Studio Flash Suggestions II
Poll: Studio Flash Suggestions II
Total Members Polled: 9
Discussion
Which would you recommend?
One respondent suggested a vote to go with my thread about studio flash: I've been Googling for a studio flash kit; 3 heads, soft box or two, preferably a long soft box and i'm stuck for choice. I already have 4 stands, 2 white translucent brollies and one silver one. I guess I can find up to £500. I have a room in the house 3m x 4.25m and Black/white colorama paper and want to shoot portraits / fashion. Up to now I've used 2 SB600's but I want to be more creative.
I seem to be drawn to Interfit and Bowens; what's the PH advice? And where should I get it from?
Replies here please http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... Flash Suggestions
One respondent suggested a vote to go with my thread about studio flash: I've been Googling for a studio flash kit; 3 heads, soft box or two, preferably a long soft box and i'm stuck for choice. I already have 4 stands, 2 white translucent brollies and one silver one. I guess I can find up to £500. I have a room in the house 3m x 4.25m and Black/white colorama paper and want to shoot portraits / fashion. Up to now I've used 2 SB600's but I want to be more creative.
I seem to be drawn to Interfit and Bowens; what's the PH advice? And where should I get it from?
Replies here please http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a... Flash Suggestions
all will do the job, I have Interfit and find it excellent considering the price. I always buy my camera gear from warehouseexpress but for studio kit I use www.karlu.com. You'll need a trigger too, you can use wire but seriously would not recommend wire as it always breaks or gets wonky. A cheap IR trigger such as this is what you want -> http://www.warehouseexpress.com/buy-interfit-int41...
OK, thanks - Interfit Stella(!) seems to be the best vfm and takes standard attachments. Next decision is power. The 150W lights have a guide number of 39 and my SB600's are 30. Firing the flashes through brollies, 1 at full power and the other at 1/8 the camera is at f8 at 200 ASA. If I want full length illumination through a rectangular soft box, say 100x60, would 150W be enough?
ian in lancs said:
OK, thanks - Interfit Stella(!) seems to be the best vfm and takes standard attachments. Next decision is power. The 150W lights have a guide number of 39 and my SB600's are 30. Firing the flashes through brollies, 1 at full power and the other at 1/8 the camera is at f8 at 200 ASA. If I want full length illumination through a rectangular soft box, say 100x60, would 150W be enough?
It depends on the aperture. Shutter speed is largely immaterial as you can't go faster than the synch speed (typically 1/250th) and going slower won't make much difference assuming the rest of the room is relatively dark. Hence you have aperture and flash power to control the exposure.IMHO the trick is to choose the aperture you want/need for appropriate DOF, and then adjust the power to get the correct exposure - that's why controllability is as important as brute force. Going back to your question, 150W is puny when medium/large softboxes are used - you could increase ISO but for the sake of a few quid I'd go for more clout. Softbox area and distance soak up power - inverse square law and all that. 1x400W and 1x100W is a good combination for me - but as they say, 'your mileage may vary!'
Simpo Two is correct that you can't go faster than your cameras sync speed.
However, most of the Elinchrome range have exceptionally fast flash durations and you would be surprised at what movement you will stop if used correctly.
I have to say that I have never seen Interfit Stella system and if you only want to do a few portraits, I guess for the money it might work for you. But I have never seen a pro use them and I guess that you get what you pay for. If you are moving to the realms of earning a living from them, IE hoping to turn pro at some point I would suggest that you get something from a range. It will be worth it in the end.
I Would also advise that you don't get anything under 2x 400W and you would need to have at least a 4x stop control minimum. Otherwise you will not be able to achieve the lighting affects you require. (If you were to shoot a group of people you might need an aperture of say f11. You may need to be using both light at say full power and having 2x lights, of different powers won't work very well especially if 1x light is only 150W. or if you want to use a box softbox close up for a large soft bank of light you might not be able to down the power enough to give you a shallow depth of field)
Control over the lighting power is all important in photography, you wouldn't upgrade your camera to a pro model with a fixed aperture would you. So don't limit yourself. OK I am sure that someone will say just pull you lighting unit further away from the subject. This will change the whole way the light falls on the subject.This can make or break your picture.
As a pro working in the Editor Photography field, I use ether a 3x 600w Elinchrome head kit or on location without power I run an Elinchrome Rangers system.
Another thing to consider is the units recycling time, I have seem some rather wild claims from the cheaper end producers. Recycling times are very important, because sometimes you take a picture an and as a result, a reaction often happens that creates a winning moment, there is no point in missing the real picture you want because you are waiting for the unit to recharge. You really do get what you pay for. If you think that you hobby could lead to something else I would really consider getting the right gear from the start. You will only buy it later on when you realise what you are missing and the limitations of the cheaper end equipment.
However, most of the Elinchrome range have exceptionally fast flash durations and you would be surprised at what movement you will stop if used correctly.
I have to say that I have never seen Interfit Stella system and if you only want to do a few portraits, I guess for the money it might work for you. But I have never seen a pro use them and I guess that you get what you pay for. If you are moving to the realms of earning a living from them, IE hoping to turn pro at some point I would suggest that you get something from a range. It will be worth it in the end.
I Would also advise that you don't get anything under 2x 400W and you would need to have at least a 4x stop control minimum. Otherwise you will not be able to achieve the lighting affects you require. (If you were to shoot a group of people you might need an aperture of say f11. You may need to be using both light at say full power and having 2x lights, of different powers won't work very well especially if 1x light is only 150W. or if you want to use a box softbox close up for a large soft bank of light you might not be able to down the power enough to give you a shallow depth of field)
Control over the lighting power is all important in photography, you wouldn't upgrade your camera to a pro model with a fixed aperture would you. So don't limit yourself. OK I am sure that someone will say just pull you lighting unit further away from the subject. This will change the whole way the light falls on the subject.This can make or break your picture.
As a pro working in the Editor Photography field, I use ether a 3x 600w Elinchrome head kit or on location without power I run an Elinchrome Rangers system.
Another thing to consider is the units recycling time, I have seem some rather wild claims from the cheaper end producers. Recycling times are very important, because sometimes you take a picture an and as a result, a reaction often happens that creates a winning moment, there is no point in missing the real picture you want because you are waiting for the unit to recharge. You really do get what you pay for. If you think that you hobby could lead to something else I would really consider getting the right gear from the start. You will only buy it later on when you realise what you are missing and the limitations of the cheaper end equipment.
Snapper7 said:
Simpo Two is correct that you can't go faster than your cameras sync speed. However, most of the Elinchrome range have exceptionally fast flash durations and you would be surprised at what movement you will stop if used correctly.
Oh indeed, I was talking about the synch/shutter speed in respect to altering exposure rather than freezing motion.Jumping from tiddly and over-complex Speedlights to manual studio flash may seem intimidating but once you adapt to dealing with the basics and thinking things through, it's very satisfying. In fact I was pondering it last night: in 'normal' photography the lighting is fixed so you balance shutter speed and aperture. In a studio, shutter speed is effectively fixed so you balance aperture and light (that's over-simplified but it's my basic take on it) and that's why controllability of light power is important. Full power and half power simply isn't enough IMHO.
good posts there by snapper and the answer to why you never see pros using stella's, they get someone else to pay for their bowens 
They are very good kit, the only way I can give an idea about vfm is its like the Monaro. Cheap but punches way about its weight in performance and still has an adequate quality
eta the recycling times quoted for the itnerfit match with experience if not more so. I use them so I am an evangalist for them, I shoot canon so when people ask thats my prefernce too so this should be taken into account with my feedback
They are very good kit, the only way I can give an idea about vfm is its like the Monaro. Cheap but punches way about its weight in performance and still has an adequate quality
eta the recycling times quoted for the itnerfit match with experience if not more so. I use them so I am an evangalist for them, I shoot canon so when people ask thats my prefernce too so this should be taken into account with my feedback
Edited by stigmundfreud on Monday 14th September 17:01
Sadly we don't get others to pay for our kit. We buy it and try and earn the money back to pay for it. Maybe once you have had some practice with the kit you could do some portraits to get the kit to pay for its self.
But it helps when good kit seem to last a lifetime. I recently sold a 3x Elinchrome 500 Classic heads kit for £ 200 each that were over 100 years old (They cost £ 365 new when sold) So that was good going IMHO.
But if your budget won't stretch to an Elinchrome kit then you have to buy what you can afford. But before you set your budget you do need to work out what you want to achive and if the kit you are buying will really do the job you want.
Personally I think that the Canon 1Ds Mk111 is way to expensive by a good couple of grand, But I had to purchase it because it does what I needed it to do.
But it helps when good kit seem to last a lifetime. I recently sold a 3x Elinchrome 500 Classic heads kit for £ 200 each that were over 100 years old (They cost £ 365 new when sold) So that was good going IMHO.
But if your budget won't stretch to an Elinchrome kit then you have to buy what you can afford. But before you set your budget you do need to work out what you want to achive and if the kit you are buying will really do the job you want.
Personally I think that the Canon 1Ds Mk111 is way to expensive by a good couple of grand, But I had to purchase it because it does what I needed it to do.
snapper I think you are missing my point in that I agree what you are saying about the bowens and the elichrom but you seem to be overlooking/dismissing interfit based on the fact you dont see others using them. Having used Bowens when it came to my own purchase i chose Interfit simply based on quality for price. 4 years on and they show no signs of aging, are a 3rd of the price of bowens and extremely well built and perform. Compare that to the bowens I used which would blow fuses left right and centre
I think all 3 on this list will do much more than the OP wants but when you see his budget is 500 you simply cannot get anywhere near that with "new" bowens or elichroms.
I think all 3 on this list will do much more than the OP wants but when you see his budget is 500 you simply cannot get anywhere near that with "new" bowens or elichroms.
I have to say that I have never seen any of the Interfit lighting equipment, so I could not comment on their build quality, durability and as I have never seen them in any reputable Photographic equipment store I am not able to have a play with a set to even voice an opinion on them. But I would question if they would have the durability and build quality of the Elinchroms.
But I would agree that with £ 500 OP is going to struggle and might need to give some extra thought to the issue. Which has been the point of most of my advice. That is why I suggest trying to get the equipment to earn its money back.
Just looking on the web, and the only shop I recognise is Jacobs and they don't seem to hold any stock, so I guess that you cant see then in store. A 2x 600watts Unbrella Kit is £ 799.99 (in other Words £ 800). or. An 2x 600watts Softbox Kit is £ 879.99 (in other Words Almost £ 900). However, Looking at the shape of the interfit softboxes I would replace them anyway because they look very directional.
Or
The Flash Centres Elinchrom 2x BX400 comes in at £ 799.00 Inc Vat (Saving £ 410 from RRP), You also get an IR Triger as well and For £ 30 you can add a 66cm SoftBox.
See Links: http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bx400-2009...
or
Elinchrom 2x BXRi 500watts Kit for £ 949.00 Inc VAT you also get the Elinchrom Skyport transmitter system included
See Link: http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bxri-50050...
They are also in stock so you can go and have a good look over the range and have a good play about with them. The Flash Centre will also give you a full demo on their use. That might not sound like much, but if you are new to studio lighting it could be a good head start.
The Flash Centre often has some ex-demo stock from when they do shows. Worth asking.
A good write up from the British journal of Photography on the BXRi. Here http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bxri-50050...
So it is not that much more money to go for a very highly regarded brand name from a company with great back up. The Flash Centre also has rental units in store should you ever have an issue and need extra or a replacement should you ever need a repair. Although I have often had free loan in such situations which is why I don't always buy on just price.
But at the end of the day it really comes down to the person buy them. But I would certainly want to try before buying. I can only offer my advice as a pro at the sharp end.
I forgot to mention you will also need a light meter. I use Sekonic and they have always been good value. There website is: http://www.sekonic.com/main/
They have some tutorials and advice pages which would be well worth looking over.
If you want a very cheap budget light meter the cheapest one in the range is the Sekonic L-308s - See Link: http://www.sekonic.com/products/Sekonic%20L-308S%2...
However I have a couple of next one up in the range, The Sekonic L-358. it is far more advanced and also gives you flash to Daylight ratios for when you get into using flash on Location with a mixture of lighting. I have to say that when you get into using a light meter you will really appreciate having a good light meter like the L358 and use it much more than just with studio lighting. See Link: http://www.sekonic.com/products/Sekonic%20L-358%20...
I hope that has been of some help. If you want to look over any of my pictures to see what I get upto with the Elinchromes, my website is here: http://www.jamiejonesphoto.co.uk
Best of luck with your purchase and let us know what you chose in the end.
But I would agree that with £ 500 OP is going to struggle and might need to give some extra thought to the issue. Which has been the point of most of my advice. That is why I suggest trying to get the equipment to earn its money back.
Just looking on the web, and the only shop I recognise is Jacobs and they don't seem to hold any stock, so I guess that you cant see then in store. A 2x 600watts Unbrella Kit is £ 799.99 (in other Words £ 800). or. An 2x 600watts Softbox Kit is £ 879.99 (in other Words Almost £ 900). However, Looking at the shape of the interfit softboxes I would replace them anyway because they look very directional.
Or
The Flash Centres Elinchrom 2x BX400 comes in at £ 799.00 Inc Vat (Saving £ 410 from RRP), You also get an IR Triger as well and For £ 30 you can add a 66cm SoftBox.
See Links: http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bx400-2009...
or
Elinchrom 2x BXRi 500watts Kit for £ 949.00 Inc VAT you also get the Elinchrom Skyport transmitter system included
See Link: http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bxri-50050...
They are also in stock so you can go and have a good look over the range and have a good play about with them. The Flash Centre will also give you a full demo on their use. That might not sound like much, but if you are new to studio lighting it could be a good head start.
The Flash Centre often has some ex-demo stock from when they do shows. Worth asking.
A good write up from the British journal of Photography on the BXRi. Here http://www.theflashcentre.com/elinchrom-bxri-50050...
So it is not that much more money to go for a very highly regarded brand name from a company with great back up. The Flash Centre also has rental units in store should you ever have an issue and need extra or a replacement should you ever need a repair. Although I have often had free loan in such situations which is why I don't always buy on just price.
But at the end of the day it really comes down to the person buy them. But I would certainly want to try before buying. I can only offer my advice as a pro at the sharp end.
I forgot to mention you will also need a light meter. I use Sekonic and they have always been good value. There website is: http://www.sekonic.com/main/
They have some tutorials and advice pages which would be well worth looking over.
If you want a very cheap budget light meter the cheapest one in the range is the Sekonic L-308s - See Link: http://www.sekonic.com/products/Sekonic%20L-308S%2...
However I have a couple of next one up in the range, The Sekonic L-358. it is far more advanced and also gives you flash to Daylight ratios for when you get into using flash on Location with a mixture of lighting. I have to say that when you get into using a light meter you will really appreciate having a good light meter like the L358 and use it much more than just with studio lighting. See Link: http://www.sekonic.com/products/Sekonic%20L-358%20...
I hope that has been of some help. If you want to look over any of my pictures to see what I get upto with the Elinchromes, my website is here: http://www.jamiejonesphoto.co.uk
Best of luck with your purchase and let us know what you chose in the end.
Edited by Snapper7 on Tuesday 15th September 16:17
as it happens for continuous kit the elichroms come in very good pricewise so they are on the shopping list.
Ian, rather than going full flash maybe look at continual. In such a small work area the trade off will enable you ti use a shallower depth of field which you might want. (its cheaper too)
Ian, rather than going full flash maybe look at continual. In such a small work area the trade off will enable you ti use a shallower depth of field which you might want. (its cheaper too)
I Have Bowens esprit and i'm not impressed at all.
yeah they are cheap but they should at least do the job.
I often get heads overheating during shoots, when this happens they refuse to fire 'til they've cooled down.
I've also had to send two heads (of 6) back to bowens for repair out of warranty.
Modeling lamps blow constantly. I go though about 50 per year.
Flash duration seems very long too, nothing like what they tell you.
Next time I'm buying profoto *checks lottery numbers*
yeah they are cheap but they should at least do the job.
I often get heads overheating during shoots, when this happens they refuse to fire 'til they've cooled down.
I've also had to send two heads (of 6) back to bowens for repair out of warranty.
Modeling lamps blow constantly. I go though about 50 per year.
Flash duration seems very long too, nothing like what they tell you.
Next time I'm buying profoto *checks lottery numbers*
Scho said:
I Have Bowens esprit and i'm not impressed at all.
yeah they are cheap but they should at least do the job.
I often get heads overheating during shoots, when this happens they refuse to fire 'til they've cooled down.
I've also had to send two heads (of 6) back to bowens for repair out of warranty.
Modeling lamps blow constantly. I go though about 50 per year.
Flash duration seems very long too, nothing like what they tell you.
Next time I'm buying profoto *checks lottery numbers*
5 years in not a single issue with the interfits yeah they are cheap but they should at least do the job.
I often get heads overheating during shoots, when this happens they refuse to fire 'til they've cooled down.
I've also had to send two heads (of 6) back to bowens for repair out of warranty.
Modeling lamps blow constantly. I go though about 50 per year.
Flash duration seems very long too, nothing like what they tell you.
Next time I'm buying profoto *checks lottery numbers*
stigmundfreud said:
Ian, rather than going full flash maybe look at continual. In such a small work area the trade off will enable you ti use a shallower depth of field which you might want. (its cheaper too)
Oddly enough I've just put a 2-head tungsten set on eBay 
I started with it because I wanted to be able to see what I was getting, but quickly moved up to flash because (1) even 500W tungsten isn't very bright (2) the room gets rather warm!Gassing Station | Photography & Video | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff