or lay the car up for winter.
That leaves Racing Reds / Gaz Gold (and a few others) for most of us who want a decent upgrade and a properly handling Tuscan without crippling our wallet. Both would seem to fit the bill for a significant improvement.
At least one dealer tried to talk me up to Nitrons without really discussing my requirements - ie, 'buy a Rolex if you want a watch'. Not good. Some preferred the Reds for performance but accepted there have been quality control issues and supply problems. Some issues with seals failing - which could be worse with cars that get laid up for winter. My overal impression is that RR's are 'Nitron copies' rather than 'budget Nitrons' - ie the development that went into Nitrons has been adapted with less expensive parts. (purely my opinion, and apart from premature failure there seems to be no question about their performance).
Derek freely admitted some early issues with Gaz shocks, but went on to explain the research, development and materials used to make the latest improved versions (in words that I could understand) and his own research, fitting and testing experiences. Without going into every detail (and maybe getting it wrong), they sound bang on the money for what 80-90% of Tuscan owners want. He was the only dealer to discuss & explain spring rates, with the offer to exchange springs if necessary. 3 year warranty as well.
No hard sell - he actually told me not to buy from him unless I was fitting, and let the indie supply & fit if they were going to do the work !
So which to go for ? I don't foresee much difference in on-road performance between the two so will discuss with my indie garage for deciding vote. Derek inspires confidence with his knowledge and willingness to answer questions. Greenstar racing will be doing my 12k service, geo set up & some other jobs - and they run their race TVR on Gaz shocks, so I reckon the issue (for me) will now be resolved. Hope this helps
Ohlins & Nitrons with Eibach springs are pretty much the way to go if you are racing & need every last fraction of a second difference per lap (or have money to burn), but not necessarily the best for normal fast road & occasional track day use - particularly if you do limited mileage or lay the car up for winter.
That leaves Racing Reds / Gaz Gold (and a few others) for most of us who want a decent upgrade and a properly handling Tuscan without crippling our wallet. Both would seem to fit the bill for a significant improvement.
At least one dealer tried to talk me up to Nitrons without really discussing my requirements - ie, 'buy a Rolex if you want a watch'. Not good. Some preferred the Reds for performance but accepted there have been quality control issues and supply problems. Some issues with seals failing - which could be worse with cars that get laid up for winter. My overal impression is that RR's are 'Nitron copies' rather than 'budget Nitrons' - ie the development that went into Nitrons has been adapted with less expensive parts. (purely my opinion, and apart from premature failure there seems to be no question about their performance).
Derek freely admitted some early issues with Gaz shocks, but went on to explain the research, development and materials used to make the latest improved versions (in words that I could understand) and his own research, fitting and testing experiences. Without going into every detail (and maybe getting it wrong), they sound bang on the money for what 80-90% of Tuscan owners want. He was the only dealer to discuss & explain spring rates, with the offer to exchange springs if necessary. 3 year warranty as well.
No hard sell - he actually told me not to buy from him unless I was fitting, and let the indie supply & fit if they were going to do the work !
So which to go for ? I don't foresee much difference in on-road performance between the two so will discuss with my indie garage for deciding vote. Derek inspires confidence with his knowledge and willingness to answer questions. Greenstar racing will be doing my 12k service, geo set up & some other jobs - and they run their race TVR on Gaz shocks, so I reckon the issue (for me) will now be resolved. Hope this helps
Edited by aquatix on Saturday 7th February 03:13
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