Just did Downhill for first time - wow!
Discussion
Yesterday was the first time in about 20yrs of riding that I went to a DH specific location and went down some Downhill runs. All I can say is wow.....
I'd mainly done singletrack with the occasional fast descent, but the place I went to was a DH specific mountain set up very similar to a ski resort with Green runs, blue runs and then Reds and Blacks (or Double Diamonds as they call them over here). The place was called Diablo - here is a linky - http://diablofreeridepark.com/
I took my 06 Kona Dawg thinking that it was more than up to the task. However, I soon realised that neither the bike, nor I, were ready for what this place threw at me. After one run down I quickly changed my SPD's to flats and also went and hired a full face helmet and some knee & elbow pads as I had only got my normal helmet and no protection.
A few hours and a few spills later I called it a day as my hands, wrists and hips were in agony.
The only disappointment was that the bike was out of its depth. The brakes suffered massive fade (I was using the front too much at first but following a tip from a friendly rider, I left it alone for most of the runs) and the suspension was bottoming out all the time. Also, another huge pain was the chain flying off 3-4 times per run.
Luckily they rent out 8" travel JAMIS bikes for $99 a day (inc helmet and pads).
However, if this is something that I want to do more regularly, do people think that there are things I can do to the Dawg to make it better suited? I'm thinking Chain guide and bigger discs for starters, but do I really need 8" of travel or am I being sucked into needing another bike (already have 3.5!)
Anyway, sorry to ramble on, just wanted to pass on my adventure this weekend - I think the last of the adrenaline buzz has just about worn off!
I'd mainly done singletrack with the occasional fast descent, but the place I went to was a DH specific mountain set up very similar to a ski resort with Green runs, blue runs and then Reds and Blacks (or Double Diamonds as they call them over here). The place was called Diablo - here is a linky - http://diablofreeridepark.com/
I took my 06 Kona Dawg thinking that it was more than up to the task. However, I soon realised that neither the bike, nor I, were ready for what this place threw at me. After one run down I quickly changed my SPD's to flats and also went and hired a full face helmet and some knee & elbow pads as I had only got my normal helmet and no protection.
A few hours and a few spills later I called it a day as my hands, wrists and hips were in agony.
The only disappointment was that the bike was out of its depth. The brakes suffered massive fade (I was using the front too much at first but following a tip from a friendly rider, I left it alone for most of the runs) and the suspension was bottoming out all the time. Also, another huge pain was the chain flying off 3-4 times per run.
Luckily they rent out 8" travel JAMIS bikes for $99 a day (inc helmet and pads).
However, if this is something that I want to do more regularly, do people think that there are things I can do to the Dawg to make it better suited? I'm thinking Chain guide and bigger discs for starters, but do I really need 8" of travel or am I being sucked into needing another bike (already have 3.5!)
Anyway, sorry to ramble on, just wanted to pass on my adventure this weekend - I think the last of the adrenaline buzz has just about worn off!
Edited to add: If you're living in the Alps etc, and just doing DHy stuff, then yes, consider a new more suited bike. If not, then its up to you.
You need in this order:
Decent helmet and pads
Big brakes with sintered pads (180mm min)
6 inch plus suspension with 20mm forks up front ideally (you don't need triples tbh)
Chain guide (to stop the chain falling off)
Dual Ply tyres (thicker, so stop punctures)
Some Manup juice
With that, you can take on most stuff
You need in this order:
Decent helmet and pads
Big brakes with sintered pads (180mm min)
6 inch plus suspension with 20mm forks up front ideally (you don't need triples tbh)
Chain guide (to stop the chain falling off)
Dual Ply tyres (thicker, so stop punctures)
Some Manup juice
With that, you can take on most stuff
To help the OP, I was DHing on my Giant Reign (not a DH bike but more trail orientated). It's always going to be a compromise compared to a proper DH bike, but hopefully it shows what sort of thing can survive - and be fun and capable on - a full-on DH track:
- 160mm front and 152mm rear travel
- flat pedals
- 203/160mm front/rear rotors with standard pads
- Single ply DH-orientated tyres (High Roller single ply's)
- full-face helmet, knee/shin and elbow/forearm guards
The bike mostly coped OK (shame about the rider!). I'd rather have more travel, but don't do DH often enough to warrant it - I use that bike for other purposes too as it only weighs in around 34lbs. That's for the OP to decide if he can warrant a bigger bike more for the purpose.
On my wish list now are:
- sintered pads!
- bigger rear rotor plus caliper adaptor
- DH inner tubes
- a spine protector (possibly the Brand X jacket on CRC)
Just interested to here where I can get this Manup juice though
- 160mm front and 152mm rear travel
- flat pedals
- 203/160mm front/rear rotors with standard pads
- Single ply DH-orientated tyres (High Roller single ply's)
- full-face helmet, knee/shin and elbow/forearm guards
The bike mostly coped OK (shame about the rider!). I'd rather have more travel, but don't do DH often enough to warrant it - I use that bike for other purposes too as it only weighs in around 34lbs. That's for the OP to decide if he can warrant a bigger bike more for the purpose.
On my wish list now are:
- sintered pads!
- bigger rear rotor plus caliper adaptor
- DH inner tubes
- a spine protector (possibly the Brand X jacket on CRC)
Just interested to here where I can get this Manup juice though
a11y_m said:
To help the OP, I was DHing on my Giant Reign (not a DH bike but more trail orientated). It's always going to be a compromise compared to a proper DH bike, but hopefully it shows what sort of thing can survive - and be fun and capable on - a full-on DH track:
- 160mm front and 152mm rear travel
- flat pedals
- 203/160mm front/rear rotors with standard pads
- Single ply DH-orientated tyres (High Roller single ply's)
- full-face helmet, knee/shin and elbow/forearm guards
The bike mostly coped OK (shame about the rider!). I'd rather have more travel, but don't do DH often enough to warrant it - I use that bike for other purposes too as it only weighs in around 34lbs. That's for the OP to decide if he can warrant a bigger bike more for the purpose.
On my wish list now are:
- sintered pads!
- bigger rear rotor plus caliper adaptor
- DH inner tubes
- a spine protector (possibly the Brand X jacket on CRC)
Just interested to here where I can get this Manup juice though
You're completely right, you can DH on bikes not really suited for the terrain; just look at the bikes used in the Mega for instance.- 160mm front and 152mm rear travel
- flat pedals
- 203/160mm front/rear rotors with standard pads
- Single ply DH-orientated tyres (High Roller single ply's)
- full-face helmet, knee/shin and elbow/forearm guards
The bike mostly coped OK (shame about the rider!). I'd rather have more travel, but don't do DH often enough to warrant it - I use that bike for other purposes too as it only weighs in around 34lbs. That's for the OP to decide if he can warrant a bigger bike more for the purpose.
On my wish list now are:
- sintered pads!
- bigger rear rotor plus caliper adaptor
- DH inner tubes
- a spine protector (possibly the Brand X jacket on CRC)
Just interested to here where I can get this Manup juice though
However, if you look at the trail of devastation left behind by the Mega, you'll quickly realise that any regularity of DH riding will put a heavy toll on your pride and joy. Even DH bikes suffer!
Its worth prioritising what riding you'll do most, and base your bike on that. Or buy two
theboymoon said:
as someone who recently popped his DH race cherry, i can categorically say that the rush of the first time out the gate is even more intense again!!!!!
The feeling that you can go as hard & fast as you like without the fear that a dog walker or passer by will step out in front & give you a rollocking for 'going to fast', the feeling that if you push to hard & come a cropper there is medical staff to help you, the feeling of being at one with the bike & hill....
Its been ages since I had a good DH blat.
Thanks for all the advice guys - really helpfull stuff.
Looking at the spec of my bike it seems that if I start heading up to Diablo regularly, it just won't cope. It has 5" travel at the rear, 120mm travel at the front. The discs are only 160mm and there is no chain guide.
Looking at the cost of upgrading those parts alone will almost warrant geating a new bike, especially as even with new parts, the rest of the ride is still pretty much comprimised.
I guess I could sell the current bike to facilitate the purchase of something new, and I have other rides to fulfill the xc/single track needs (a new retro-modded Kona Hot for starters!).
Hmmm - decisions, decisions.
I think next step will be to head back up to the park and rent one of their 8" travel full DH bikes and see if it makes the difference I am expecting it to!
Looking at the spec of my bike it seems that if I start heading up to Diablo regularly, it just won't cope. It has 5" travel at the rear, 120mm travel at the front. The discs are only 160mm and there is no chain guide.
Looking at the cost of upgrading those parts alone will almost warrant geating a new bike, especially as even with new parts, the rest of the ride is still pretty much comprimised.
I guess I could sell the current bike to facilitate the purchase of something new, and I have other rides to fulfill the xc/single track needs (a new retro-modded Kona Hot for starters!).
Hmmm - decisions, decisions.
I think next step will be to head back up to the park and rent one of their 8" travel full DH bikes and see if it makes the difference I am expecting it to!
neil_bolton said:
You're completely right, you can DH on bikes not really suited for the terrain; just look at the bikes used in the Mega for instance.
However, if you look at the trail of devastation left behind by the Mega, you'll quickly realise that any regularity of DH riding will put a heavy toll on your pride and joy. Even DH bikes suffer!
Its worth prioritising what riding you'll do most, and base your bike on that. Or buy two
You have to remember that the Mega (was my first time this year However, if you look at the trail of devastation left behind by the Mega, you'll quickly realise that any regularity of DH riding will put a heavy toll on your pride and joy. Even DH bikes suffer!
Its worth prioritising what riding you'll do most, and base your bike on that. Or buy two
) while a lot of fun is far from a DH race hence everyone doing well and indeed most people there are not on DH bikes.DH is a funny one. Of course you can ride any bike down a hill, afterall half (not by time) of an XC ride is downhill. However, if you start taking it seriously anything but a specific DH bike will hinder you quite a lot.
For your needs right now I would invest in a set of downhill tyres. Maxxis highrollers are probably the best all round tyre you can get, though it its dry the majority of the time Minnion DHF's will wear better (they will clog up in thick mud). Only use these when you are riding DH as they will ruin your enjoyment of a trail ride and will wear very fast as well.
Next get yourself a full face helmet and some goggles. Very important to have a helmet that fits well, the goggles are not so important but they don't cost that much and in my experience make a big difference.
Now go and ride whatever you want and replace bits as you break them. This will probably start with rims, if you go for something like a Mavic 721 then you get a fairly good trade off between weight and strength and width so you could still go trail riding with them. Soon enough you will have been bitten by the DH bug and will be ably to justify buying something second hand. Since you are in the states ridemonkey.com has a good American baised forum with a decent classified section.
theboymoon said:
as someone who recently popped his DH race cherry, i can categorically say that the rush of the first time out the gate is even more intense again!!!!!
Was the Mega your first race or have you raced some UK downhill?Also OP. I have no idea where Diablo is in the US but look at the deals that can be found if you look hard enough]
http://www.ridemonkey.com/classifieds/cat-2/ad-973...
I would still a 06-09 Rockshox Boxxer Team on there (could be had for about $400, the shiver could be sold for $200 possibly). It would be a bit heavy but for the price you will striggle to get something better I think. Obviously it depends what size you are.
Floor Tom said:
theboymoon said:
as someone who recently popped his DH race cherry, i can categorically say that the rush of the first time out the gate is even more intense again!!!!!
Was the Mega your first race or have you raced some UK downhill?I've entered a few less serious events in the Alps - Morzine, Chamonix, La Clusaz (used to live in Chamonix) and some XC stuff in the UK which is all good but a very different experience to 5 minutes of brain-out going for it!
to the OP - 2 bikes is the way to go. Trying to get one bike that fits all just doesnt work. I have an old 05 enduro which was only just 'big' enough for mega and is really too big for longer UK XC rides even with some tyre trickery. After the Oz race i keep trying to find money for a 224 or a sunday etc etc
theboymoon said:
The sprint race in Oz was my first 'proper' DH race. I wouldn't count the mega as a DH event, more enduro.
Cool. Do you stay in the UK now or are you still out there now? The UK has a thriving DH race scene, the only downside of that is it can be very hard to get into the races. If you are back here in the UK and fancy racing a bit more I'd be more than willing to give advice Floor Tom said:
theboymoon said:
The sprint race in Oz was my first 'proper' DH race. I wouldn't count the mega as a DH event, more enduro.
Cool. Do you stay in the UK now or are you still out there now? The UK has a thriving DH race scene, the only downside of that is it can be very hard to get into the races. If you are back here in the UK and fancy racing a bit more I'd be more than willing to give advice Put this way, if work threw some cash my way at the moment i'd be buying a van and a rig and joining in a bit more!!!
theboymoon said:
Floor Tom said:
theboymoon said:
The sprint race in Oz was my first 'proper' DH race. I wouldn't count the mega as a DH event, more enduro.
Cool. Do you stay in the UK now or are you still out there now? The UK has a thriving DH race scene, the only downside of that is it can be very hard to get into the races. If you are back here in the UK and fancy racing a bit more I'd be more than willing to give advice Put this way, if work threw some cash my way at the moment i'd be buying a van and a rig and joining in a bit more!!!
The more popular events do sell out pretty much instantly but it is possible to get in if you know when to phone up/get your entry in.
As for a bike I find the best UK website for preowned stuff is southerndownhill.com forums, you can thank me later after you have blown 2 grand on a dh bike
Floor Tom said:
theboymoon said:
The sprint race in Oz was my first 'proper' DH race. I wouldn't count the mega as a DH event, more enduro.
Cool. Do you stay in the UK now or are you still out there now? The UK has a thriving DH race scene, the only downside of that is it can be very hard to get into the races. If you are back here in the UK and fancy racing a bit more I'd be more than willing to give advice You'll spunk as much money (race entries, fuel, food, bits etc) on a race weekend as you would getting down to the Alps and back.
Smaller, cheaper, and more localised DH races are the way forward. I've raced lots of DH in my years gone by, inclusing National Champs etc, and I'm always struck by how disorganised the bigger events are.
The smaller, friendlier ones are the way forward.
Or just race yer mates.
I'll be dragging Moonie away to the Churchill series when they announce the dates; it should be a hoot - they were when I competed in them before.
As for the Mega;
Sprint Oz Avalanche Cup = DH
Megavalanche Qualifier = Gnarly Enduro
Megavalanche itself (for those who did it) = slightly less gnarly, but pointy and potentially damaging all the same.
Two bikes is the way forward, that or buy something like a Giant Anthem, Lapierre Spicy or Meta 5.5 and make it burly enough to do cope with proper pointy stuff.
Oh and Spoldge, get yer arse out with me, I'll get you riding again
Edited by neil_bolton on Tuesday 28th July 16:49
Floor Tom said:
theboymoon said:
as someone who recently popped his DH race cherry, i can categorically say that the rush of the first time out the gate is even more intense again!!!!!
Was the Mega your first race or have you raced some UK downhill?Also OP. I have no idea where Diablo is in the US but look at the deals that can be found if you look hard enough]
http://www.ridemonkey.com/classifieds/cat-2/ad-973...
I would still a 06-09 Rockshox Boxxer Team on there (could be had for about $400, the shiver could be sold for $200 possibly). It would be a bit heavy but for the price you will striggle to get something better I think. Obviously it depends what size you are.
Diablo is based in New Jersey and I am based in NYC so the bike is fairly close by.
All this advice is great, again I really appreciate it.
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