Please read copy of email from Jon B
Discussion
VCA Web Committee / National Board and Officers,:
I have been advised that, effective Immediately, your most knowledgeable, senior VCA member-Sponsors, like Dan Cragin, Chuck Tator, Woddhouse Dodge, PartsRack, etc etc, may no longer post in the VCA Member forums, or general forums. We may NOT give advice freely as we have for 15+ years. We may only post in two "commercial" forums to which we have been unilaterally corralled.
How can the Committee, with any clear conscience, eliminate DECADES of collective Viper experience from paid member-vendors, when owners and members ask routine questions that now we cannot answer ?! Any NEWBEE can express their opinions anywhere, but NOT YOUR SPONSORS ?!?!
This is a major departure from VCA policy. I officially request as a VCA member that you POST THIS NEW POLICY and SOLICIT COMMENT, and MEMBER INPUT and then enact changes as VCA members see fit.
Your committee's censorship is overt, ill-conceived, and a terrible disservice to VCA members and Viper owners everywhere. [It also denies my rights as a paid VCA member.]
In the interim, SUSPEND this terrible mistake while you poll your members, as well as your regional presidents. Oh.....and why not ask your sponsors?
I have been advised that, effective Immediately, your most knowledgeable, senior VCA member-Sponsors, like Dan Cragin, Chuck Tator, Woddhouse Dodge, PartsRack, etc etc, may no longer post in the VCA Member forums, or general forums. We may NOT give advice freely as we have for 15+ years. We may only post in two "commercial" forums to which we have been unilaterally corralled.
How can the Committee, with any clear conscience, eliminate DECADES of collective Viper experience from paid member-vendors, when owners and members ask routine questions that now we cannot answer ?! Any NEWBEE can express their opinions anywhere, but NOT YOUR SPONSORS ?!?!
This is a major departure from VCA policy. I officially request as a VCA member that you POST THIS NEW POLICY and SOLICIT COMMENT, and MEMBER INPUT and then enact changes as VCA members see fit.
Your committee's censorship is overt, ill-conceived, and a terrible disservice to VCA members and Viper owners everywhere. [It also denies my rights as a paid VCA member.]
In the interim, SUSPEND this terrible mistake while you poll your members, as well as your regional presidents. Oh.....and why not ask your sponsors?
viper paul said:
Could also be that someones been 'got at' tol ensure that they get whole attention.
But it does suck that several people most of whom are owners and members are no longer allowed to post in the ordinary forums.
As I said earlier, wouldn't be remotely surprised if the addition of the Grail Trail/Grailkeeper is something to do with all this... Is that section of the site funded at all? Does make you wonder if they need to gain more attention to that section and make sure he earns his crust from the VCA?But it does suck that several people most of whom are owners and members are no longer allowed to post in the ordinary forums.
It doesn't really make a great deal of sense though does it? The bulk of the posts on the VCA forums are requesting advice or help with something, which means if that all gets shifted to one main area that area will become flooded and many of the other sections will have a whole lot of tumble weed blowing through... Crazy! And let's face it the assistance of people like Chuck and JonB is always highly appreciated by the masses and surely that's what things like the VCA are all about?
Edited by RT/10Dave on Wednesday 27th May 10:58
That has to be a mistake because if it isn't it is so dumb its unbelievable. There have been lots of changes to the vca forums of late, classifieds were cleared out a few weeks ago, I had to put in a lot of new information in my profile the other day. so hopefully it is just an unexpected side affect of something else and will be sorted soon.
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ViperDave said:
That has to be a mistake because if it isn't it is so dumb its unbelievable. There have been lots of changes to the vca forums of late, classifieds were cleared out a few weeks ago, I had to put in a lot of new information in my profile the other day. so hopefully it is just an unexpected side affect of something else and will be sorted soon.
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post by Chris VCA pres:
We have received numerous complaints about certain vendors abusing the system, hijacking threads for their own benefit, etc. We (the VCA) have even been accused of "commercializing" the website as there are so many vendor posts pushing product unchecked throughout the forums. One of the folks that moderates other auto-related forums (and bigger than this one) tells us they have never seen vendors make so many posts or allowed to mention their company name or products in the general forums like we have been allowing here.
Yesterday the vendors were notified that their posts would be largely restricted to the Vipers & Vendors category, of which there are numerous sub-forums. We have since learned that this is fine with many of the vendors (even encouraged by a couple), but that a couple others are pretty upset. We are working through several possible solutions to make everybody happy.
It is important to note that this site is NOT made possible by vendor support as some would have you believe. If we truly wanted to commercialize the site we would simply use Google Adsense/Adwords, IntelliTXT, or any of hundreds of programs that provide much, much better income. We offer advertising to bring limited income to the club, but more importantly to help our members and hopefully provide them with direct benefits from those same advertisers.
The bottom line is that we are working through alternatives right now. We spent two hours with two national officers on a cenference call with a vendor last night, while another national officer spent three hours replying by PM and e-mail to the other concerned vendor. Obviously this was not our intention (to spend time reassuring vendors) but at the same time our members and their concerns are ALWAYS our top priority.
We have received numerous complaints about certain vendors abusing the system, hijacking threads for their own benefit, etc. We (the VCA) have even been accused of "commercializing" the website as there are so many vendor posts pushing product unchecked throughout the forums. One of the folks that moderates other auto-related forums (and bigger than this one) tells us they have never seen vendors make so many posts or allowed to mention their company name or products in the general forums like we have been allowing here.
Yesterday the vendors were notified that their posts would be largely restricted to the Vipers & Vendors category, of which there are numerous sub-forums. We have since learned that this is fine with many of the vendors (even encouraged by a couple), but that a couple others are pretty upset. We are working through several possible solutions to make everybody happy.
It is important to note that this site is NOT made possible by vendor support as some would have you believe. If we truly wanted to commercialize the site we would simply use Google Adsense/Adwords, IntelliTXT, or any of hundreds of programs that provide much, much better income. We offer advertising to bring limited income to the club, but more importantly to help our members and hopefully provide them with direct benefits from those same advertisers.
The bottom line is that we are working through alternatives right now. We spent two hours with two national officers on a cenference call with a vendor last night, while another national officer spent three hours replying by PM and e-mail to the other concerned vendor. Obviously this was not our intention (to spend time reassuring vendors) but at the same time our members and their concerns are ALWAYS our top priority.
Dr-Bob said:
Got the same mail...
THATS NUTS........
Does that mean know one can give advise... Half these vendors give advice and recomend other vendors so its not like its a sales pitch!!!!!
Whenever i have read a comment from any of the guys on there,i feel passionTHATS NUTS........
Does that mean know one can give advise... Half these vendors give advice and recomend other vendors so its not like its a sales pitch!!!!!
Edited by Dr-Bob on Wednesday 27th May 10:34
not sales pitch.
Snuff to make you spill your beer.It`s what the forums are all about for me.
one of the sponsors posted his email on the alley site....
Dear Valued VCA Sponsor:
As you know, we have been working diligently to improve the benefits we offer you on an ongoing basis. We have recently created an entire category dedicated to you specifically: Vipers & Vendors. In that category we have added individual vendor review forums for each of you, a "parts wanted/where can I find this part" forum ("What'cha Need for Your Snake?"), and moved others into that category such as Performance Modifications and Viper Detailing. The idea is to create a very focused area for our vendors to prosper on the site.
Our Moderators, Web Committee, and National Officers have been continuing to discuss other ways to help focus product-related posts in that section so that you can better manage it. We have been consistently moving "looking for a part" posts to the "What'cha Need for Your Snake?" and vendor reviews/questions to the individual review sections of each vendor. Again, the idea is to focus everything in your Vipers & Vendors category.
Today we will be implementing a new policy that continues that same focus by having vendor/sponsor posts targeted specifically for the Vipers & Vendors category. This means that we will be restricting vendor posts in the general forums in an effort to continue to drive people to visit you in the forums we set up for you specifically. We have been observing carefully over the past month or so where Vendor postings AND user questions are originating. We have been routinely moving user postings into the vendor areas and we will continue to do that, but if we truly want to let the users KNOW that the way to reach the vendors is in the vendor forums then we need to make sure you are indeed posting in there and not the general forums. The idea is not only to give all of our valued sponsors the opportunity to have UNLIMITED posting in the Vipers & Vendors category but to create an area of the website that becomes known for it's quick and accurate technical response, much like the SRT Engineers forum and the GrailKeeper forum. We want to point the way to that area as the experts location.
Remember that ANY vendor who is not a site supporter and posts in that area OR the general forums will have their post pulled.
We understand that some of you have been VCA members for many years and want to make sure that you continue to have a voice in the club and on the website. For this reason we created The VCA Suggestion Box, to which vendors that are also VCA members will have unlimited access as well. We value your input.
Thanks again for advertising with the VCA!
Dear Valued VCA Sponsor:
As you know, we have been working diligently to improve the benefits we offer you on an ongoing basis. We have recently created an entire category dedicated to you specifically: Vipers & Vendors. In that category we have added individual vendor review forums for each of you, a "parts wanted/where can I find this part" forum ("What'cha Need for Your Snake?"), and moved others into that category such as Performance Modifications and Viper Detailing. The idea is to create a very focused area for our vendors to prosper on the site.
Our Moderators, Web Committee, and National Officers have been continuing to discuss other ways to help focus product-related posts in that section so that you can better manage it. We have been consistently moving "looking for a part" posts to the "What'cha Need for Your Snake?" and vendor reviews/questions to the individual review sections of each vendor. Again, the idea is to focus everything in your Vipers & Vendors category.
Today we will be implementing a new policy that continues that same focus by having vendor/sponsor posts targeted specifically for the Vipers & Vendors category. This means that we will be restricting vendor posts in the general forums in an effort to continue to drive people to visit you in the forums we set up for you specifically. We have been observing carefully over the past month or so where Vendor postings AND user questions are originating. We have been routinely moving user postings into the vendor areas and we will continue to do that, but if we truly want to let the users KNOW that the way to reach the vendors is in the vendor forums then we need to make sure you are indeed posting in there and not the general forums. The idea is not only to give all of our valued sponsors the opportunity to have UNLIMITED posting in the Vipers & Vendors category but to create an area of the website that becomes known for it's quick and accurate technical response, much like the SRT Engineers forum and the GrailKeeper forum. We want to point the way to that area as the experts location.
Remember that ANY vendor who is not a site supporter and posts in that area OR the general forums will have their post pulled.
We understand that some of you have been VCA members for many years and want to make sure that you continue to have a voice in the club and on the website. For this reason we created The VCA Suggestion Box, to which vendors that are also VCA members will have unlimited access as well. We value your input.
Thanks again for advertising with the VCA!
Viper said:
post by Chris VCA pres:
We have received numerous complaints about certain vendors abusing the system, hijacking threads for their own benefit, etc. We (the VCA) have even been accused of "commercializing" the website as there are so many vendor posts pushing product unchecked throughout the forums. One of the folks that moderates other auto-related forums (and bigger than this one) tells us they have never seen vendors make so many posts or allowed to mention their company name or products in the general forums like we have been allowing here.
Hmmm... I wonder who that could be then?? We have received numerous complaints about certain vendors abusing the system, hijacking threads for their own benefit, etc. We (the VCA) have even been accused of "commercializing" the website as there are so many vendor posts pushing product unchecked throughout the forums. One of the folks that moderates other auto-related forums (and bigger than this one) tells us they have never seen vendors make so many posts or allowed to mention their company name or products in the general forums like we have been allowing here.
I have to agree that JonB does have a habit of hijacking threads and inevitably ends them with we have these available at Partsrack, but other than him I can't really think of anyone else who does this... I still think the Grailkeeper situation is part of the problem, not liking being undermined by other people giving advice in alternative forums so lets keep these people in their own little section.
Viper said:
one of the sponsors posted his email on the alley site....
The idea is not only to give all of our valued sponsors the opportunity to have UNLIMITED posting in the Vipers & Vendors category but to create an area of the website that becomes known for it's quick and accurate technical response, much like the SRT Engineers forum and the GrailKeeper forum. We want to point the way to that area as the experts location.
Remember that ANY vendor who is not a site supporter and posts in that area OR the general forums will have their post pulled.
The idea is not only to give all of our valued sponsors the opportunity to have UNLIMITED posting in the Vipers & Vendors category but to create an area of the website that becomes known for it's quick and accurate technical response, much like the SRT Engineers forum and the GrailKeeper forum. We want to point the way to that area as the experts location.
Remember that ANY vendor who is not a site supporter and posts in that area OR the general forums will have their post pulled.
Oh, and they can't post in my section either! 
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