shes running finally. diagnostic help red'q 2moro
Discussion
I finally had her ticking over tonight. I plumed in the fuel hoses as advised in another thread and started her up to find a petol drip from the o ring on the pressure regulator to the fuel rail. hunted everywhere for a duplicate o ring but no one had one the same spec as what was on there.
I ended up checking the fuel rail hole to find a mate had lubed the hole with a little grease for ease of popping the o ring in as it was a meag tight squees so much so that it couldnt be done by hand. I degreased it cleaned the o ring, added a bit of good old saliva and re assembled............. no more drip. I will keep my eye on it though as i cant afford to have a melted bath tub out of it.
however it was running but failing to idle. probably due to me unwinding the idle screws so they do not touch anything and for me slackening or making the throttle linkage equal. so I wedged the throttle open at 1500revs for a while, whilst i thorughly checked all hoses and oil filled parts etc. all water tight and oil tight so far.
one problem is the MIL light is on now and it wasn't before I stripped it. I will be going down the garage tomorrow with the laptop and will report back with the findings. thats where help and advice from you guys will be needed.
one other thing, now TCS has shut where's the next best place to take the cerb to, for them to set it up properly. Does TCS do hobbles still?
I ended up checking the fuel rail hole to find a mate had lubed the hole with a little grease for ease of popping the o ring in as it was a meag tight squees so much so that it couldnt be done by hand. I degreased it cleaned the o ring, added a bit of good old saliva and re assembled............. no more drip. I will keep my eye on it though as i cant afford to have a melted bath tub out of it.
however it was running but failing to idle. probably due to me unwinding the idle screws so they do not touch anything and for me slackening or making the throttle linkage equal. so I wedged the throttle open at 1500revs for a while, whilst i thorughly checked all hoses and oil filled parts etc. all water tight and oil tight so far.
one problem is the MIL light is on now and it wasn't before I stripped it. I will be going down the garage tomorrow with the laptop and will report back with the findings. thats where help and advice from you guys will be needed.
one other thing, now TCS has shut where's the next best place to take the cerb to, for them to set it up properly. Does TCS do hobbles still?
plumAJP said:
now TCS has shut where's the next best place to take the cerb to, for them to set it up properly.
This is a question I need answering too. Glad to hear its up and running Shayne. Thats going to be a peach of a Cerb when its finished.
Can't you remove the wheels once its at the paint shop, and then get them refurbed? I'm sure the paint shop would accomodate you.
Edited by caduceus on Wednesday 29th April 09:59
cheers buddy.
I'm in a dilema now as I was going to take the spiders for a refurb this week but if I do that then I have to wait for them to come back before
I can roll her to the paint shop.
or do I get car painted first then refurb the wheels. either way im going to have to wait for one or the other.
I'm in a dilema now as I was going to take the spiders for a refurb this week but if I do that then I have to wait for them to come back before
I can roll her to the paint shop.
or do I get car painted first then refurb the wheels. either way im going to have to wait for one or the other.
plumAJP said:
cheers buddy.
I'm in a dilema now as I was going to take the spiders for a refurb this week but if I do that then I have to wait for them to come back before
I can roll her to the paint shop.
or do I get car painted first then refurb the wheels. either way im going to have to wait for one or the other.
You might find that the spray shop use a spare set of wheel whilst the car is in there, enabling you send the wheel away. Or have I missed that you are spraying it?I'm in a dilema now as I was going to take the spiders for a refurb this week but if I do that then I have to wait for them to come back before
I can roll her to the paint shop.
or do I get car painted first then refurb the wheels. either way im going to have to wait for one or the other.
no worries mate i'll just have to wait a week extra.
anyway. i plugged her in tonight and got both banks throttle to 15% or as close as possible, i had throttle1 to 14.8% and 15.2% (it kept jumping between these 2 figures) throttle 2 was set at 15.2 %.
it wouldnt idle tonight for some reason i couldnt write down the diagnostic readings as the manifolds were smoking like hell and i had my wndscreen removed earlier and i think some of the bonder had fallen on the manifold so that was burning too. that garage was full of exhaust fumes, brurning rubber fumes and fumes from the manifold wrap etc. so i just kept it revving at 2k to burnall the gunk off and left as my eyes were burning.
any ideas why it doesnt want to idle? it does idle for 5 seconds but then gets lumpy and dies. would a duff lambda sensor cause something like this.
anyway. i plugged her in tonight and got both banks throttle to 15% or as close as possible, i had throttle1 to 14.8% and 15.2% (it kept jumping between these 2 figures) throttle 2 was set at 15.2 %.
it wouldnt idle tonight for some reason i couldnt write down the diagnostic readings as the manifolds were smoking like hell and i had my wndscreen removed earlier and i think some of the bonder had fallen on the manifold so that was burning too. that garage was full of exhaust fumes, brurning rubber fumes and fumes from the manifold wrap etc. so i just kept it revving at 2k to burnall the gunk off and left as my eyes were burning.
any ideas why it doesnt want to idle? it does idle for 5 seconds but then gets lumpy and dies. would a duff lambda sensor cause something like this.
I take it your 15% throttle setting was with the cable disconnected? Normally you need about 17-18% throttle to get the idle. Have you checked for air leaks around the inlets- bit of soapy water works a treat (not sure this would definelty cause your symptoms, but it's still well worth checking).
caduceus said:
plumAJP said:
now TCS has shut where's the next best place to take the cerb to, for them to set it up properly.
This is a question I need answering too. Glad to hear its up and running Shayne. Thats going to be a peach of a Cerb when its finished.
Can't you remove the wheels once its at the paint shop, and then get them refurbed? I'm sure the paint shop would accomodate you.
Edited by caduceus on Wednesday 29th April 09:59
Yup mate, 15% is the reading that the ecu takes as (effectively) a fully closed throttle. Definitely too low for an idle anyway. Just open it out till its happier- easy!
I'm sure it was Joo of TCS fame who wrote a guide on setting the throttles. If I remember correctly, the procedure was:
1) Disconnect throttle cable and linkage
2) Adjust t-pots untill readings are 15%
3) Reconnect linkage and cable
4) Adjust linkage untill t-pots read evenly
5) Adjust cable untill idle throttle reads circa 18% (basically untill you get an idle of about 1000 rpm)
Oh, and the soapy water will get sucked in if there's a leak (thats why its soapy- lowers the surface tension). But dont worry, a tiny bit of water like that wont do a thing wrong to the engine.
I'm sure it was Joo of TCS fame who wrote a guide on setting the throttles. If I remember correctly, the procedure was:
1) Disconnect throttle cable and linkage
2) Adjust t-pots untill readings are 15%
3) Reconnect linkage and cable
4) Adjust linkage untill t-pots read evenly
5) Adjust cable untill idle throttle reads circa 18% (basically untill you get an idle of about 1000 rpm)
Oh, and the soapy water will get sucked in if there's a leak (thats why its soapy- lowers the surface tension). But dont worry, a tiny bit of water like that wont do a thing wrong to the engine.
I wasnt worried about the sucking in of water just wondered if it would show as clearly as it would if it was blowing the bubbles in the water rather than sucking.
Right I removed the cable and linkage and adjusted the throttle arms via the idle screws until they read 15%. Then I connected the cable and linkage and made sure it stayed at 15%.(now its obvious that's a shut throttle so no air to keep it idling)
When you say set thorrtle POTS at 15% is that different to setting the throttle arms(where linkage connects). how do I set the throttle pots to 15%.... do I remove cable and linkage, un-wind the idle screw so they do not interfere at all and then slacken off the throttle pot screws and twist each throttle pot until the laptop shows 15% for each T.Pot (the Tpots don't move hardly but from another post I see that a tiny movement results in big changes in %)
Right I removed the cable and linkage and adjusted the throttle arms via the idle screws until they read 15%. Then I connected the cable and linkage and made sure it stayed at 15%.(now its obvious that's a shut throttle so no air to keep it idling)
When you say set thorrtle POTS at 15% is that different to setting the throttle arms(where linkage connects). how do I set the throttle pots to 15%.... do I remove cable and linkage, un-wind the idle screw so they do not interfere at all and then slacken off the throttle pot screws and twist each throttle pot until the laptop shows 15% for each T.Pot (the Tpots don't move hardly but from another post I see that a tiny movement results in big changes in %)
right great news.
found jools guide eventually I had printed out and shuved in my laptop bag. I follwoed it and set T pots to 15 or as close to as possible. connected linkage and cable then adjusted to 16.8 or as close to as poss. i had it at 17.2 on throt2 and 16.9 on thrott 1.
she idled like a dream from cold.
i have recorded a 10min section of it running with the occassional rev but how do i host that or who wants to volunteer to look at the file for me to see if things are ok.
the adaptives were out mind. one was fluctuating from 18 to 20 and the other was on minus -8 to -5 fluctuating. both lambda's seemd ok but what looks wrong.
found jools guide eventually I had printed out and shuved in my laptop bag. I follwoed it and set T pots to 15 or as close to as possible. connected linkage and cable then adjusted to 16.8 or as close to as poss. i had it at 17.2 on throt2 and 16.9 on thrott 1.
she idled like a dream from cold.
i have recorded a 10min section of it running with the occassional rev but how do i host that or who wants to volunteer to look at the file for me to see if things are ok.
the adaptives were out mind. one was fluctuating from 18 to 20 and the other was on minus -8 to -5 fluctuating. both lambda's seemd ok but what looks wrong.
plumAJP said:
right great news.
the adaptives were out mind. one was fluctuating from 18 to 20 and the other was on minus -8 to -5 fluctuating. both lambda's seemd ok but what looks wrong.
Positive adaptive - more air flowing than fuelling in the base map so fuel is addedthe adaptives were out mind. one was fluctuating from 18 to 20 and the other was on minus -8 to -5 fluctuating. both lambda's seemd ok but what looks wrong.
Negative adaptive - less air flowing than fuelling in the base map so fuel is removed
The bank with 18 to 20 is flowing too much air. You need to adjust the linkage to close the butterflies slightly on that bank to reduce the air flow and then adjust the TPot to bring it back to the same reading.
Moving the butterflies by adjusting the linkage increases or decreases air flow. Moving the TPot changes the amount of fuel injected. So having closed the butterflies a bit the TPot reading goes down and the amount of fuel injected changes. Then moving the TPot to get back to the same reading gets the fuel back where it was.
Do it slowly with small changes and you should get to a point where the bank has adaptives close to zero.
Then working on the other bank you can close the butterflies slightly to reduce the airflow to match the fuel being delivered and tweak the TPot back to where it was.
You want equal TPot readings around 17, and equal adaptive readings as close to zero as possible
The only problem is that if it is the offside bank you have to use the idle screw to open/close the butterflies which of course affects the idle speed and both banks are opened/closed. So you also have to tweak the connecting rod to get the near side bank back to where it was.
All a bit of a balancing act. Small adjustments are the only way to do it.
Also to remove the effect of any slop in the throttle linkage hold the throttle open slightly when comparing the readings.
Edited by mikesr on Friday 1st May 12:57
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