Discussion
I am thinking of upgrading the front brakes on my 93 L Chimaera. The car has the early 240mm disc set up and although the brakes seem fine at high speed they just don't have that bite when stoping round town. It may be due to the pad compound (EBC Green Stuff)?
I was thinking of a 280mm disc upgrade with standard callipers but was wondering if anyone had any experience of this upgrade and where to get it from.
Any help appreciated.
I was thinking of a 280mm disc upgrade with standard callipers but was wondering if anyone had any experience of this upgrade and where to get it from.
Any help appreciated.
K11 CHM said:
I am thinking of upgrading the front brakes on my 93 L Chimaera. The car has the early 240mm disc set up and although the brakes seem fine at high speed they just don't have that bite when stoping round town. It may be due to the pad compound (EBC Green Stuff)?
I was thinking of a 280mm disc upgrade with standard callipers but was wondering if anyone had any experience of this upgrade and where to get it from.
Any help appreciated.
If you're after brakes that last longer on the track, the 285mm big brake upgrade is ideal for that car IMO, assuming you have the original 250 non-vented rears. It improves the brake balance and also increases the heat dissipation dramatically. If you're just after more 'bite' in normal driving this is probably not the best way to get it though. You are better off making sure you have fresh fluid, discs in good condition and a good fast road compound pad bedded in properly. Bedding in is crucial. This time of year conditions are cold enough for some of the fast road compounds to need a little heat in them before they really start working. I found that Greenstuff were a bit wooden on frosty days until they'd warmed up a bit but to be honest you'll find the same with many of the pads at the higher end of the 'fast road' temperature range.
I have the 285mm conversion kit from Hi-Spek. It uses the standard calipers with a spacer plate between hub and carrier bracket to bring the caliper out 45mm. It does improve braking over standard.
Before I got the kit I upgraded to grooved Tarox discs. These were much better than standard with less fade and glazing. Braided hoses also showed an improvement to pedal feel. It is also important to bleed the system regularly to get rid of air and introduce cleaner fluid to the calipers.
Pads: I tried Green Stuff pads on an old set up but didn't like them. Ferodo DS2500 and Mintex 1144 are good, as are the Red Dot pads you can get in some Halfords/Ripspeed stores.
On the 285mm kit, the carrier bracket needs to be modified by grinding away metal to suit the larger diameter. I also had to grind away other areas for it to fit and get shorter bolts as the ones supplied fouled the disc. Once fitted the pads do not sit properly on the disc, they overhang slightly. This may be due to the Red Dot pads I have, but they also wear at an angle, indicating the set-up is not true to the disc. This is probably due to the spacer plate not fitting properly or flexing during braking. I am looking into this.
In summary, I would not recommend the 285mm kit but first upgrade to braided hoses, then upgrade to Griff 500 spec large-piston calipers and 260mm grooved discs (there's a kit advertised on PH which seems good value), combined with standard but grooved rear discs.
Dan
Before I got the kit I upgraded to grooved Tarox discs. These were much better than standard with less fade and glazing. Braided hoses also showed an improvement to pedal feel. It is also important to bleed the system regularly to get rid of air and introduce cleaner fluid to the calipers.
Pads: I tried Green Stuff pads on an old set up but didn't like them. Ferodo DS2500 and Mintex 1144 are good, as are the Red Dot pads you can get in some Halfords/Ripspeed stores.
On the 285mm kit, the carrier bracket needs to be modified by grinding away metal to suit the larger diameter. I also had to grind away other areas for it to fit and get shorter bolts as the ones supplied fouled the disc. Once fitted the pads do not sit properly on the disc, they overhang slightly. This may be due to the Red Dot pads I have, but they also wear at an angle, indicating the set-up is not true to the disc. This is probably due to the spacer plate not fitting properly or flexing during braking. I am looking into this.
In summary, I would not recommend the 285mm kit but first upgrade to braided hoses, then upgrade to Griff 500 spec large-piston calipers and 260mm grooved discs (there's a kit advertised on PH which seems good value), combined with standard but grooved rear discs.
Dan
I had the 285mm upgrade at Tower-View-Services, north London. That included the larger front disks, caliper adapters to convert the calipers to the larger version, pads, hoses and a dot 5.1 fluid, fitted for around £650.
I can't praise the set-up enough. Great stopping power and zero fade on the last track day I did. No loss in braking performance after the track day too. It's not a cheap upgrade, but a worthwhile one. Plus the insurance company were more than happy about it and my premium didn't budge.
Definitely recommend it.
Rob
I can't praise the set-up enough. Great stopping power and zero fade on the last track day I did. No loss in braking performance after the track day too. It's not a cheap upgrade, but a worthwhile one. Plus the insurance company were more than happy about it and my premium didn't budge.
Definitely recommend it.
Rob
Dan M said:
they also wear at an angle, indicating the set-up is not true to the disc. This is probably due to the spacer plate not fitting properly or flexing during braking. I am looking into this.
One disadvantage of the standard single-pot floating calipers is that they have a relatively weak bridge and flex significantly under very heavy braking, allowing the caliper to open up and causing this tapered pad wear (pad outer edge wears more than inner edge).
Don't like the sound of those other problems though, you shouldn't have had to grind metal away and if the adapter plate was the correct one the pad should be properly positioned relative to the disc. If you have this conversion, Tower View can supply deeper pads which extend further towards the center of the disc, which gives you more advantage from the extra disc area.
I have a 285mm upgrade kit. Comes with adapters from HiSpec. No fade on the track for my level of driving skill (average). Brake balance now much better, plus the car now has braking commensurate with it's performance.
http://trefor_jones1.users.btopenworld.com/BrakeUpgrade.html
http://trefor_jones1.users.btopenworld.com/BrakeUpgrade.html
i run the V8s (same brakes as you) with just the griff 500 front brakes on as an upgrade .. much better and dirt cheap too. i use the S *fairly hard* at track days and not had any trouble with fade at all .. I sometimes wonder how big you really need to go on most std engined / std suspension TVRs .
joospeed said:
i run the V8s (same brakes as you) with just the griff 500 front brakes on as an upgrade .. much better and dirt cheap too. i use the S *fairly hard* at track days and not had any trouble with fade at all .. I sometimes wonder how big you really need to go on most std engined / std suspension TVRs .
Car isn't standard, has a chip by Mark Adam's and a Tornado cam....
Dan M said:
I have the 285mm conversion kit from Hi-Spek. It uses the standard calipers with a spacer plate between hub and carrier bracket to bring the caliper out 45mm. It does improve braking over standard.
<snip>
Pads: I tried Green Stuff pads on an old set up but didn't like them. Ferodo DS2500 and Mintex 1144 are good, as are the Red Dot pads you can get in some Halfords/Ripspeed stores.
On the 285mm kit, the carrier bracket needs to be modified by grinding away metal to suit the larger diameter. I also had to grind away other areas for it to fit and get shorter bolts as the ones supplied fouled the disc. Once fitted the pads do not sit properly on the disc, they overhang slightly. This may be due to the Red Dot pads I have, but they also wear at an angle, indicating the set-up is not true to the disc. This is probably due to the spacer plate not fitting properly or flexing during braking. I am looking into this.
Dan
Out of interest, my Hi-Spec kit fitted perfectly and just bolted together. I had probs with the braided hose connectors, but that was my fault for not getting them from hi-spec with the kit I think. I had custom hoses made up for less than the price of goodridge ones in the end.
I agree that Greenstuff are rubbish on TVRs (seem OK on other cars). DS2500 are great as a 1144s.
Rich...K11 CHM said:
Just had braided hoses fitted, they have also replaced the solid pipes with a type of braided nylon pipe. Not sure if there is a poroblem with the master cylinder?
You know what, I had EBC pads and discs on the front (std 260mm Chim 4.0 size). I also thought there was something wrong because the brakes had no bite. Turned out it was the EBC pads. Once warmed up they were fine, but this was no good for public roads.
Trefor, your link didn't work for me.
Have you changed the pads yet? That's when I noticed that they had worn "diagonally" (both sides were the same). The replacement set is also doing the same. I will take it all apart and check it is all straight. If it is then I guess it is due to distortion during braking.
My EBC pads were the same - no bite when cold and suffered from glazing after track days. When they started cracking I threw them away.
Dan
Have you changed the pads yet? That's when I noticed that they had worn "diagonally" (both sides were the same). The replacement set is also doing the same. I will take it all apart and check it is all straight. If it is then I guess it is due to distortion during braking.
My EBC pads were the same - no bite when cold and suffered from glazing after track days. When they started cracking I threw them away.
Dan
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