Which brakes?

[wooly350i]

Hi all,

I am mid way through the 5 litre engine upgrade on my 350i, and have been thinking for a while about how i am going to get the beast to stop with all the extra power it has. Does anyone have any recommendations on what brakes to go for, bearing in mind i dont wish to break the bank.

Cheers, John

[gsx600]

Just think ahead

From what I recall the SE and SEAC 450's only had the same vented discs as the 400 420 430

Maybe use different type of pads ?

[JR]

Cirks has very good brakes.

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

gsx600 said:

Just think ahead

From what I recall the SE and SEAC 450's only had the same vented discs as the 400 420 430

Maybe use different type of pads ?

Also the Griff and Chim 4.0 and 4.5 had smaller brakes,
If you can lock them up and they don't over heat, then they are big enough, bigger brakes, only do 1 main thing and that is cool quicker. smaller brakes in some ways are more effective, most bespoke hill climb cars will only have small brakes, as they don't get used enough to overheat.

Also the other problem with better breaking fronts is that it will change the front rear balance, and you could end up will less stopping distance, as you will be only braking on 2 wheels not 4.

[JR]

TVRleigh_BBWR said:

gsx600 said:

Just think ahead

From what I recall the SE and SEAC 450's only had the same vented discs as the 400 420 430

Maybe use different type of pads ?

Also the Griff and Chim 4.0 and 4.5 had smaller brakes,
If you can lock them up and they don't over heat, then they are big enough, bigger brakes, only do 1 main thing and that is cool quicker. smaller brakes in some ways are more effective, most bespoke hill climb cars will only have small brakes, as they don't get used enough to overheat.

Also the other problem with better breaking fronts is that it will change the front rear balance, and you could end up will less stopping distance, as you will be only braking on 2 wheels not 4.

L, remember that the OP has a 350i. When I pushed my 350i hard I found that the limiting factor was the brakes overheating and brake fluid boiling (DoT 5.1) Whilst the solid Granada discs are reasonable they are not good (and the Princess calipers aren't brilliant.)

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

JR said:

TVRleigh_BBWR said:

gsx600 said:

Just think ahead

From what I recall the SE and SEAC 450's only had the same vented discs as the 400 420 430

Maybe use different type of pads ?

Also the Griff and Chim 4.0 and 4.5 had smaller brakes,
If you can lock them up and they don't over heat, then they are big enough, bigger brakes, only do 1 main thing and that is cool quicker. smaller brakes in some ways are more effective, most bespoke hill climb cars will only have small brakes, as they don't get used enough to overheat.

Also the other problem with better breaking fronts is that it will change the front rear balance, and you could end up will less stopping distance, as you will be only braking on 2 wheels not 4.

L, remember that the OP has a 350i. When I pushed my 350i hard I found that the limiting factor was the brakes overheating and brake fluid boiling (DoT 5.1) Whilst the solid Granada discs are reasonable they are not good (and the Princess calipers aren't brilliant.)

Fair point, did not realise due to GSX's post.
Also I pointed out that if you brakes are over heating then you do need bigger/better ones.

I think a cheap ok upgrade is to upgrade to a Ford Mondeo system.

[simonwedge]

Also see following website for Wedge brake upgrades:

http://www.shpub.co.uk/tvrservices/tvrs_brakes1.ht...

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

simonwedge said:

Also see following website for Wedge brake upgrades:

http://www.shpub.co.uk/tvrservices/tvrs_brakes1.ht...

I Know Tower View are no longer in business, I think one of the guy's now works with Steve Heath, but not sure they are doing upgrades.

RT racing may have some options.

[gsx600]

TVRleigh_BBWR said:

JR said:

TVRleigh_BBWR said:

gsx600 said:

Just think ahead

From what I recall the SE and SEAC 450's only had the same vented discs as the 400 420 430

Maybe use different type of pads ?

Also the Griff and Chim 4.0 and 4.5 had smaller brakes,
If you can lock them up and they don't over heat, then they are big enough, bigger brakes, only do 1 main thing and that is cool quicker. smaller brakes in some ways are more effective, most bespoke hill climb cars will only have small brakes, as they don't get used enough to overheat.

Also the other problem with better breaking fronts is that it will change the front rear balance, and you could end up will less stopping distance, as you will be only braking on 2 wheels not 4.

L, remember that the OP has a 350i. When I pushed my 350i hard I found that the limiting factor was the brakes overheating and brake fluid boiling (DoT 5.1) Whilst the solid Granada discs are reasonable they are not good (and the Princess calipers aren't brilliant.)

Fair point, did not realise due to GSX's post.
Also I pointed out that if you brakes are over heating then you do need bigger/better ones.

I think a cheap ok upgrade is to upgrade to a Ford Mondeo system.

Too true on my 350 I put vented brakes in with magnesium bells, got from some racer somewhere years ago. Certainly improved the 350. Also don't forget braided lines as also help in firmer pressure, well they did on the 450 anyways

Not heard of a Mondeo upgrade though

[leorest]

gsx600 said:

...Not heard of a Mondeo upgrade though...

Me neither.
Anyone got any details on this as I've got a Mondeo sitting in the garage not going anywhere...

[barrington]

i have fitted tuscan s front brakes on my 400 but you will need bigger wheels

[B@man]

leorest said:

gsx600 said:

...Not heard of a Mondeo upgrade though...

Me neither.
Anyone got any details on this as I've got a Mondeo sitting in the garage not going anywhere...

Mondeo brakes onto old ford's clicky

Info mainly for Capri / Escort struts but as the Cortina / Granada upright has the same M16 caliper the upgrades should fit the wedge.

Using a similar idea I've grafted a set of sierra vented front disks onto Escort Mk2 uprights, not quite as neat as the Caprisport job, but it ended up costing me a few bottles of beer.



Don't panic the fabricated bracket has a huge web welded inside to carry the rotational load, luckily it's not for the wedge as it's increased the unsprung weight but on a utility who cares !

[Transmitter Man]

Interesting site there Simon.

I recently picked up some Jag XJR rear Brembo's which I hope to have fitted to my other car which, like our wedges runs a salisbury rear axle with in-board discs.

I want to go to out-board for no other reason than it looks good, and of course makes changing pads easier.

Phil
420 SEAC

[B@man]

Transmitter Man said:

I want to go to out-board for no other reason than it looks good, and of course makes changing pads easier.

Phil
420 SEAC

Think I prefer the "Where the hell are your back brakes ???"

Outboard must be better for cooling though as the heat can dissipate into the wheel using the same theory as the caprisport conversions ?

Thanks for the comments on the site, Prior to TVR ownership I built a couple of kit cars so have built up a reasonable library of where to get bits to fix & upgrade fords - comes in handy with the ki... er, oops TVR !

[leorest]

Think I prefer the unsprung weight of inboard brakes. As far as I can see the only downside is a lack of cooling, no problem on the road and a bit of ducting will make it good for the track.

[Comadis]

a friend of mine owns a westfield. front hubs are escort or cortina and he uses citroen c15 alloy calipers. they are huge compared to the ford ones. when i had a look on them i couldnt see any adaptor plates...so it seams that they are a direct fit.

[Transmitter Man]

I've been made aware of the unsprung weight advantage of in-board rear discs so have come to the conclusion that all , or most all of the current crop of supercars go for aesthetics over outright performance!

Phil
420 SEAC

[cirks]

JR said:

Cirks has very good brakes.

Well thank you kind sir

[grahamw48]

cirks said:

JR said:

Cirks has very good brakes.

Well thank you kind sir

Oh dear....just had to click on that profile pic of yours again.

That is the best looking SE Wedge I've ever seen...apart from the spec.

[Wedg1e]

Transmitter Man said:

I've been made aware of the unsprung weight advantage of in-board rear discs so have come to the conclusion that all , or most all of the current crop of supercars go for aesthetics over outright performance!

Phil
420 SEAC

I think the original design by Jaguar was intended to reduce unsprung weight and to produce a compact rear axle assembly for the XJ6/ Sovereign etc... they fitted twin springs each side, small ones; gave a fantastic ride for its era and maximised boot and cabin space.
Strangely, people complain about the rear brakes being hard to work on, on the Wedge, yet on the Jag it was harder as all you had was a couple of holes in the pressed-steel beam to work through.

Lotus used the inboard disc setup from the Citroen SM on the Esprit but in trying to adapt the idea for the front-engined Elite/Eclat they lost the plot a bit and used inboard DRUMS - fine until you need to change the shoes when half the rear end of the car has to come apart to get the drums off
Allegedly the diff-with-inboard-drums setup was nicked from a milk float