Criminal Records check and Thomas the tank engine.....
Discussion
One of the attractions close by me is the "East lancashire railway", which runs for around sixteen miles between Heywood/Bury/Rawtenstall in Lancashire, and around four times a year they have a "Thomas the tank engine" weekend, to encourage families, where all the engines have smiley faces like "Thomas" "Henry", "James" etc....
With another "family" event coming up soon, I noticed the "Thomas" franchise has been dropped, and the ELR are going it alone will their own version, still with faces on the front of the Engines, but with different names such as "Sammy" "Bill" etc....
Of course, doing this they would avoid having to pay a hefty licence fee four times a year to the licence holders of the "Thomas" brand, but my question is, I know there are peado's around everywhere, but is this actually taking it too far...........
Full story here:-
http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/rossenda...
With another "family" event coming up soon, I noticed the "Thomas" franchise has been dropped, and the ELR are going it alone will their own version, still with faces on the front of the Engines, but with different names such as "Sammy" "Bill" etc....
Of course, doing this they would avoid having to pay a hefty licence fee four times a year to the licence holders of the "Thomas" brand, but my question is, I know there are peado's around everywhere, but is this actually taking it too far...........
Full story here:-
http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/rossenda...
There is quite a bit more to this than that report says - a couple of friends are volunteers on the ELR.
Without going into the minutae of the politics involvd, the bit about CRB checks for all is true. Did the article mention enhanced CRB checks? That's what HITT wanted - even for the signal staff and anyone else working on the track who has no dealings with the public 'on the day'. This appears to be an artificial stumbling block to ELR using the "Thomas" name, put in ELR's way by HITT after ELR had raised objections to other "Thomas" issues.
There's a lot more to it than this brief overview - but HITT got the result they wanted, anyway...
Without going into the minutae of the politics involvd, the bit about CRB checks for all is true. Did the article mention enhanced CRB checks? That's what HITT wanted - even for the signal staff and anyone else working on the track who has no dealings with the public 'on the day'. This appears to be an artificial stumbling block to ELR using the "Thomas" name, put in ELR's way by HITT after ELR had raised objections to other "Thomas" issues.
There's a lot more to it than this brief overview - but HITT got the result they wanted, anyway...
Very similar thing reported on the radio this morning.
See here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8153251.stm
Oli.
See here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8153251.stm
Oli.
After this happened in January I'm not surprised they are covering their arses with CRB checks tbh.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1128023/Bu...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1128023/Bu...
Wacky Racer said:
I know there are paedos around everywhere
There aren't. Obviously there are some (and even one is too many) but the reality is that the vast majority of sexual abuse takes place within the family.
Re the CRB, every time a predatory paedophile is discovered & convicted, the cry from the Daily Wail is that "something must be done." The government are doing something - the enhanced CRB checks - and, to no surprise whatsoever, there's a tide of complaints. I dislike Brown as much as the next man, but I can't help feeling the government are in a no-win situation here.
Edited by longblackcoat on Thursday 16th July 11:16
Enhanced CRB Checks are free for volunteers, but there is no need for the volunteers to have them if they are not going to have unsupervised access to children.
In the case of the railway I would imagine parents will accompany children, the only possible issue that could arise from something like this is a volunteer befriends a child and then stalks them.
That scenario could occur even with CRB checked staff because Not having been caught does not mean that the person would never do something and because of that a CRB check is pretty useless.
In the case of the railway I would imagine parents will accompany children, the only possible issue that could arise from something like this is a volunteer befriends a child and then stalks them.
That scenario could occur even with CRB checked staff because Not having been caught does not mean that the person would never do something and because of that a CRB check is pretty useless.
Chris_w666 said:
Not having been caught does not mean that the person would never do something and because of that a CRB check is pretty useless.
I disagree; sure, it wouldn't stop the first-time offender, nor one who had been clever enough to get caught, but at the same time it does mean that those who've been caught previously would find it a lot harder to continue. Certainly doesn't guarantee complete safety, of course, but it at least cuts out some of the risk.
longblackcoat said:
Chris_w666 said:
Not having been caught does not mean that the person would never do something and because of that a CRB check is pretty useless.
I disagree; sure, it wouldn't stop the first-time offender, nor one who had been clever enough to get caught, but at the same time it does mean that those who've been caught previously would find it a lot harder to continue. Certainly doesn't guarantee complete safety, of course, but it at least cuts out some of the risk.
Chris_w666 said:
longblackcoat said:
Chris_w666 said:
Not having been caught does not mean that the person would never do something and because of that a CRB check is pretty useless.
I disagree; sure, it wouldn't stop the first-time offender, nor one who had been clever enough to get caught, but at the same time it does mean that those who've been caught previously would find it a lot harder to continue. Certainly doesn't guarantee complete safety, of course, but it at least cuts out some of the risk.
Unsurprisingly, some of the parents ended up being uttely useless at managing the kids, and really shouldn't have been used as volunteers. Trustworthy and honest, I'm certain, but as much use as a week-old doughnut.
Wacky Racer said:
Look, authors visit schools as part of a wider commercial agenda. Teachers may well have been teaching for 20 years but they have to be checked and passed. And when they visit my kids' schools, they normally charge for the privilege, then sell books as part of their visit.Not that impressed with their 'outrage'.
Lord Croker said:
I can't see where there could be a risk here. Shirley the parents of kids who ride on the train will go with them?
Ah Ha,have they all been CRB checked....? I would presume not...SO the guy in the back office has to have a check even though he's miles away from the kids,yet the person on the next seat to the kids can get on without....I know I'm taking things to extremes here but the whole thing has gone beyond a joke...longblackcoat said:
Wacky Racer said:
Look, authors visit schools as part of a wider commercial agenda. Teachers may well have been teaching for 20 years but they have to be checked and passed. And when they visit my kids' schools, they normally charge for the privilege, then sell books as part of their visit.Not that impressed with their 'outrage'.
I went through the whole Child Protection and Sex Offenders Act thing as the secretary of a miniature railway, operating under the umbrella of a museum.
Our club belonged to a Federation of over 360 miniature railway clubs and as such, this Federation had a written Child Protection Code, part funded and written by the NSPCC and a Government dept, which said that non-disclosed (ie non-CRB) members were not allowed to touch a child under ANY circumstances. If a child wanted to ride but couldn't get climb aboard on his own and had no parent or guardian to assist him/her onto the train, the child didn't ride...period.
The ONLY time our people were allowed to touch a child was in the case of 'immediate danger' and then only by the hand. There was even a policy for junior club members...ie if you REALLY HAD to spend time on your own with one alone (private chat or something) you had to tell someone else so they could check in on you both frequently.
Basically the Museum were having some CRB checks for customer facing people as they had to assist disabled kiddies gain access to some museum items and they asked what we were doing about CRB checks. As it happened, a couple of members that worked in education already had CRB checks and I offered this as a token gesture as our rules made no provision for those that are checked. The non-disclosed rules stuck under all circumstances.
The official line is that ONLY those that have ANY chance of coming into direct contact with children need to have CRB checks. If they take the line of our policy ie you dont touch at any time except in case of immediate danger then you don't need a CRB check.
The Thomas the Tank Engine copyright owners have always been greedy buggers and any chance they have to screw you out of money they take it (believe me I know) I personally feel that all they are going to do is eventually alienate themselves from the steam comminity and rely on selling videos, DVDs and books.
As an aside, the club I was in allowed a pedo to rejoin after he had done his 5 years on the sex offenders list. I was outvoted, he rejoined and I resigned immediately. My flesh crept whenever I was within 50 yards of the...guy...
Problem was, he had told the story so that it looked as though he was entrapped by the kids and the legal system. As the secretary of that club, I had to know the full story and was not allowed to tell anyone (Data Protection Act etc)
The club chairman even lied to the Bus museum about why this guy was rejoining after 5 yrs, saying quite correctly he had been living away on the coast and certainly NOTHING about why he had to go away and now why all of a sudden he was allowed back....
I have always said I would happily do time if anyone touched my grandkids...
OT a bit (especially the last bit) but I thought I would help define what was allowed and not allowed by non-CRB people, throw some clarity in and let you all make your own minds up.
Mogs
Our club belonged to a Federation of over 360 miniature railway clubs and as such, this Federation had a written Child Protection Code, part funded and written by the NSPCC and a Government dept, which said that non-disclosed (ie non-CRB) members were not allowed to touch a child under ANY circumstances. If a child wanted to ride but couldn't get climb aboard on his own and had no parent or guardian to assist him/her onto the train, the child didn't ride...period.
The ONLY time our people were allowed to touch a child was in the case of 'immediate danger' and then only by the hand. There was even a policy for junior club members...ie if you REALLY HAD to spend time on your own with one alone (private chat or something) you had to tell someone else so they could check in on you both frequently.
Basically the Museum were having some CRB checks for customer facing people as they had to assist disabled kiddies gain access to some museum items and they asked what we were doing about CRB checks. As it happened, a couple of members that worked in education already had CRB checks and I offered this as a token gesture as our rules made no provision for those that are checked. The non-disclosed rules stuck under all circumstances.
The official line is that ONLY those that have ANY chance of coming into direct contact with children need to have CRB checks. If they take the line of our policy ie you dont touch at any time except in case of immediate danger then you don't need a CRB check.
The Thomas the Tank Engine copyright owners have always been greedy buggers and any chance they have to screw you out of money they take it (believe me I know) I personally feel that all they are going to do is eventually alienate themselves from the steam comminity and rely on selling videos, DVDs and books.
As an aside, the club I was in allowed a pedo to rejoin after he had done his 5 years on the sex offenders list. I was outvoted, he rejoined and I resigned immediately. My flesh crept whenever I was within 50 yards of the...guy...
Problem was, he had told the story so that it looked as though he was entrapped by the kids and the legal system. As the secretary of that club, I had to know the full story and was not allowed to tell anyone (Data Protection Act etc)
The club chairman even lied to the Bus museum about why this guy was rejoining after 5 yrs, saying quite correctly he had been living away on the coast and certainly NOTHING about why he had to go away and now why all of a sudden he was allowed back....
I have always said I would happily do time if anyone touched my grandkids...
OT a bit (especially the last bit) but I thought I would help define what was allowed and not allowed by non-CRB people, throw some clarity in and let you all make your own minds up.
Mogs
MoggyMuncha said:
cw2k said:
The article mentions volunteers having to pay for CRB checks but aren't CRB checks still free for volunteers ?
Most certainly not. If who thay are working for doesn't want to pay they YOU have to pay Mogs
MoggyMuncha said:
As an aside, the club I was in allowed a pedo to rejoin after he had done his 5 years on the sex offenders list. I was outvoted, he rejoined and I resigned immediately. My flesh crept whenever I was within 50 yards of the...guy...
Problem was, he had told the story so that it looked as though he was entrapped by the kids and the legal system. As the secretary of that club, I had to know the full story and was not allowed to tell anyone (Data Protection Act etc)
The club chairman even lied to the Bus museum about why this guy was rejoining after 5 yrs, saying quite correctly he had been living away on the coast and certainly NOTHING about why he had to go away and now why all of a sudden he was allowed back....
I have always said I would happily do time if anyone touched my grandkids...
OT a bit (especially the last bit) but I thought I would help define what was allowed and not allowed by non-CRB people, throw some clarity in and let you all make your own minds up.
Mogs
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