A Heating Virgin
Discussion
Basically I have a 2/3 bed end of terrace house. It has 2 bedrooms of approx 10ft by 11ft + 2 downstairs living areas of 10ft by 11ft, the 3rd bedroom which is only 6ft by 7ft and a kitchen extension of 8ft by 14ft.
Built in about 1890.
I hope this paints the picture. It currently has no central heating, so am looking to install it myself. Im looking at selling the property in 6 months and so not looking for high end products but still want something reasonable so its sellable. There currently is no loft insulation, etc...
I have the following costs for everything I believe I need.
Radiators x 6 = 150
Towel Radiator x 1 = 100
Room Thermostat = 15
Programmable Controller = £50
Boiler 28KW = 500
Copper Tube = 160
Water Cylinder = 200
Pump = £60
3 way Valve = 70
So the questions:-
1...Have I missed anything ?
2...Are my figures realistic ?
3...Is 28Kw boiler more than ample for that house ? Is it overkill ?
4...What flow rate do I need ? Waht impact does flow rate have ? and why is it important ?
5...When installing what are the basic steps ?
e.g. Install boiler first then run pipe work or install radiators first and then boiler, etc...
Thanks for all your help
Rob
Built in about 1890.
I hope this paints the picture. It currently has no central heating, so am looking to install it myself. Im looking at selling the property in 6 months and so not looking for high end products but still want something reasonable so its sellable. There currently is no loft insulation, etc...
I have the following costs for everything I believe I need.
Radiators x 6 = 150
Towel Radiator x 1 = 100
Room Thermostat = 15
Programmable Controller = £50
Boiler 28KW = 500
Copper Tube = 160
Water Cylinder = 200
Pump = £60
3 way Valve = 70
So the questions:-
1...Have I missed anything ?
2...Are my figures realistic ?
3...Is 28Kw boiler more than ample for that house ? Is it overkill ?
4...What flow rate do I need ? Waht impact does flow rate have ? and why is it important ?
5...When installing what are the basic steps ?
e.g. Install boiler first then run pipe work or install radiators first and then boiler, etc...
Thanks for all your help
Rob
With regards the process, I am by no means an expert but I am just in process of doing up a terraced house to sell on as well. Luckily OH's brother is a gas fitter and the house had no central heating system.
He started with the main pipe work, laying it all under the floor boards and then T'ing off ready for the radiators to attach to. He also laid all the pipes in the bathroom and kitchen first (ready for showers and sinks etc). Once that was done he mounted the boiler on the wall, fitted the radiators and then ran the final pipe work to the boiler. Then it was just a case of filling the system with water to check for leaks and then testing the heating. Some of the pipe work is a bloody work of art!
He started with the main pipe work, laying it all under the floor boards and then T'ing off ready for the radiators to attach to. He also laid all the pipes in the bathroom and kitchen first (ready for showers and sinks etc). Once that was done he mounted the boiler on the wall, fitted the radiators and then ran the final pipe work to the boiler. Then it was just a case of filling the system with water to check for leaks and then testing the heating. Some of the pipe work is a bloody work of art!
Building regs ?
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/england/genpub/en...
Won't you need a flue kit also - not sure if this comes with boiler.
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/england/genpub/en...
Won't you need a flue kit also - not sure if this comes with boiler.
Edited by john_p on Thursday 15th October 15:51
I've used plastic pipes and push-fit fittings in the past. Dead easy and quick to fit and you save a lot of pipe bending. A lot of plumbers don't like them but they're increasingly being used. I got mine from Screwfix, the make was John Guest. No problems 7 years later.
Another tip is to pressurise the system with air before you fill with water, it's a lot easier to fix a leak without having to drain down. I fitted a pressure gauge on a T and pumped the system up with a small compressor. You'll hear any leaks hissing away and the gauge will drop quickly.
Another tip is to pressurise the system with air before you fill with water, it's a lot easier to fix a leak without having to drain down. I fitted a pressure gauge on a T and pumped the system up with a small compressor. You'll hear any leaks hissing away and the gauge will drop quickly.
Just use copper where you can see the pipes, they look a lot prettier than plastic, for example from the rads to where they go through the floor/ceiling. They just push-fit to the plastic fittings. You also need copper within a certain distance of the boiler, I think it's a metre or 1.5 metres. It really is a doddle to use, de-skilling the job a lot. Also no risk of setting your house on fire with a blowlamp!
Even the best of houses use it. I saw a Grand Designs a year or so ago with a multi-million pound development in London using it.
Even the best of houses use it. I saw a Grand Designs a year or so ago with a multi-million pound development in London using it.
Sorry guys, a couple more stupid questions just to clarify that I have understood how a combi boiler works:-
1...There is no need for a programmable control unit which turns the hot water/ heating on/off at certain times because with a combi its permantely available 24/7 ?
2...Do you have a room thermostat ? or do you control the temperature of the rooms by the TRD rad Valves ?
1...There is no need for a programmable control unit which turns the hot water/ heating on/off at certain times because with a combi its permantely available 24/7 ?
2...Do you have a room thermostat ? or do you control the temperature of the rooms by the TRD rad Valves ?
robsartain said:
Sorry guys, a couple more stupid questions just to clarify that I have understood how a combi boiler works:-
1...There is no need for a programmable control unit which turns the hot water/ heating on/off at certain times because with a combi its permantely available 24/7 ?
2...Do you have a room thermostat ? or do you control the temperature of the rooms by the TRD rad Valves ?
You MUST have a Room Thermostat.1...There is no need for a programmable control unit which turns the hot water/ heating on/off at certain times because with a combi its permantely available 24/7 ?
2...Do you have a room thermostat ? or do you control the temperature of the rooms by the TRD rad Valves ?
[/quote]You MUST have a Room Thermostat.
[/quote]
Why? Is it regs? As long as one rad has no TRV (usually the bathroom)and is always on, where's the problem? That's how mine is set up and building control were happy. I've never understood why a room stat in one room should switch the whole system on and off.
It is indeed a building regulation.
If you have a new boiler fitted it must be notified to Gas Safe and have the Benchmark paperwork completed by the Gas Safe engineer (or, strictly speaking, 'competent person').
This paperwork is to comply with part 'L' of the efficiency rules and TRVs are simply not enough to comply, you MUST fit a Room Thermostat as well.
And, having read your post more carefully, the radiator without a TRV is the one serving the space where the Room Thermostat is sited. This is generally one in a space which will heat up LAST so we tend to go forthe hall where the door to the outside world is. It's worth bearing in mind that a lot of boiler manufacturers require a bypass large enough to take the flow for 10% of the designed heating system, so a radiator without a TRV is unlikely to be enough. So factor in a differential bypass valve too.
Just for further information, we are seeing quite a number of 'o'-ring failures on push-fit fittings now. I suspect it's the tip of the iceberg. Anyone using plastic seriously uses crimped fittings or just does it all in copper.
If you have a new boiler fitted it must be notified to Gas Safe and have the Benchmark paperwork completed by the Gas Safe engineer (or, strictly speaking, 'competent person').
This paperwork is to comply with part 'L' of the efficiency rules and TRVs are simply not enough to comply, you MUST fit a Room Thermostat as well.
And, having read your post more carefully, the radiator without a TRV is the one serving the space where the Room Thermostat is sited. This is generally one in a space which will heat up LAST so we tend to go forthe hall where the door to the outside world is. It's worth bearing in mind that a lot of boiler manufacturers require a bypass large enough to take the flow for 10% of the designed heating system, so a radiator without a TRV is unlikely to be enough. So factor in a differential bypass valve too.
Just for further information, we are seeing quite a number of 'o'-ring failures on push-fit fittings now. I suspect it's the tip of the iceberg. Anyone using plastic seriously uses crimped fittings or just does it all in copper.
Edited by Ferg on Thursday 15th October 19:11
rovermorris999 said:
I've used plastic pipes and push-fit fittings in the past. Dead easy and quick to fit and you save a lot of pipe bending. A lot of plumbers don't like them but they're increasingly being used. I got mine from Screwfix, the make was John Guest. No problems 7 years later.
Another tip is to pressurise the system with air before you fill with water, it's a lot easier to fix a leak without having to drain down. I fitted a pressure gauge on a T and pumped the system up with a small compressor. You'll hear any leaks hissing away and the gauge will drop quickly.
&
Just use copper where you can see the pipes, they look a lot prettier than plastic, for example from the rads to where they go through the floor/ceiling. They just push-fit to the plastic fittings. You also need copper within a certain distance of the boiler, I think it's a metre or 1.5 metres. It really is a doddle to use, de-skilling the job a lot. Also no risk of setting your house on fire with a blowlamp!
Even the best of houses use it. I saw a Grand Designs a year or so ago with a multi-million pound development in London using it.
Another tip is to pressurise the system with air before you fill with water, it's a lot easier to fix a leak without having to drain down. I fitted a pressure gauge on a T and pumped the system up with a small compressor. You'll hear any leaks hissing away and the gauge will drop quickly.
&
Just use copper where you can see the pipes, they look a lot prettier than plastic, for example from the rads to where they go through the floor/ceiling. They just push-fit to the plastic fittings. You also need copper within a certain distance of the boiler, I think it's a metre or 1.5 metres. It really is a doddle to use, de-skilling the job a lot. Also no risk of setting your house on fire with a blowlamp!
Even the best of houses use it. I saw a Grand Designs a year or so ago with a multi-million pound development in London using it.
cjs said:
Yes plastic pipe and fittings may be a quicker option and if your selling on...who cares??
robsartain said:
I was planning on using compression joints where possible, but will have a look at the plastic push fit.
I want to do a good job, but if its hidden under the floor boards, as said who really cares ??
Some great ideas.
Keeping me in work until retirementI want to do a good job, but if its hidden under the floor boards, as said who really cares ??
Some great ideas.
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