McRae Crash Investigation
Discussion
This is odd:
The expired licence situation, although rather foolish, is immaterial to the cause of the crash.
article said:
Mark and Karen Porcelli said: "...The cause of the crash is clearly outlined in the report."
And then...article said:
Colin's father Jimmy said: "...we will never know the actual cause of the crash."
The expired licence situation, although rather foolish, is immaterial to the cause of the crash.
article said:
Mark and Karen Porcelli said: "...The cause of the crash is clearly outlined in the report."
translated as "we are going after the McRae family for compensation" article said:
Colin's father Jimmy said: "...we will never know the actual cause of the crash."
translated as "there's no proof of liability so there's no point trying to sue on the basis of this report" It's inevitable that the media would focus on an expired licence but yes it's immaterial to the crash. There will no doubt be inference that an expired licence means incompetent or reckless.
A great shame it happened and a great shame that there is inference of the cause being anything other than mechanical failure, but it looks like there will always be the possibility that "larking about" was indeed the root cause
Muzzlehatch said:
article said:
Mark and Karen Porcelli said: "...The cause of the crash is clearly outlined in the report."
I ran some courses on aircrash and got in some survivors and those who'd lost people and the terrible thing is that losing someone in an aircrash can totally dominate the balance of that person's life. Some spend years going around to various courses like mine saying the same thing over and over again. Marriages break up because of such obsessions.
The main difference between those who establish some kind of life afterwards (there's no going back in reality) and those who, it seems to me, also become victims of the crash is that in the latter case there is a desire to blame. Even in cases where the fault lies, say, with a bomber, some people scatter accusations of failure like ashes from a cremation.
It must be difficult to let go of such a young child but if, as they seem to be suggesting, Colin was at fault for taking too many risks, then he's paid the ultimate price.
It's such a horrible tragedy and one which mars the memory of the lad. I can't think of Sweet Lamb without also thiking of the crash.
My sergeant suggested, all but demanded, that we bin the guests as we were making it worse for them, encouraging them in their obsession. And he was right.
VladD said:
I get the feeling that Colin was having a bit of a lark about and it all went horribly wrong.
One has to agree that's a highly likely scenario, especially given that it's now clear that he had been flying for over 2 years with a lapsed license and had a lapsed type rating too.....hugely irresponsible.This link in Autosport hints that he was 'taking risks'....but does not directly criticise his flying.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73235
ETA: Quite sad if he was at fault.....his whole life he took risks to become great....sadly only 4 people know the real reason behind the crash, but it does sound like he was hooning and went beyond the limits of his or the machinery's capability.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73235
ETA: Quite sad if he was at fault.....his whole life he took risks to become great....sadly only 4 people know the real reason behind the crash, but it does sound like he was hooning and went beyond the limits of his or the machinery's capability.
Edited by Cara Van Man on Thursday 12th February 10:41
Having read the link, it does say in there that the lapse in his license had no bearing on the accident or his flying skills.
Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat b
k out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)
Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat b
k out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)uktrailmonster said:
He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)
Sadly I don't think the young boys were able to assess that sort of risk.t of course)As one of the greatest drivers ever to grace us, it's a poor way for him to be remembered......
uktrailmonster said:
Having read the link, it does say in there that the lapse in his license had no bearing on the accident or his flying skills.
Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat bk out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)
On the face if it it sounds like he was hooning and something happened.Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat b
k out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)A young boy was killed, who didn't have a choice whether to get in the aircraft or not.
His licence had expired, so he was likely uninsured. How much sympathy do unlicensed and uninsured drivers who kill get on here? None. And rightly so.
He may have been a driving god, but sounds to me like he messed up big time.
I agree that the lapsed licence didn't have any bearing on the crash (and he MAY not even have known). The fact that he wasn't rated to fly the aircraft in question is much more serious, and something that he would have to have known. To fly any aircraft you're not rated for, is pretty poor judgement. To perform extreme manouveres in said aircraft is hugely irresponsible. Yes, he's paid the ultimate price, but he's takes a "friend" and two young children with him. It just smacks of an air of invulnerability, and a complete disregard for the law. Idiot !!!!
robbom3 said:
I agree that the lapsed licence didn't have any bearing on the crash (and he MAY not even have known). The fact that he wasn't rated to fly the aircraft in question is much more serious, and something that he would have to have known. To fly any aircraft you're not rated for, is pretty poor judgement. To perform extreme manouveres in said aircraft is hugely irresponsible. Yes, he's paid the ultimate price, but he's takes a "friend" and two young children with him. It just smacks of an air of invulnerability, and a complete disregard for the law. Idiot !!!!
I've now read the full text of the report, and apparently every time his licence lapsed he failed to renew for a long period, but continued to fly. He didn't keep his flight logs up to date either.No valid licence = invalid insurance = inexcusable.
Soovy said:
uktrailmonster said:
Having read the link, it does say in there that the lapse in his license had no bearing on the accident or his flying skills.
Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat bk out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)
On the face if it it sounds like he was hooning and something happened.Was he hooning around when he crashed? This was a guy who drove and rode everything with wheels and an engine flat b
k out 100% all the time. So it wouldn't be a big surprise if he flew that way too. He died with his friends, who presumably knew his personality very well and accepted the risk of being his passengers. End of story (apart from all the legal bullst of course)A young boy was killed, who didn't have a choice whether to get in the aircraft or not.
His licence had expired, so he was likely uninsured. How much sympathy do unlicensed and uninsured drivers who kill get on here? None. And rightly so.
He may have been a driving god, but sounds to me like he messed up big time.
The lack of appropriate licence at the time is unfortunate, but there is no indication he hadn't had one in the past and therefore had proven his ability previously. I don't know the process in terms of re-testing etc. however, so may be wrong in the way I am viewing this.
Overall, a very tragic accident which a whole host of factors might have prevented, but Colin McRae had a lot of accidents which could have been said to be preventable during his life. Somehow I doubt he would have done much differently for himself, although for others it maybe would have been different.
andyps said:
The lack of appropriate licence at the time is unfortunate.............
Yes, especially for the wife and children of the bloke who got killed, as McRae's insurers will be uniklely to pay out.I am sure he was a great pilot, in every respect other than he couldn't be bothered to keep his paperwork up to date which in the case of a pilot is inexcusable.
Soovy said:
He may have been a driving god, but sounds to me like he messed up big time.
Much as it pains me to admit it, I have to agree that it looks very much this is the case - the natural instinct he had to drive flat out is what made him a great driver to watch, it is hard to imagine when reading the report that he didn't apply this same gung ho to flying also. I'll always remember him fondly as a driver, even having sat once in a cold and wet Kielder Forest to see him blatt by in his inimitable style - however, much as I desperately don't want it to, this does tarnish things greatly for me as a memory of him. The lapse in licence and the lapse in type approval are paperwork failings, not the cause of the accident. All the people in a position to know seemed to rate his piloting skills quite highly.
Sounds like he was showboating a bit and got caught out by this servo transparency they keep mentioning; it certainly sounds like all the factors that could cause this were in place (low level, high speed, heavy load, hard manoeuvring)... Either leading to him clipping the tree or else caused whilst trying to recover from clipping the tree.
Sounds like he was showboating a bit and got caught out by this servo transparency they keep mentioning; it certainly sounds like all the factors that could cause this were in place (low level, high speed, heavy load, hard manoeuvring)... Either leading to him clipping the tree or else caused whilst trying to recover from clipping the tree.
I've just read the entire report. Its very comprehensive, however, it makes no major conclusions. Its very scientific, but simply misses the most likely truth, for whatever reasons. Maybe if the man flying the helicopter hadnt been who he was, the most obviosu reasons for the crash would have been made clear.
I've experianced an number of helicopter flights myself. All have been meticulously professional. At no point in my flights did I witness laughter and enjoyment. I did not feel the need to video the pilot.
The very presance of the video camera and of impressionable young children on this flight would it seem to me have altered the mind set of the pilot. Instead of a straightforward A-B and back again flight to pick up a gearbox, the flight was turned into an 'experiance'. An experiance that has been recorded as seeing a reaction that produced laughter and enjoyment from those envolved. Had the camera not been rolling, and the others not been there, the pilot would most likely have flown a more conservative route with less aggressive manouvers.
But he didnt and they paid the price for it. There may well have been other factors, but at the end of the day the most obvious factor is the deviation from straight forward professional flying practices.
Not sure why the authors of the report cant see the evidence staring them in the face. Call it what you like, showing off, show boating, having fun. Or if you like, misjudgement, bad luck, skill gap, over confidence. There are many ways of descibing it. Usually bundled into 'pilot error'.
Sad for all involved. probably avoidable.
Think about your own journeies from place to place. When was the last time you felt the need to video it? When did it last produce laughter and enjoyment for your passengers? Did you ever give your passengers a 'thrill'?
I've experianced an number of helicopter flights myself. All have been meticulously professional. At no point in my flights did I witness laughter and enjoyment. I did not feel the need to video the pilot.
The very presance of the video camera and of impressionable young children on this flight would it seem to me have altered the mind set of the pilot. Instead of a straightforward A-B and back again flight to pick up a gearbox, the flight was turned into an 'experiance'. An experiance that has been recorded as seeing a reaction that produced laughter and enjoyment from those envolved. Had the camera not been rolling, and the others not been there, the pilot would most likely have flown a more conservative route with less aggressive manouvers.
But he didnt and they paid the price for it. There may well have been other factors, but at the end of the day the most obvious factor is the deviation from straight forward professional flying practices.
Not sure why the authors of the report cant see the evidence staring them in the face. Call it what you like, showing off, show boating, having fun. Or if you like, misjudgement, bad luck, skill gap, over confidence. There are many ways of descibing it. Usually bundled into 'pilot error'.
Sad for all involved. probably avoidable.
Think about your own journeies from place to place. When was the last time you felt the need to video it? When did it last produce laughter and enjoyment for your passengers? Did you ever give your passengers a 'thrill'?
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