Discussion
I have been saving my pennies for an Ultima GTR and had decided it was the ONE to buy until USA made GTM-200 showed. I know the Ultima has more time/linage and proven. What are some thoughts about GTM-200?
Karlo
Idaho, USA
See Link
www.ffcobra.com/magazine/gtm.html
Karlo
Idaho, USA
See Link
www.ffcobra.com/magazine/gtm.html
Factory Five's the largest kit car manufacturer in the world. They're not going anywhere (hopefully)
The car's some way off being launched, they were hoping to announce it mid-November, but I gather that's been put back a bit.
It's going to use the Corvette as a donor.
Unlike a great many kitcar manufacturers (cue Den...) they haven't got a history of advertising things that don't exist. The site is pretty clear about where they're at with the GTM.
It's not going to be an Ultima competitor really, far more a traditional 'kit car' with a donor vehicle and perhaps a greater expectation that the customers will be willing to do some work to get it sorted.
The car's some way off being launched, they were hoping to announce it mid-November, but I gather that's been put back a bit.
It's going to use the Corvette as a donor.
Unlike a great many kitcar manufacturers (cue Den...) they haven't got a history of advertising things that don't exist. The site is pretty clear about where they're at with the GTM.
It's not going to be an Ultima competitor really, far more a traditional 'kit car' with a donor vehicle and perhaps a greater expectation that the customers will be willing to do some work to get it sorted.
Have to agree with STIG on the looks especially in the drawings....... however I actually think the real mock ups look a lot better and I actually quite like it.
There seems to be quite a few cars on the horizon that may rival an Ultima in the Kit Supercar arena, but for now the Ultima is King.
There seems to be quite a few cars on the horizon that may rival an Ultima in the Kit Supercar arena, but for now the Ultima is King.
The url is for an article June 19, 2002 and refers to a launch date 2003-4
If you follow the links to FFR's site the GTM info is not updated very much, still the same photos.
One notable quote is
"Performance, usability and affordability: The GTM is focused on being able to see out the back window while enjoying a cool/quiet interior, and still being lightning fast. This kit will benefit from all of our racing and engineering experience. We are investing huge amounts of money in this design. The first two years of production will be set aside for FFR customers only. Stay tuned."
So, the GTM is focussed on being able to see out the back window...... Prefer front window view myself!
And the quote mentions the first two years being reserved for FFR customers only. Mmmm.
If you follow the links to FFR's site the GTM info is not updated very much, still the same photos.
One notable quote is
"Performance, usability and affordability: The GTM is focused on being able to see out the back window while enjoying a cool/quiet interior, and still being lightning fast. This kit will benefit from all of our racing and engineering experience. We are investing huge amounts of money in this design. The first two years of production will be set aside for FFR customers only. Stay tuned."
So, the GTM is focussed on being able to see out the back window...... Prefer front window view myself!
And the quote mentions the first two years being reserved for FFR customers only. Mmmm.
They're a fair way on with development, the website's not a strong point of the co. (to say the least). You might scoff at reserving the first two years production for pre-existing customers, but bear in mind that some of those customers are professional constructors and that FFR have sold 1000s of units.
As most of you know, I live 3 miles from Factory Five, and have built and campaigned successfully a carbon fibre FFR Cobra, albeit with our modifications.
http://home.comcast.net/~rosenracing5/wsb/html/view.cgi-photo.html--SiteID-724093.html
At the time that I was contemplating the Ultima, I heard rumours about the FFR mid-engine concept. Jim Schenck who is the project head, showed me in advance, the mock-up photos that are posted. To me, the design looked like a cross between a Saleen and a Mosler. Jim said the design was done by committee.
The problems I had were that I really wanted (at the time) an open car, and I could see that they would never have the car ready in the near future.
Jim is a great person, and he was at my shop many times while I was building the Ultima. It was through his help I was able to map the Edelbrock FI to the point I could drive the car.
I think he realized from seeing my drivetrain, that the Audi transaxle would not work, so they're reverting to a similar setup. They're still going to use modified Corvette suspension parts.
FFR is at SEMA this week, so I couldn't contact Jim for an upate, but will when he returns.
IMHO, while the GTM 200 has a striking initial appearance, the Ultima's have a design look that is cleaner, softer, and less gaudy.
Jack
http://home.comcast.net/~rosenracing5/wsb/html/view.cgi-photo.html--SiteID-724093.html
At the time that I was contemplating the Ultima, I heard rumours about the FFR mid-engine concept. Jim Schenck who is the project head, showed me in advance, the mock-up photos that are posted. To me, the design looked like a cross between a Saleen and a Mosler. Jim said the design was done by committee.
The problems I had were that I really wanted (at the time) an open car, and I could see that they would never have the car ready in the near future.
Jim is a great person, and he was at my shop many times while I was building the Ultima. It was through his help I was able to map the Edelbrock FI to the point I could drive the car.
I think he realized from seeing my drivetrain, that the Audi transaxle would not work, so they're reverting to a similar setup. They're still going to use modified Corvette suspension parts.
FFR is at SEMA this week, so I couldn't contact Jim for an upate, but will when he returns.
IMHO, while the GTM 200 has a striking initial appearance, the Ultima's have a design look that is cleaner, softer, and less gaudy.
Jack
You might want to check the Factory Five website now. www.factoryfive.com/table/ffrkits/GTM/gtmupdate/gtmrelease.html
They have formally introduced the GTM. Nice car, but I hate the color it is painted!
>> Edited by tetteh on Tuesday 4th November 21:34
They have formally introduced the GTM. Nice car, but I hate the color it is painted!
>> Edited by tetteh on Tuesday 4th November 21:34
Nice, but the proportinos don't seem to work for me visually. That cockpit looks extremely low and small?
Also, is it just me or does the front valance raise up a bit relative to the rest of the body? Can't be good for aerodynamics - granted this is an early prototype.
Still, if it can be built for sub $45k then it seems good value.
Also, is it just me or does the front valance raise up a bit relative to the rest of the body? Can't be good for aerodynamics - granted this is an early prototype.
Still, if it can be built for sub $45k then it seems good value.
Stig said:
Nice, but the proportinos don't seem to work for me visually. That cockpit looks extremely low and small?
The prototype looks like too many other cars on the road. Ford is coming out with the GT40 and is going to sell for around $140K US. This is very GT40'ish looking with a few modernized changes. I agree with Stig that the cockpit is very low. The new shape of many cars has you sitting very low in relationship to the windows.
I still prefer the unigue looks of the Ultima.
Rear overhang? Where?
I think it looks pretty good in general. Not exactly to my tastes, but then again neither is the Ultima (I don't like the bubble cockpit, but I've got pretty high standards when it comes to aesthetics).
Looks better than the GT40, more modern. The front looks good. The back is a bit plain, I prefered the other setup they had. Looks great from the rear quarter view, apart from the light setup. I don't like the rear quarter windows. That pillar just ruins the lines of the car, I think the looks would flow better if the rear quarts and sides were joined. I'd lose the wing.
Looks like the rear part (from back wheels) is a bit Porsche GT1ish, GT40 curve over the wheels. The front angles sort of remind me of a S7 or the W12 (think that's it- the VW super car). Man those side and rear quart windows do look a bit weird, but would be fine if the car was in a darker colour.
I think a bright, metallic blue would look great on this car.
I'm sure you'd all disagree, but it does look more attractive than the Ultima apart from the rear and those side quarter windows. The Ultima looks better though, just flows better.
I think the looks will grow on people, I thought at first that the Ultima was sort of ugly but it has really grown on me. It would also probally look better in person.
Looks like a good thing for $45k US (Doc, that's around 2 cent A$ these days
)
I think it looks pretty good in general. Not exactly to my tastes, but then again neither is the Ultima (I don't like the bubble cockpit, but I've got pretty high standards when it comes to aesthetics).
Looks better than the GT40, more modern. The front looks good. The back is a bit plain, I prefered the other setup they had. Looks great from the rear quarter view, apart from the light setup. I don't like the rear quarter windows. That pillar just ruins the lines of the car, I think the looks would flow better if the rear quarts and sides were joined. I'd lose the wing.
Looks like the rear part (from back wheels) is a bit Porsche GT1ish, GT40 curve over the wheels. The front angles sort of remind me of a S7 or the W12 (think that's it- the VW super car). Man those side and rear quart windows do look a bit weird, but would be fine if the car was in a darker colour.
I think a bright, metallic blue would look great on this car.
I'm sure you'd all disagree, but it does look more attractive than the Ultima apart from the rear and those side quarter windows. The Ultima looks better though, just flows better.
I think the looks will grow on people, I thought at first that the Ultima was sort of ugly but it has really grown on me. It would also probally look better in person.
Looks like a good thing for $45k US (Doc, that's around 2 cent A$ these days
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